Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

As I listen to people on C-Span and read some comments on Facebook, I realize there are more and more folks gathering at Barney's Frank's dining table.

hope someone is considering applying the sherman anti-trust act to the healthcare insurance industry activities. at least threaten them so they stop with the fear mongering and start cooperating. here's a blurb from wiki on it:

"The Sherman Act was not specifically intended to prevent the dominance of an industry by a specific company, despite misconceptions to the contrary. According to Senator George Hoar, an author of the bill, any company that "got the whole business because nobody could do it as well as he could" would not be in violation of the act. The law attempts to prevent the artificial raising of prices by restriction of trade or supply.[6] In other words, innocent monopoly, or monopoly achieved solely by merit, is perfectly legal, but acts by a monopolist to artificially preserve his status, or nefarious dealings to create a monopoly, are not.
Put another way, it has sometimes been said that the purpose of the Sherman Act is not to protect competitors, but rather to protect competition and the competitive landscape."

Here's a interesting thought. For all those who oppose reform of any kind with respect to Health Insurance\Care and are very religious I say this.

You really don't need Insurance so why should you care. Hell you don't even need Medicaid or Medicare and here's why.

These people that I use above in this example are mostly I believe those who always quote the bible and don't believe in Science.

They tell you the earth is less then 10,000 years old because God created the earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. so therefore they don't believe in Geology (Science) and want to teach Creationism in schools.

They don't believe in Evolution (Biology\) more Science either so I would submit that I don't see how they can believe in Medicine which is Science.

Instead they are strong believers in the Bible and God so I say let them pray to God to heal them. They don't need doctors only their belief, faith and prayer to God to make them well.

By using Science it would be using the Devil to heal them which would be interfering in God's will. Because after all when something bad happens they always say its God's will so why should they use a tool of Satan's to heal their illness's such as Medicine and Science.

If God wants them to live He will heal them, if not they will not be healed and die. To use Science and Medicine tools of the Devil or Satan, they would be sinning against the Lord by going against His plan.

There is a couple who are being tried for not seeing a doctor for their sick child who ended up dying. Now this couple believed that the Lord would save her and they prayed for the child to be healed. They did not seek Medical treatment or see a doctor.

They are true believers in both the Bible and God, not like those who always preach the Word while at the same time not living it. They should not be tried for their Religious Beliefs.

If these Bible ranting nuts truly belief in what they preach and have all this faith in God then why do they need any kind of Health Insurance\Care at all. Let them use their Faith when they get sick and not Satan's plan to interfere in God's will.

Just a thought, that's all.

Oh by the way, good morning.

A little too black and white, Anon. Your brush is way too big.

It's lucky Barney doesn't want to talk to his table, I doubt his house is big enough for him to ge close to it.

CIA hired Blackwater assassins - more reasons to be proud

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/19/AR2009081904315.html?nav=rss_email/components

NY Times series on "end of life" decisions

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/20/health/20doctors.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

"http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252870"
Personally, Jamie, so long as the list for assassination is carefully scrubbed and validated, I have no problem with it.

It would probably be cleaner if DoD returned the Blackwater people involved to active duty then placed them under CIA's OpCon, but that wouldn't have changed the tactical thrust of the program. A thrust I believe as being in our national interest.

Senator Bingaman held a invitiation only luncheon with AARP members yesterday...from today's Sun-News --

The initial proposal would have directed the health secretary to establish a board, which would run a non-profit insurance organization. The entity would become licensed in each state, he said, and would compete with existing private insurers.

Bingaman said a second proposal that's gaining steam calls for the creation of cooperatives. It would be similar to the public option plan, but instead of the government entity, non-profit co-ops would apply to the health department to start providing insurance. They, too, would compete with private insurers.

patd: You are right about anti-trust. Most of the problems we have with "competitive markets" right now is that corporations have become TOO big and there is very little real competition. Corporations have lobbyied successfully to weaken anti-trust over the last 50 years, and the bigger they get, the more power they have in D.C.

Matt Taibbi

Health Care: Sick and Wrong

http://www.rollingstone.com/nationalaffairs/index.php/2009/08/19/matt-taibbi-on-health-care-reform-sick-and-wrong/

NY Times series on "end of life" decisions

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/20/health/20doctors.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

Posted by: jamie44.myopenid.com | August 20, 2009 7:53 AM

Jamie, I have been in those doctor's office with my Mom when she was told she had cancer. The first doctor was a real asshole to us and I traveled over 260 miles to take her to Albuquerque where the oncologist was outstanding. The entire office was incredible. A real human operation, not some angry doctor scolding us about cancer. Hospice is a bit different. The hospice care was outstanding in Florida for my Dad, but not so hot here for my Mom.

Craig - A+ !!
Coop plan -interesting - and allow competition across state lines

But best of all !!
Start of the day with the morning funny with that big JOKE known as Barney Fife Frank. He is a hoot... The Dem's have some awesome representation in that package of a joke...

Sadly Barney fife Frank is just a big LOL that has cost this country Hundreds of BILLIONS or Trillions....

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252878

Ping, why do you personalize your attack on Frank rather than attacking, with specificity, the legislation and policies he advocates or rejects?

Coops are unworkable
They are just a bandaid cover for the folks selling out.
Lets have a vote and get everybody on the record. Then we can see who is selling out the well being of the American people.

Jack

good thing i saw this before a magazine started talking to me. what a surprise that would have been. or maybe not.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8211209.stm

If there is only one co-op in the entire country, this might work.

Plan for Military Co-ops.

We can get rid of the federal government's big, expensive, "socialized" military forces. (Fact: Hitler liked a big, government-controlled military.)

Small groups of citizens (militias) in a locality get together, purchase weapons, and hire soldiers to defend their community.

This is an established model that history proves can work. It's called "feudalism."

Ping

If you find Frank amusing then you must be rolling on the floor when McConnell speaks.

Jack

Great series of Beatles photographs in Rolling Stone

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/29722200/rolling_stones_essential_beatles_coverage

what about grassley? he's a scream......

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252883
Nash, I suppose you could call that the Swiss model. But, even the Swiss had foreign entanglements intended at maintaining the face of their neutrality.

No matter that. Such a system would provide a mechanism for settling such things as the water war between Atlanta and the folks depending on estuarine water in the Florida panhandle.

"Get your government hands off my interstate highway system!"

Plan for Co-op interstates.

Small groups of citizens in a locality come together to maintain the interstate system.

The people in my neighborhood will maintain 100 feet of the northbound side of I-95 just beyond the Bangor exit. We'll be responsible for repaving it in the summer and snow removal in the winter. (Unless we sleep late and then drivers will be on their own.)

So PIng you think its alright to compare what that woman said to Frank about Obama's policy on Health Insurance\Care to Nazi death camps killing Jews?

If so than perhaps you also approve of this.

"At the event, local news stations were interviewing an Israeli man who was praising the “fantastic” “national health care” in Israel. During his remarks, a woman yelled out, “Heil Hitler!” The man stopped, became visibly upset, and exclaimed, “Did you hear this? She say to a Jew, ‘Heil Hitler’! Hear? I’m a Jew! You’re telling me, ‘Heil Hitler’? Shame of you!” After he angrily confronts her, the woman mocks him by making a crying sound to imply he is a whining baby. Watch it:"

Go watch the video at link below and see what those in your Party are saying and using about Health Insurance\Care reform.

http://reconstitution.us/rcnew/?p=5636

Those tactics were used by Joseph Goebbels against the Jews to denigrate, demean and demonize them. Only your Party uses them against Liberals, Democrats and any who disagree with them and have for years.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252882

BW

It's called Medicare

Jamie...

: ) also know as single payer.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252883

Nash

The second amendment rose out of the fact that several of the colonies had laws specifically forbidding standing armies while recognizing the need for that "well ordered militia". Think we can get the right to go along with disbanding the US Army, Navy, Air force, and Marines?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252892

jamie,

I think Nash is being humorous.

I always look to my friends down under...from the land of Rupert Murdoch they were able to get this done...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(Australia)

Flatus: Atlanta vs Florida.

You are correct. Instead of these large scale, expensive wars in distant foreign countries, warfare would revert to what it has been throughout most of human history: "Let's kill those bastards in the next village."

This is warfare on the local level that the whole family can take part in. It will be more fun than NASCAR.

so did anyone see Maria B make a fool of herself when confronted with facts about the US Health Care System by Matt Taibbi on Morning Load?

The Mormans are big fans of co-ops. Willard knows a food co-op works!

http://www.lds.net/forums/preparedness/9056-3-month-supply.html

Yep, HD and I wrote a nasty note to MSNBC.

I know her insurance did not pay for those lips!

Maria B. came off as Marie A. and she seems very spoiled...pout and all.

"...but can't get "it; unless they drop it..."

... yeah, we get the crumbs.
Glad to see you were back last nite. You were missed.
(I'm at my best when I'm pissed too :))

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252893

Dooty

Maybe if I remove my tongue from my cheek, my eye teeth will be able to see where I'm talking.

sorry, Jamie, I missed the tongue in the cheek in your statement. The internets and tubes are poor vehicles for subtle humor, I think.

jamie: Can we get the right to go along with disbanding the U.S. Military? I don't see why not. It's the logical extension of their "big government is the enemy" argument.

This ideology inspires the right wing "militias" that are growing again according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, which tracks extremist hate groups. The militias actively recruit recently discharged veterans.

Blackwater and other "private security" corporations are another example of an extreme right wing philosophy applied to the military. Blackwater also recruits veterans and turns them into mercenaries who answer to no one except the CEO.

BW

Those poor people on Norfok Island - Have to fly to Australia.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252883

ROFL, Nash.

I know MSNBC has to attempt to provide "balance" on issues. Unfortunately anyone like Maria B., P.B., and even Joe look like idiots trying to defend Insurance companies.

There just isn't any answer to "What service do they provide for the money?"

"Those tactics were used by Joseph Goebbels against the Jews to denigrate, demean and demonize them. Only your Party uses them against Liberals, Democrats and any who disagree with them and have for years."

Sweet Jeezus, Anon...can we stop with the continual Nazi talk? You are as bad as any of them. Plus, I see idiots on both sides now hurling Hitler-bombs at each other. And you are one who does it most often!

"I think Nash is being humorous."

I thought it was a joke, as well, Doots. But maybe you and I are just twisted. :)

Yes, I noticed the Nowfolk Island disclaimer, too, Jamie.

Norfolk..typos because I am making a burrito...I can't keep myself away from the green chili.

Big storms here last night, big problems in southern Il, and in In. going to need some of that war money. Speaking of money, The president (no capital P for him, and no last name anymore, just what he is all......) later on in the day is going to announce the end of the only successful program his corporation (his administration) has done right: He is ending the cash for clunkers.......are they nuts?

Meanwhile, the new car dealers are complaining that the government is way too slow in paying them the money that they owe them; from the cash for clunker's program: If this were money to help his corp buddies, this money would have been paid-given to them ahead of the programs start....when some thing is working .......shouldn't this be kept operating....and used as an example to do other programs? to get us going strong again; he needs to put a lot of money into the small corps that employ the people that will spend it, and the small construction corps that will hire.......the people that will be put back to work range from the Laborers to the Architect's to the lawyers that plan and finalize these projects.........but I guess he needs most of this money for the 2010 push, his re-election, that he started on day one; day one, where have I heard that before?, and for his wars........no change mr. president.....no change

Karzi, Is going to be re-elected today, at Afghanistan. He is a shoe in with all of the money that he gets from us. They have about 40 candidates for his job, we only get a hand full here, and with all of the money that the corps give out to ours......another reason for the flat taxes, we will be able to follow the money...imagine no hidden tax......my son just paid $50.00 in taxes, most of them hidden. His phone bill is just $ 50.00 monthly.
This is not capitalism it is rape.

AP, I have to throw a flag on you buddy, for off sides. You can't call lunch at 11: am....gots to be 11:30 - on.......and you have to do the Moose call...........AP, all we need is one more guy/gal from chicago, and we will be called a gang huh:-)

Teach Beth, really liked this post from last night:

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/the-real-outrage-of-death-pane.html#comment-252852

Just one exception: I still can remember the dermatologist that I took my Father to a cpl of times; after waiting for him for an hour sometimes, after the appointed time.....we had to wait in one of his little rooms that he made, another 20 minutes or so. Then we would come in. Ask a cpl of questions: Leave without ever saying hello or goodbye. Later on in the same week; a bill would come in the mail for 50 bucks for his 5 minuets visit with us.......I had a few word to say to him: I told him that *&#@**^ and to *&^$#&, but did get a date with one of his cute assistance's. You get to know them pretty good while waiting for the star quarter back HA/!

Ping,

At one time I would punched you in the foot if you had said that about B. Frank....not anymore.....him and a few others that I thought would be on the up and up for ever....we need term limits: I believe that having faith in religion is just having fervent hope; well I will have hope that one day we will have term limits....just sayin.....

One more thought about the 39 people running for president at Afghanistan: We Tweeter it down to two......no room for anyone else!!!!!!!

"http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252895"
"This is warfare on the local level that the whole family can take part in. It will be more fun than NASCAR."

Nash, I totally agree. I bet Fox has a channel set aside for it.

patsi & horsedooty:

Co-op military? It was a joke, but a joke with a point.

If a centralized, federal governemnt-controlled military "works," why can't the same model be applied to health care? Conversely, if co-ops are such a great idea, why don't we make the military a co-op?

The right wing "arguments" against a universal single-payer system are total B.S.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252907

So Patsi, what part of that is not true?

jamie...the history of Norfolk Island is interesting. When Britain no longer had the US for wood, hemp and flax, after the revoluntionary war, they went to Norfolk and it is theorized that is how the penal colony of Australia was established.

Obama and his crew keep backtracking and contradicting themselves on the "public option."

Different spokespeople issue different positions each day. Then, the next day, all of them issue revised statements "clarifying" what they said the day before, but still contradicting each other.

Then they say: (A) nothing has changed; and (B) all the statements are consistent.

I think Craig is right on target with his headline today. This should have been and is now the key to healthcare reform.

O'Reilly was battling with conservatives last night in asking them how rejecting EVERYTHING Obama presents is sane opposition. This is the fault line on the Right the President CAN exploit to pick off Republicans. The biggest sticking point has been and will continue to be "government run" solutions. How this escaped Obama is a sign that his bravado exceeded reality. If the Democrats can be shrewd yet TRANSPARENT, smart yet realistic and media savvy rather than reactionary, Obama has a real chance.

Democrats should not be bound by past notions of co-ops, nor should they make a sham of the concept by stupidly dressing up government run in co-op clothing. It strikes me that how regional co-ops can connect, the role of States and the necessary BILL OF INSURED"S RIGHTS that guide ALL healthcare is critical. Also there should be an understanding of who can qualify for what co-op.

That leaves a new push Medicare/Medicaid reform as something the administration must restate to cool off anger from the 50 plus crowd.

I will stop asking how the administration was so stupid. That is in the past and the future is the real target. Obama must use the threat of a public option to tame private insurance companies and GOP opposition. I am hopeful as I see this story below as a sign of a learning curve when faced with impending failure. I did predict this healthcare mess as well as what Debka reports this morning. Better late than never.

"US Middle East envoy George Mitchell and Yitzhak Molcho, special adviser to Israeli prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu, are tying up the last ends of an understanding on West Bank settlement construction between the Obama administration and Israeli prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu, DEBKAfile's Washington sources disclose.

The two officials have been meeting in the US capital.

Our sources report that the understanding rests on four principles:

1. Israel will maintain a freeze on new settlement construction. (This week, transport minister Eliahu Atias said that all new projects for West Bank settlements have been "on hold" in the five months since Netanyahu took office.) In the next three years, the prime minister's office and defense ministry will only grant permits for some hundreds of building projects appearing on an agreed list. A joint US-Israeli team is now working on the final list.

2. Obama will stop demanding a total freeze.

3. The two governments agreed to disagree on construction in Jerusalem, including the eastern side, which will continue uninterrupted - as will Washington's criticism on this point.

4. The Obama administration has made it clear that any confrontation with the Netanyahu government is undesirable; relations between the White House and PMO will henceforth revert to their normal friendly level.

The two parties also agreed that the US-Israel understanding on the settlements and their limited expansion will not be published or brought before the government in Jerusalem for endorsement.

Defense minister Ehud Barak will be the only minister with full knowledge of its contents and in Washington, only Vice President Joe Biden, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel and Mitchell - seven individuals in all in both capitals.

Mitchell was the live wire pushing for an accord and smoothing away the obstacles and differences, according to one Washington source. It was he who prevailed on President Obama to step away from a showdown with Netanyahu.

Netanyahu and Mitchell will finally approve the draft when they meet in London on Aug. 26, a date insisted on by Obama because he has set Sept. 10 as the deadline for his own team to finish their Middle East policy review (which was first revealed by DEBKAfile).

The prime minister's approach to an understanding on the settlement dispute with the US president has caused unrest among some ministers, especially in the right wing. It prompted deputy Prime Minister Moshe Yaalon to meet the Jewish Leadership Division, the most nationalist faction of the ruling Likud party Wednesday, Aug. 19. He was applauded when he described the opposition Peace Now group and other "Israeli elites" as "viruses" because of their antagonism to settlements and settlers.

"I hold to the position that Jews are at liberty to settle and build in every part of the Land of Israel," he stated with emphasis.

That night, Netanyahu's office issued a reprimand saying that the prime minister finds Yaalon's words and style unacceptable."

The winner will be the most adaptive and capable of learning lessons on the fly. Obama could have done this in an easier way and still has a road to travel to get his policy right. I will point out that the most disturbing thing is Obama's public statements in the US and the policy promoted behind the door. I still object to his secretive means and the misdirection spokespeople or pundits come up with characterizing progress and policy. We would be far better served by the truth, Obama promised that and so far, his clarity has been sorely lacking.

Let's hope he can switch suits and improve is report card. Reform in America and peace on the planet demand it.

P.S. Anon has only one dimension. I find his comments useful in showing exactly what many on the Left dished out to Republicans for eight years. Keep on dishing Anon. You make my case every week and I find your ancestory the height of irony as well as mine being a Jew left to oppose your distorted Nazi throwing mentality as being part of sensible Liberal strategy..

When I hear Obama on TV, I no longer believe him.

He promised to "change the way Washington works" but instead we get "business as usual."

Even with 60 Dem votes in the Senate, a huge majority in the House, and a Dem President, right wing ideology & corporate power still controls the government.

I really don't know why the right wing crazies hate Obama so much. Yes, he is black, but he's as much a servant of reactionary politics as was Bush.

max...the reason most of us are not buying the co-op thing is that we already have a distribution system in place and the cost of start-up, etc. will burden the system even more if we let the insurance companies run things. And I not convinced this works that well in rural areas.

P.S. I see Hillary is not on the seven person list Debka mentions above and I think her exclusion from the O-team Israeli policy is a tremendous mistake. In fact, this is insulting. Maybe someone more knowledgable than myself can explain why she was kept from forming the Middle East policy.

Rahm must be very concerned that Israelis have begun to regard him in less than favorable terms. Bill and Hillary could have done much to nudge Israel and I will mark Obama's Israel policy as another mistaken effort causing considerable damage with no apparent gains. THis "new" understanding could have been achieved in a far more coherent way and do not kid yourself: Iran and the Palestinians changed Obama's approach, that is, this change in policy was put forward to rescue Obama from certain failure. Reminds me of the recent version of The Day the Earth Stood Still. We only wake up when on the brink of failure.

I suggest that we do what Craig suggests. What would be a workable co-op model? The government can put in place infrastructure, lawyers, experts etc. These would serve co-ops until they take over the structure.

Let people run their own healthcare. How American is this? Remember, be smart. Avoid the co-op mistakes of the past and understand the government will be playing the role of the third pary. What an advantage for the co-ops.

Is imagination land dead? I think not. We are all a creative bunch so let's make a model of how a people run healthcare group can make healthcare better.

Hi, Side Saddle,

a little pe-oed is ok for me....but not totally, but sometimes I get close, when it comes down to all of the people losing their jobs homes, both of my family, myself, and people that I don't know.....all the while we spend big $ on the ones that hurt us in the first place.....All of my biz. sense, screams out and asks, why don't we have all new people making the big choices and the big decisions....why is Geithner the top $ man in Washington? I would never do biz with someone that has been on Wall St. at the time that made all of this mess in the first place.....what the hell is Greenspan talking about, why is he talking at all? and....

Max,

You keep leaving one thing out of your post's about Netenhayoooo, and the land stealer's....the fix was in...is in, that would complete your post.!

AP, I agree with a lot of what you say, but the Nazi part is getting old.....doesn't mean the same when you say it anymore....

Time to go...sick of the co-op talk. I am against it...in my area, we would have about six co-ops between the 12 doctors that service the area. Get real...negotiating, set-up ,etc. a real time and money waster. We are not getting what we need and this is to confuse us about medicare for all. Just because a group of doctors are geographically tied, they are miles apart in banding together to provide health care.

Co-ops alone will not address the health care needs of most Americans.

Max: "Insurance" itself is a SOCIALIST concept. It's a group of people who, through collective action, interfere with the efficiency of normal buyer-seller transactions in the market.

If you were a man of principle you would forswear all insurance and pay for health care "out-of-pocket."

If everyone did this it would restore real free market mechanisms to the health care industry. People with healthy habits would not have to pay the medical bills of those with unhealthy habits.

People would stop eating fried baloney sandwiches.

Craig,
I really like your idea of giving the uninsured coupons that can only be used in the Co-ops. That would certainly provide them with a good pool from which to start, and many of the uninsured are actually young people in good health and are minimal users of services -- exactly what you would want to keep overall costs low.

Only problem is that the Republicans will NEVER support such an option. They only want a system that drives more people into for-profit insurance plans.

I don't agree with Max on much, but on this he is right, Obama lost control of the debate through a lack of leadership and legislative strategy. Our chances for true health care reform are now on life-support and only heroic actions will change it.

Eventually, Medicare will go broke, and companies that now provide subsidized health insurance plans will no longer do so because of costs.

It is, after all, the American way -- don't agree to do anything with forethought. Wait until the crisis is so large that only drastic measures that must be undertaken are unavoidable.

I was confused yesterday. I saw a car with pro-Obama stickers all over it and it also had a Dale Earnhardt #3 sticker on it as well.

Just too much common sense from you Solar.

If only some of those you mentioned had just a little
of it. I know, wishful thinking.

And here's a program to keep an eye on---rebates
for buying energy efficient appliances to be implemented soon.

http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/08/20/am-energy-efficient-appliances-q/

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252924
One 'law of nature' I've learned Solar, is that if a transaction is not beneficial to everyone involved, then it's not a good tranaction. Apparently, Washington isn't aware of that law.

co-op = insurance networks

What happened to choice of doctor everyone is fighting so hard to keep? What if you want to see a specialist who is part of another co-op because he is the only specialist in the area?

"--rebates for buying energy efficient appliances"

Good one Coreen. At least this administration is aware of the need for energy efficiency. That's one mark in their favor.

Ree, pre-existing conditon coverage DEMANDS all will be insured. The President has repeated the 27 million people number. This obviously includes illegals which he denies. He should restate the number. He IS right that in order for insurance companies to accept insuring all but illegals, they need All to be covered. It makes perfect sense. So Obama has the logic of covering all in front of him. Much of them money will come from the savings of not using the ER to treat the unisured. Part of the money comes from the deal inusrance will give Obama for getting everyone covered.

In exchange for a Bill of Rights, the insurance companies will demand tort reform. You all laugh but more than $200 billion a year is spent on unessary tests and precedures doctors order to save their ass from malpractice suits. That is alot of mony. There is a trillion in waste to start reclaiming so I do not see reform as a huge increase in deficits.

I would aslo point to Bipartisan bills before Congress. They have been vetted by the CBO. There is enough here already to make reform happen this year if handled correctly from this point forward. The irony would be if the Left did Obama in.

Bill would never have let that happen, nor Hillary....

47 million that is

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252929

... maybe he's a plant Ree.

Birthday of Benjamin Harrison (1833), 23rd U.S. President

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Harrison

(a very busy one term)

Deaths which occurred on August 20:
1804 Charles Floyd only fatality of the Lewis & Clark Expedition
---------------
Sgt. Floyd was buried 5 times, twice by Lewis and Clark.
Never bury someone next to the Missouri River.

Good point Blondie. Insurance will have to make exceptions for doctors participating in co-ops. Government can sweeten the deal with helping to partly cover the cost of liability.

Don't forget rural areas aready have problems.....

Co-ops can be a loophole to allow various national insurance groups to cross State lines which is why States must be involved in the co-operative process.

Jamie,

Solar,

Great song lyrics, "You may have been a headach but you never were a bore .... thanks for the memories"

Thats the nicest thing that you have said to me. R U flirting with me? Im easy, and sensitive so watch it.

BW,

I don't like talking about all of this Health Care so m uch; but have you checked out the prgrams that Spain has. I think that they rate # seven in the world...even in the rulel areas......there is no doctor shortage.....everything they do about Universal Medicine; is passed by both the Liberals, and the conservatives..........now that bipartesenship no?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252934

Max

Get everyone covered and I'll give you a BIG cost savings. Multiply every insured car in the US by the amount charged by the insurance Co. for "medical liability". All of those funds now become available to cover medical expenses.

Hurricane Bill could brush Cape Cod, forecasters say

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/weather/08/20/hurricane.bill/

-------------
Heads-up yankees.

Craig....
I've been listening to lots of healthcare reform debates on NPR for the last several weeks. One thing there is a consensus on.... co-ops don't work.

Divalicious..... great job on MSNBC! thanks for posting it....
and yes.... you are as beautiful as your nom de plume.

Ree.... I hope you let Craig list your blog on blogroll.
And my favorite pie is blueberry.... what's your's?..... :0)

Don't forget rural areas aready have problems.....

Posted by: maxtrue | August 20, 2009 10:19 AM

So, I guess this means we do not get decent health care, huh? Good healthcare is for urban peeps, only.

Nash, your comments were a joke, yes? If everyone had to pay for medical care out of pocket many people would be too broke to buy consumer goods and capitalism would struggle. Redistributing liability costs is hardly socialism as commonly decried. One could make similar absurd claims that we are also in part facists, communisys, federalists, republicans, democrats, anarchists, communalists, etc.

Joe, you disagree with me more than not?

Well, I think that might be just on the rhetoric level. When we peel back the rhetoric, I don't think we are so far apart. Some would even put us both in the center/left camp.

Republicans can be out manuevered with a smart co-op plan. It better not be a thousand pages long. Democrats only need a small number of defections and the price of a total rejection would cost Republicans plenty.

MSNBC is on a massive whine over the freeing of the Lockerbie bomber.

Didn't we just go through trying to make the right wing understand the term "Sovereign Nation". Now we have to listen to the left wailing about a decision made by Great Britain in their best interest.

Enough already. The man did a horrible thing. He has been in jail for decades. He is dying and by letting him go the British nation gets Libyan oil. It's not like they are paying ransom for something that happened yesterday.

jamie...also throw-in the medical on home owners insurance.

Anon -- you asked what you said that was untrue -- what you said was that only the right throws Nazi accusations around. Hell, You've been screaming HITLER ever since you got here! It's mindless namecalling.

No Blondie, I meant that rural areas already have problems which I think co-ops can address. Your question seems to concern the size of co-ops in rural areas. What if there is a size requirement that would allow rural areas to join together? It is not however the fault of insurance companies that doctors prefer the richer areas. That is where the State must help in making it a sweeter deal for doctors to service rural areas. I also think nurse practioners can figure greatly into co-operative programs. With doctors serving on the co-op board, more nurses can deliver healthcare as a doctor is required to oversee their adminsitration of care.

"People would stop eating fried baloney sandwiches."

Not me.

And Jamie, there is still so much to this story that the Press did not investigate. Where did the triggers for the bombs come from? I agree with you as this case has been muddy from the start.

Max...government intervention to force rural doctors to work together? Medicare is easier and already here!

Dana Gould had a good video piece on Bill Mahrer about the contrast between the people who were waiting in line for free medical care and the nazi-poop slinging crowd at the townhall meetings. He felt those who should be screaming about health care were not. And the flakes who had nothing to scream about started painting hitler mustaches on Obama.

Holt Crap people. Yes, many co-ops including the one I bought food from when living in New Haven do not work that well. Partly it is because they never have the starting capital to get off the ground. The question is not whether co-op have worked but whether they can be formulated to work. This is as big a question mark than whether Obama's government run concpets can work either. If they don't work they can be reformed later. For now they seem the best way to go forward. Isn't going forward the point?

So Craig asks how co-ops can be modeled to work. Are we up to the task? This should have been figured out years ago when the idea was seriously put forward. The Republicans will be watching to see if this is a trojan horse. Democrats seem to have a higher IQ than those Republicans watching, so with smarts, savvy, sound thinking and CBO vetted numbers, Obama can pull his healthcare reform package back out of his ass and get to work on passing this reform before January.

Coreen,

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252930

Thanks for the link. I goes along with the weatherizing home credits: They are good and needed ones; it's just that they are doing them way too late; this should have been done, while bush ( not capital letter for that one either) was still in office, and he gave out tons of cash. Our new president- whats his name? knew all of this going in no?

That $ is allocated, but it will take a lot of time to train the huge amounts of people that it will take to spend it, on these programs.....they do things on purpose, just to bottle all of the money up.....but by the election importance of 2010 comes into play.......just you watch Natasha ( you do get a capital N :-) there will be a lot of it around, and a lot of bragging. It's all fn planned for us imo.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252941

Solar,

This whole health care business comes down to whether or not you believe that access to adequate health care that doesn't financially destroy you or your family is a right or a privilege.

If as a nation we believe that those with money have more rights than those without money, then as with Scrooge, "If they are going to die then let them do it and reduce the excess population". That is the position of most third world nations which fits right in with our health statistics.

If as a nation we believe that health care is a basic human right then it has to be based on covering everyone. This is the position of all the developed nations of the earth except for the US

If reform puts the Health Insurance companie out of business (which it won't), well too darn bad, don't let the door hit you on the rear on your way out.

Ree and Renee, My favorite is pecan. (of course it would be, it's got the most sugar)

I might point out that many in line for the free health care in LA had medical insurance.

OK....
for lunch today at the Crawford's Cafe we have a special on fried baloney sandwiches, blueberry pie, strawberry rhubarb pie (good choice, Ree) and
Appletinis....

and at Crawford's Store we have a special on AK47s and buckets of bullets....

I saw that sad show this weekend BLondie. Note the comments by Zinni and Bill's smart ass replies.

Calm down. I said that States could do a better job attracting doctors and healthcae insurers could sweeten the deal too. I said rural communities could be allowed to band together for larger pool numbers and with nurses brought into the picture, this could be a boon for more nurse practioners. Right now we have about 800,000 doctors servicng 300,000,000. After expensive educational programs, no wonder doctors seek money to repay their loans. New loan programs could be set up to direct doctors to rural areas. Technology should laso help balance out the less infrastructure in rural areas. Medicade/Medicare is stretched and the adminsitration has not sucessfully shown it has really strengthened it. The big question for co-ops will aslo be to what degree government goes to bat for co-ops as they negotiate for better rates. People will have to be paid to run co-ops so how the government steps in and first sets them up to run is critical. Maybe Medicare/Medicaid is a decent model to use at first. Maybe the government could create a co-op producing entity with help from the private sector. I am sure the States have ideas too. There are co-ops in New York that work.

Solar, I left a link for you yesterday to HD supply solutions. I'm working with them now and they seem like a fantastic resource. It is a shame however, so much comes from China these days. I wish new automated factories could start producing things again here to compete with China.

Also note my Debka story above on Isreal.

Hello everyone!

Nash -- I have been enjoying your co-op comparisons. I would like to share them with some other friends if you don't mind.

I have a lot of questions about the co-op concept as applies to health insurance -- the first question is who will run these coops? Also, insurance is regulated by the states. Different states have different requirements of health insurance policies which has the insurers gnashing their teeth. For example, some states require maternity coverage, well-baby visits, etc. Not all states do. Some states have stronger consumer protections for HMOs. So guess why the insurance companis want to sell across state lines?

Another thing to think about with individual health insurance -- the Lifetime Maximum Benefit. Commonly the less expensive plans have a lower LMB. A $500K LMB might seem like a lot when you're healthy, but could be exhausted pretty quickly if needed treatment for a major illness/injury. Once you've reached the LMB -- yer out.

I with yoiu, Chloe..pecan pie.

http://www.stahmannfarms.com.au/website/default.asp

I am not a baker, so these guys make a great chocolate and pecan pie.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252967

Max

Why should they have to negotiate for better rates. Why should a pill bought by a thousand people cost less than the same pill bought by one person?

Chlo,

Thought you were going to say, it has the most nuts...............that goes right to the cabeza haha

I want an old fashioned super tart Apple Pie and a slice of extra sharp cheddar thank you.

We see division on the Democratic side, yes. We see alot of bright people like Krugman, even if you disagree with them. On the Republican side with few exceptions their public declarations are pretty brain dead. Their pundits like Rush and Beck are blatant anti-intellectuals. O'Rielly pointed to the strategy last night. Catch the GOP rejecting everything. Americans do not like that. Without being too cute or convoluted, Democrats I think have a serious IQ advantage as moderate Republicans have been isolated by the GOP core. Democrats MUST anticipate Republican reaction and make it sound by carefully constructing reform even stupidier than we already know it will be. If Democrats can't out flank Palin, they should just toss in the towel and become the minority party again. Democrat's big problem is leadership which is why I suggested sending Pelosi, Reid, Durban, Franks, Dodd and others on a very very long tour of the Middle East and beyond.

Guess I shouldn't be surprised . . . but that Rove is a real jackass.

"Tom Ridge confirms a long-held suspicion among Bush critics, writing in his new autobiography that he "was pushed to raise the security alert on the eve of President Bush's re-election, something he saw as politically motivated and worth resigning over.""

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0809/Politicizing_the_terror_alerts.html?showall

Jamie, simple supply side economics. IBM enjoys a better per person insurance rate than myself, because of the numbers. I know you want capitalism out of healthcare, but that will not happen now. We can lower costs, keep quality and cover all legal people without destroying a model the majority want. One day perhaps with great GDP and energy solved, American can afford to make privilege a right. For now, can't we just get this reformed in a politically viable way? I don't reject your vision, just the means to achieve that now and into the near term.

Chloe, BlondeW....

tomorrow.... Crawford's Cafe will be running a special of 20% off any slice of pecan pie.... and if you're a diabetic, it'll be 50% off.....

Jamie....
I want to be associated with your 10:46 post.... IMO, it sums up this whole healthcare issue beautifully....

Blonde, I don't bake pies either (unless they're pre-made and frozen). So we'll need to find a good baker.

Solar, "Thought you were going to say, it has the most nuts..."
... that would explain a lot of things, wouldn't it. :)

I am sorry, Max, I have had a truly difficult time in calming down...my husband has maxed out his insurance for the year, I wiped out our savings because I paid the doctors so he would be able to see them again about the cancer, I am still working on that outrageous hospital bill, we have cut-out so much in our life just to afford this poverty. For me, I am in the economy plan...$7500 maximum lifetime benefit. No preventative..no pap smear, no mammogram, no bone density, nothing. And I already used $3500 on my broken hand. I was given the economy treatment for my broken hand. Yep, I am trying to calm down. Food is our priority right now.

No surprisie Warren. and I wonder if you read the other articles over at Politico. Not that you cherry pick.....

Renee, Serve Jamie's favorite too: apple pie (another favorite of mine). Remember, she'll want her's with cheddar.

Have a good day everyone.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252981

Those are the kind of 'real life' stories that our 'moron' politicians need to hear Blonde. They don't have a clue, nor do they want to.

Damn: Hillary was right about Obama. He gives nice speeches but he's an empty suit.

He's going to be a one-term president. I hope Hillary resigns as Sec State and challenges him in the 2012 primaries. The way he's performing now, she'll win.

The GOP base will certainly nominate some extremist loon, so the general election will be an easy win.

Ree, the Democrats completely underestimated both Republicans and American sentiment. I think that is pretty obvious by now.

Blondie, so sorry. I wonder what kind of plan you had. HMO's in NY cover almost everything with much higher caps and lower deductibles. Yes they are expensive, but in hindsight, would you have been better served by buying the more expensive plan? Was it offered? In NY, healthyNY http://www.ins.state.ny.us/website2/hny/english/hny.htm is a program for low income people. I have problems with their demaraction of what low income is and the kind of coverage they provide. They should offer a graduated program for increasing levels of income. However, if these plans are what co-ops can produce by merely reducing rates to 50% of what is presently sold in NY as good individual policies, life would get much better for people like you (and me). I do think the rual question is a bit different than co-ops in general, but the fix must relieve the struggle you and others are having. In fact, lowering your costs is one of the two central aspects of Obama's reasoning in the first place. Cover the uninsured and lower costs while not lowering coverage items.

BlondeW....
I really do wish I could reach into this screen and give you a hug....

ok.... apple pie will be on special tomorrow too....
and keeping with that theme..... Crawford's Country Store will have a special on fireworks.... the bigger... the better....

gotta go.... see y'all later...

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252966

Renee --

That sounds like a Blue Plate Special. How much?

divalicias: You can share any of my comments, anytime.

Nash, what the hell makes you think HIllary is MORE LIberal than Obama? Yes, she would have gotten more done, but I rather doubt you would have liked her compromises that are political realities. Remember the Clinton Referendum?Seems she was rejected because she was too Republican Lite.

I have NO sympathy for the Obamabots. In fact, I have more hope for Obama than many of his faithful/fickled followers do now (though I don't mean to imply you are one of them).

Blonde -

Here's yer "Atta Girl".

BlondeW: Your case is a reminder that this is not an abstract issue: so many people are getting hurt every day by a bad system. I hope things work out for you.

Work calls....hope you all have some great co-op ideas. Make Craig proud and my prayers are with LL today.....

Max over and out....

Max

The only reason the majority want this broken system is because they don't know what they might get in its place. That is the fault of the administration.

Insurance companies provide absolutely NOTHING to the health care system. NOTHING. They leach away 30% plus of all the monies sent to them and provide no care, no services, no drugs, no surgeries, no offices, nada, zilch nothing.

Good lord, even the Mafia only took 20% for its protection racket.

What a difference a year makes.

Remember when republicans were blathering that whatever the president does is right ?

BW

You need to be on MSNBC not the twits they keep putting on to argue about healthcare.

Your family is what it is all about

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252949

RR -- Thank you for your kind comment!

I really would like something from the Crawford Cafe/General Store and Gun Shop -- my jewel encrusted sidearm so I can wear it to my GOP-Just-Say-NO-To-Everything Congressman's THM next month. I'll wear it with my T-shirt that says: "This is what a Liberal, Feminist Socialist looks like. Bite me." The back of the T-Shirt says: "Stand back! I'm menopausal, out of estrogen because my health insurance won't pay RX and I'm armed."

Max:

Calm down, you'll have a stroke (and you're not covered for "blog-related conditions.")

Hillary KNOWS the GOP is her enemy. Obama does not seem to be able to figure that out, even though, every day, they're inciting the gun nuts to assassinate him. Everytime he, or his idiot press secretary, blather on about "bi-partisanship" I want to puke.

I want a FIGHTER, not a compromiser. The Clintons, on their worst day, never laid down and played dead like Obama is doing. (What a wimp.)

Mercury in fish is widespread, U.S. survey finds
Each tested fish in 291 streams had some; a quarter were above EPA level

High levels in Southeast
Some of the highest levels in fish were detected in the remote blackwater streams along the coasts of the Carolinas, Georgia, Florida and Louisiana, where bacteria in surrounding forests and wetlands help in the conversion. The second-highest concentration of mercury was detected in largemouth bass from the North Fork of the Edisto River near Fairview Crossroads, S.C.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32479855/ns/us_news-environment/

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252999

Jamie -- I heartily second your sentiments here.

Blondie -- I am so sorry about your situation. Mine is so small in comparison to yours. I have been away from the list for a while but I never stopped thinking/praying about your husband's kidney cancer. I am glad to hear he is still with us and I truly hope he is well. Our system is so unfair! Another friend who was going through the exact same cancer as your DH at the same time as your DH is also doing well -- but my friend had government-sponsored health insurance so his out-of-pocket costs were minimal. He's recently taken a two-week trip to Hawaii with his wife to celebrate his recovery. I love that he got to do this -- but the comparison with your situation and his is just galling!

We so need to fix this broken system! Blondie -- You do need to tell your story -- you are not alone -- but so many of us have been too quiet, dealing with our situations as best we can with little time for anything else.

Cheers to you and your husband! You are still in my thoughts and prayers.

This is so embarassing...I almost didn't want to come back to the blog. We ended-up in this situation because we had insurance. In 2008, my husband took a job so he could have insurance. I being self employed, used to buy my health insurance, but went on his plan when he became eligible. He had paid over $3000. in premiums the first six months and when he made his first appointment with my doctor, he was told his insurance was accepted (in network doctor). Well, the doctor had just dropped that company and was no longer a network doctor. The staff did not know. To further complicate the situation, it was discovered that my hubby had high blood pressure (symptom of kidney disease/where we are today). He never had high blood pressure before, so we were shocked. Then we got the news....the high blood pressure was a pre-existing conditon and the doctor was out of network. So, the $2500. in routine tests, doctor's fees, etc. was our burden in entirety. When we tried to fight the pre-exisiting condition, the doctor's staff would not let us talk to the doctor. Insurance claimed the doctor had determined it was pre-existing. I finally sent a certified letter to the doctor. He wrote letters to the insurance company to no avail. We got the letter from the insurance...no treatement for 12 months. By this time, I am working hourly amd opt for the cheapest insurance the company is offering...it is all I can afford. Ten months into the one year waiting period, my husband is diagnosed with cancer. You know the rest of the story from here. We no longer use that doctor.

It has been a long wrestle with health care...I am glad I have good teeth. Sorry for the length of the post.

Nash....yeah, blog related injuries are not covered by BLue Cross...

Hillary did not consider ALL Republicans enemies. You seem to dismiss my point about compromise, bipartisan etc. You all had the chance to elect her and instead she was rejected. I love it. Yes, she would be getting things done in the manner of the Clinton Referendum which was meant to move Democrats center, co-op Republican thunder and get this friggin country going forward instead of side to side.

THe irony of course is that Reagan Hero Republicans applaud was really a New Deal Democrat. I think the Clntons understand that while the Left and Right is in denial.

Frankly, I was surprised that Hillary ran so close given her more "conservative" take on things. LIke Presidents and healthcare, there are no do overs, so I suggest we get a smart plan passed now before more mistakes sweeps away Democratic advantage in the election of 2010.

P.S. the Left should whisper unless they want Republicans to pick up lots of seats.

Max,

I just read where you told BW to calm down.....now haven't you been reading what she is sharing with us? You need to slow up a little, and decide what you should say to someone that is going thru what she is going through, in other words, stfu, when it comes down to something so personal. I matter not one iota if she is right ( in your mind) or wrong, she is living it............

Flatus,

Been thinking, Im going to go a little further than you. I do like that we employ Blk Wtr. in missions of assassination, but only approved ones, and not of any head of state. Make that only for terrorist, period. The only addition I would make is that we should for our own, mercenary's ....once a gang member has killed, proven that he has, force him into the terrorist strong holds...they go first and draw the first fire.....let see how they like getting shot back no? A lot less little children hurt by their inexperience use of weapons imo.

O, about pie's.....like anything that's put in front of me; but no rhubarb, no rhubarb: I had to dig out their roots for 5 years when I bought my first house.....they just kept coming out of the ground, enven tho I dug them out at 4ft deep.,!

Blonde shows why all must be covered to eliminate the pre-existing conditon clause. My heart goes out to her and her husband. Take a look at the small business plan HealthyNY covers. Not bad and I think co-ops can match that as NY plays the role of co-op administers.

Healthy NY says the full check up once every three years should not discourage testing of anything that is problematic on a yearly basis. They just want to hold down $5000 + annuals that are not always necessary. Again, it is a good starting point and had Blonde and her husband had acess to such a plan, maybe her situation would be different. Healthy NY does not allow additional riders to add to coverage by third parties. Some clout NY has is to prevent companies from certain pools should they opt out for helping, but Cigna was just allowed out of their program and still operates in NY. I think they have been denied any offering of individual plans.

I hope things improve for Blonde and her husband. We certainly need some reform now.

Breaking News -

The road to hell was closed yesterday as the devil's minions searched for the missing soul of Robert Novak.

Now work really calls.....

Again, check out that link to HealthyNY. I think it can serve as some kind of guide for a co-op model. With State and Federal help, we should have policies that are quite comprehensive and cost arounf $300 or so a month.

Have fun yall...

Max,

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253009

..Nice post.......

CB,

R. Novak, who is he? I haven't given him much thought when he was living: I doubt that anyone will think of him in a cpl of more day's; well maybe just the people that he left his $ to. I bet that he rigged up, so there would be (now remember his voice) CROSSE FIRRRRRRE to the people that he left his millions to. Now there is a place that an M -14 should be allowed into no?

Solar, I forgive you for your inappropiate remarks. "Calm down" had nothing to do with her terrible situation, but rather some comments she made about healthcare solutions. I am just empathic as you are to her situation. For all YOU know, even more empathic.

Be careful when you tell someone to STFU.

Solar,

Did you see this armadillo. You may have a problem.

http://thiseclecticlife.com/

Blonde -- You are the reason why I fight on. We need to fix this!

Now I'm off to a meeting -- check with you all later!

Ree,

Far be it for me to try to inject facts into your screeds, but here is the actual booklet to read for yourself. It is nothing more than a straight forward list of questions that each person should ask themselves to prepare for a living will and end of life decisions. Hardly some nefarious plot to condemn veterans to an early death

http://www.rihlp.org/pubs/Your_life_your_choices.pdf

Jamie,

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253014

Holy Pozzole.! A John Wayne- Dillo. Don't tell Tony the Baloney, he thinks that they are harmless, I like that Tony, but a little too nice for his own good about those dillos. Call D. Cheney, he will take him out with his shotgun...........but make sure that Tony isn't home at that time. haha

Ree

I know that, but you keep throwing up these right wing citations without any background. They sound reasonable on the surface, but once you dig a little then the truth without the slant emerges.

I love the comments section on the piece you put up, particularly the ones in favor of letting anyone on welfare only get enough treatment to keep them out of hospital emergency rooms ... more from the if they die they die who needs 'em crowd.

My son is a vet as well. I think there was a move to try to shift more vets into Tri Care rather than the free care of VA even for war wounded. I agree that this was horrid.

What I find strange is that it would have put vets into a system run by insurance companies instead of one run by Veterans affairs.

The more you did into this mess, the more obvious it becomes that the whole insurance company scam is nothing more than a way to shift the wealth of the nation away from the people and into fewer and fewer hands and that the government is complicit in this goal.

Craig,

Your recent string of posts has made me think that we need to get you tested for performance enhancing drugs because you've been knocking them out of the park lately. If you could then give said PED's to all people in the health care debate, maybe an adult conversation could be had on the topic.

I don't understand how people don't see that medical bills are what drives most people, even with insurance, to bankruptcy.

Ethan Zohn?, the recent Survivor winner who is fighting cancer, recently posted that each chemo treatment costs him $23,000 and that's with insurance. This guy was a millionaire and he's worried that fighting cancer will bankrupt him too...

When Alicia was on MSNBC yesterday, she dropped an eye opening quote when asked about her current insurance situation...

"Why bother with a mammogram if you can't afford the cancer?"

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253000

Diva --

You were the essence of "poise over noise." I like the direction Contessa's going too. I may start turning on the tv again when I'm home during the day.

Did I miss lunch?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253010
"The road to hell was closed yesterday as the devil's minions searched for the missing soul of Robert Novak. "

Styx and stones

What Your Choice of Words Says about Your Personality
A language analysis program reveals personality, mental health and intent by counting and categorizing words

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=you-are-what-you-say

Demand rises for publicly funded burials

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-08-19-funerals_N.htm

Ivy,

everyone missed lunch except you. You and me kiddo, you don't eat any lunch, what a frugal lunch pink-date ( don't tell Natasha, or Cho, or....) you are.....you drive ok?

"But I am not in the let them die who needs them crowd"

Ree, I was referring to the comment below the article you posted not you. It just bothered me that a totally legitimate questionaire to help people make decisions about medical care was being portrayed as a way to kill off veterans and blaming Obama for wanting to do it.

Keith Olbermann will have a nutty over this tonight...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/20/tom-ridge-i-was-pressured_n_264127.html

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253033

Solar --

My driving? I think it's okay. I've logged about a million miles. Haven't been pulled over in 20 years or so. I have a good intuitive sense of direction even if I get my right and my other-right mixed up sometimes. I don't buck oncoming traffic, and I figure I can turn around and go another way any time.

(^_~)

Since the 1980s, American agriculture has become increasingly concentrated. Today, less than 2 percent of farms account for half of all agricultural sales. The new antitrust division of President Obama's Justice Department has said that scrutinizing monopolies in agriculture is a top priority.

That shift is giving hope to independent farmers, who have complained for years that agriculture giants are shrinking the marketplace and paying farmers less for their products.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=112035045

IM Driving,,,,,,gimme those key's..........your husband doesn't stand a chance....your mean. with a smile on you.......

The role the rabid Left is playing and why Democrats ought to be concerned.

http://stubbornfacts.us/domestic_policy/health_care/mass_hysteria_over_health_care_reform_leftwing_edition#comments

Raf (voted for Obama) )brings up the Left’s role in the Healthcare debate. This kind of groupthink from the fringe is something Leadership must reject. I rather doubt Hillary would be boycotting Whole Foods. I can’t tell you how many Indians in NYC love to shop there and strangely enough, Liberals would be surprised what many Indians think about America’s Left and the threat to abandon Obama.

Mobile missile defense and Obama’s military strategy

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004990.html

Note the maker here of the GBI is Boeing, the same producer of the Air Borne Laser (ABL). In keeping with the lessons we learned from past wars, Missile Defense programs seek to create layers of protection. We have been at this endevor as a nation since 1980 and in the following thirty years the MIC has come up with some valuable defensive capabilities as well as a series of prototypes heralding further game changing advances. Americans should have an informed debate about the need and direction of these programs relative to a realistic assessment of current and near term threats while understanding that this critical aspect of the defense budget is rather a small percentage of our GDP.

If you scan today’s Defense Tech, you will see that perhaps the India would love one our mothballed carriers given the inferior Russian product they have yet to recieve. We can see how metamaterial surfaces one day not too far off will cloak military objects. Such metasurfaces may well be needed to discharge the energies required to deflect lasers. I wonder how many will see the stuff of sci fi actually fly.

We are certainly nearing the cusp of military innovation which has serious implications for present global competitiveness and the outcomes of violent conflict. There are two things that stand out about American supremacy in these matters. We had a network and manufacturing base that delivered materials in sufficient numbers and that in important areas we had a qualitative edge. These have tipped fortune our way. This we less true about WW2 in terms of qualitative edge, but certainly true of most conflict that has followed. Both our soldier centric conventional backbone and our qualitative edge in technology provides the real measure of deterrence in the decades of technological and political change that will occur in the coming decades. The road we map out in the next few years will be critical.

I watched Obama's talk radio interview a few minutes ago on MSNBC.

He always reminds me of the high school debator who talks and talks and talks, but lacks any real passion.

His first non-answer quickly dismissed whether Sebelius misspoke about the public option option by saying this is what we have been saying and then he went on for minutes with his standard talking points.

Yesterday I put one of my smaller Hillary signs in the trunk of my car. I just might hit the streets to get a fighter in the White House.

I keep thinking..where is the fight in this President.

Any meaningful health care reform will be in spite of Barack Obama, not because of him.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253038

Hey, I'm nice...don't run red lights and always observe the Yield sign...though it's confusing about who has right-of-way, the immediate right-hand turner, or the guy making a left through the intersection?

(^_~)

Once in Texas, I commuted to work past a shot-dead body lying on the road. Armadillos were fighting back...

Posted by: Oregon Democrat Author Profile Page | August 20, 2009 1:49 PM

Mitt Romney will be president before Romney will. Have fun cannibalizing your own party, though.

"Mitt Romney will be president before HILLARY will."

Damn, that took some of the bite out of it, eh?

How can you sustain a democracy if one of the two major political parties has been overrun by nihilists? And another question: How can you maintain the illusion of journalistic impartiality when one of the political parties has jumped the shark?

http://www.time.com/time/printout/0,8816,1917525,00.html

Patsi...

"Those tactics were used by Joseph Goebbels against the Jews to denigrate, demean and demonize them. Only your Party uses them against Liberals, Democrats and any who disagree with them and have for years."

From Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, and Bush 2 Right Wing Radio has denigrated, demeaned and demonized Liberals, Democrats and any who disagreed with them.

That is a fact whether or not you agree with me.

"And my response to Ping was what that woman said to Frank about Obama's policy on Health Insurance\Care to Nazi death camps killing Jews."

And I was wrong to use the word only. I should have just said your Party uses them against Liberals, Democrats and any who disagree with them and have for years."

While I have said it plenty of times over the past 4 years the fact remains that the Right has continually denigrated, demeaned and demonized Liberals, Democrats and any who disagreed with them.

Only now they are going into the intimidation phase and possibly more violent phase more than they have in the past.

Tell me what would have happened if armed Liberals, Democrats and those who opposed the Bush\Cheney policies showed up at any meeting that Bush\Cheney were speaking brandishing weapons. That is if they were allowed to get within 500 feet of where he was.

And now we have all the nuts coming to Presidential meetings with guns hoping for a confrontation. I submit that one day one of those nuts will kill someone at a political meeting, there just looking for a excuse, any excuse to shoot someone. And a innocent bystander will end up dead.

WASHINGTON – The world's oceans this summer are the warmest on record.

The National Climatic Data Center, the government agency that keeps weather records, says the average global ocean temperature in July was 62.6 degrees. That's the hottest since record-keeping began in 1880. The previous record was set in 1998.

Meteorologists blame a combination of a natural El Nino weather pattern on top of worsening manmade global warming. The warmer water could add to the melting of sea ice and possibly strengthen some hurricanes.

The result has meant lots of swimming at beaches in Maine with pleasant 72-degree water. Ocean temperatures reached 88 degrees as far north as Ocean City, Md., this week.

The Gulf of Mexico, where warm water fuels hurricanes, has temperatures dancing around 90. Most of the water in the Northern Hemisphere has been considerably warmer than normal. The Mediterranean is about three degrees warmer than normal. Higher temperatures rule in the Pacific and Indian Oceans.

It's most noticeable near the Arctic, where water temperatures are as much as 10 degrees above average.

Breaking heat records in water is more ominous as a sign of global warming than breaking temperature marks on land. That's because water takes longer to heat up and doesn't cool off as easily, said climate scientist Andrew Weaver of the University of Victoria in British Columbia.

"This is another yet really important indicator of the change that's occurring," Weaver said.

Liberals don't have guns, Anon.

Posted by: anon-paranoid Author Profile Page | August 20, 2009 2:06 PM

Your passion is admirable, Anon-P, but if you let fear control you, you become a part of the problem. Relax every once in a while; life's too short.

I agree about the nuts, Anon. But you cannot deny that you scream HITLER every time you turn around!

Another angle on health care. Canadian patients coming to Michigan to get health care.

http://www.freep.com/article/20090820/BUSINESS06/908200420/?imw=Y

Corey...

I would ponder to guess that some do. Though I don't think that they would kill anyone unless shot at first.

DL...

I do relax, what upsets me is that no one looks at the whole picture. Our Country is a Fascist Country now and though I don't like to believe it even some Democrats helped the Republicans bring Fascism to our shores.

It's the Corporations who have bought our elected representatives lock, stock and barrel and the laws wrote favor them over the American Citizens.

That's another fact whether or not you believe what I say is true.

Nash2.0,

Comparing the Obama Administration to FDR's and Lincoln's at this stage may put things into perspective.

In August of 1933, evil joe kennedy was busy subverting colleagues in the Administration, and sending letter's that both alarmed and energized his bigoted and reactionary pals on Wall Street. Meanwhile, fascist swine were planning a coup de etat for October, and trying to recruit highly respected retired General Butler to be their front man. The NRA that would be undone by the SCOTUS was still in the future, as was the WPA and CCC. To the good, by this time currency had been stabilized at 60% of it's previous value, and the runs on the banks were stopped, and organized crime had been deprived of its largest source of revenue.

US post offices, customs houses, and arsenals (notably Liberty Arsenal, in MO)had been attacked across the South, and Federal employees murdered. Confederate troops attacked and destroyed the US military installation at Fort Sumter in April 12, and in July Confederate troops defeated the US Army at Bull Run. Between the inauguration and Bull Run, Sec'y of State Seward conducted secret negotiations with the enemy behind Lincoln's back, undercutting America. To the good : zero.

President Obama oversaw the stabilization of American banks, the lightening swift resolution of Chrysler and GM insolvencies, and withdrew American troops from Baghdad. While most Americans would prefer a total pullout from Iraq, and are grumpy about the confused and hapless attempt to create universal health insurance, the Administration made solid accomplishments, and there are more to come. After all, we are still only 7 1/2 months into the 48 month 1st term.

Well getting ready to leave for the day. Off tomorrow and I look forward to another day with no A/C. Went out sometime Monday and the landlord will not have anyone over until tomorrow morning.

Hope this is the last night with no air. 87 when I went to bed and 85 when I got up this morning.

Later.

Corey,

Yes, that is another positive element of the Canadian National Health Care System: they will pay for patients to go to the United States for treatment that is not available locally in Canada. Rather than build redundant facilities, they use ours. And rather than having the Canadian patient go to another Canadian facility that might not be as convenient, they make a short trip across the border from Ontario to Michigan.

A most sensible approach.

Here in the United States we have many situations that every hospital in a city must have the newest of everything rather than specialize and refer. Once they have the equipment they must pay for it by using it and billing insurance companies -- sometimes whether the patient really needs it or not.

Contrary to some of the comments here, tort reform, which may end some defensive treatments, will not end most of it, because much of it is based on utilization of available capital equipment. The more you prescribe its use, the more insurance money you get, the more equipment you can buy.......................................

Artical about the new "health foods". Love this line

"I try to avoid as many additives as possible, and when it says 'doctor-recommended,' you know damned well you don't need it."

http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-health/20090820/US.MED.Unproven.Remedies.Superfoods/

Newt Gingrich editorial gets slammed by readers:

http://thepoliticalcarnival.blogspot.com/2009/08/newt-gingrichs-op-ed-gets-slammed-by-la.html

I tried watching Mr Obama's group thingy at the the DNC hq. Couldn't take it.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253045

It was dispiriting to read Klein's article. But I appreciate his depth of insight and eloquence of expression, colored by personal experience with which I empathize.

By the end of the reading, sad as I felt, I realized can still make a choice: to allow myself to fall into despair and resignation, or to consciously reject the hopelessness the right wing is peddling. Fall victim to pessimism, or side-step them and choose optimism?

As nihilists, the right wing increasingly emerges as its own death panel. I won't allow them to fear-monger me into giving up MY hope in a better future as a means to THEIR self-actualization. They tried during the campaign, and the majority rejected them. We can do it again. Therefore, I renew my faith in optimism, and the belief that we're going to be all right, no matter what happens.

Insurance Companies - Murder by Spreadsheet

http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/08/20/mr-baucus-mr-conrad-respond-to-this-grief-stricken-family-now/

Flatus

Well he has added a new term to the general conversation. Lots of yammer about the President say, "Everybody just got all wee-weed up"

From now on we can go around saying ..."Are you wee-weed up? Talk to the table.

Jamie, there are so many chilling anecdotes, including those of our tent-mates, Alicia and BW and all the others here.

Only the village idiots can close their eyes to the desperate condition within families all over this country.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253060

Jamie --

There's a story like that in my family, and probably a lot of families right here at Trail Mix. Health care poverty has become untenable to me. The last lines of the article are most important: "This is the reason we fight. Don’t give up, don’t get sidetracked, don’t be swayed, never forget. This is about people’s lives." To which I add, people lives today in the here-and-now, not some distant future for bean counters. A citizenry with no health cannot create any wealth.

"the Administration made solid accomplishments, and there are more to come. "

He's certainly better than McCain and the GOP would have been, but PUHLEEZE...he has NOT stabilized anything.

""Everybody just got all wee-weed up""

Jamie, he's one tough scat :)

Great column on how the Health Care Reform should have been done

http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/23395

RFD-TV's magazine, received today, says Imus' last broadcast will be Aug 28th.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253063 "To which I add, people lives today in the here-and-now, not some distant future for bean counters."

Well said Ivy.

New Poll: 77 Percent Support "Choice" Of Public Option
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/20/new-poll-77-percent-suppo_n_264375.html

Face it Obama is weaker than Jimmy Carter and doesn't seem to have a clue. this runnung around trying to be bipartisan when they are kicking dirt in your face. Look a what Chuck Grassley pulled.

It is time to demand a vote get their names on paper. Then we can begen the next election. If a Democrat votes for a bill without a public medicare type option. then find someone to run against them. Better to have a Republican in the seat.

That is the only thing they are scared of loosing their seat.

Jack

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253041

Ivy, thanks for the lunch ride, had fun; and glad to get back in one piece......yes you are very nice.! .......Have a question for you. Did you try to drive the Captain of the airplane nuts too. Did he have to make a left hand turn when you told him.....or was this a little devilish plan just for me? what did I do? im innocent over here. At least you let me drive; and not put me in the back seat, and all , just like that Chloe women, and U know who.

3210 lobbyists for insurance and medical profiteers.

The Best democracy money can buy

http://www.truthout.org/081709C?n

"At least you let me drive; and not put me in the back seat, and all "

Oh Solar, I'm glad you brought that up. I've been meaning to tell you, you don't have to ride in the back seat anymore. From now on, I'm taking the pickup truck. You don't mind riding in the truck bed, do you? It'll give you a lot of room to stretch out and take a nap.

Here's the CSPAN video of the Barney Frank town hall
including all the boring parts :-)

http://www.c-span.org/Watch/C-SPAN_rm.aspx

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253068

Thanks, Chloe. Let me point out I'm not down on bean counters. They are some of my dearest people, and I respect their knowledge and skills. By the same token, I'm confident bean counters of the future will be smart enough to solve any problems that come their way. Instead of projecting what they might have to contend with, we are better served to solve our own problem of the day which is limited or lack of access to general public health care.

Seems 77% of people actually want a government option. The internals on the Survey USA poll are fascinating

http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=5ba17aa2-f1b9-4445-a6b8-62b9d1ba8693

c-bob: Bob Novak and Bob MacNamara are now sharing a condo in hell.

I just met up with a group of my friends. We are going to attend the next THM of our Congressman's. Since we don't have money to buy real guns and they aren't really our thing anyway, we decided that we are going to get the biggest Wham-o Super Soakers we can find and wear those instead. We will have T-Shirts made up -- Open Carry Divas.

"we are better served to solve our own problem of the day"

... which is the only thing that will get politicians reelected. It seems to me, that the bean counters are just following instructions. They must figure things both short term and long term, don't they?

Four of top five recipients of insurance company funds are Democrats.

http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/recips.php?cycle=2010&ind=F09

Nash -

I was reading about Novak. Dick Morris was his Clinton leaker. He took the Cross Fire gig to pay his gambling debts.

Posted by: Corey | August 20, 2009 2:12 PM :
"Liberals don't have guns, Anon."

Corey, by that definition I'm obviously not a Liberal.

Patsi, In January all but one of the 7 biggest banks in America had either already toppled, or were in danger of toppling. The Administration changed that situation. That is why I used the word 'stabilized'.

Corey and Xrep,

There are plenty of liberal gun owners. The just don't generally feel they need to tote them to Yosemite or to their local bar for that matter.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253080

You're right on that too, Chloe. Economists have theories about the art and science of balancing the short term and the long term, but I'm too lazy at the moment for the homework...however, I know what John Maynard Keynes said about the long run...

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253070

Solar --

Very funny... and mischievous.

(^_~)

Vitter's Devious Plan

One of the great, too-little-considered mysteries of modern Washington is that Sen. David Vitter (R-LA) was actually a Rhodes Scholar. Recently, in order to explain the seeming contradiction between his opposition to health care reform and his support for reimporting drugs from countries with national health care systems like the Dems want in the US. Vitter says it's part of a long-range plan to bankrupt the health care systems in those other countries and force them back to a USA style free market system.

--Josh Marshall

"The just don't generally feel they need to tote them to Yosemite or to their local bar for that matter."

Joe, How can you be so sure of that?

c-bob: You like odd bits of data.

A recent survey reports the ten most expensive cities in the world...

1. Oslo
2. Zurich
3. Bangor, Maine
4. Copenhagen
5. Geneva
6. Tokyo
7. New York
8. Helsinki
9. Vienna
10. Paris

Now, I know what you're thinking. Is Zurich really more expensive than Bangor? Just remember that Stephen King lives there, and all he can afford is a 1950s era 2-bedroom ranch with no garage.

Vitter just doesn't " Jump the Shark " ..... he jumps the whale shark. or maybe even a blue whale.

Chloe,

What happened---how did we miss lunch?

And Solar, lunch with Ivy & you got to ride shotgun---and still complaining!

I didn't have any lunch today---was working with
clients on their 'end of life' counseling, preparation &
execution of POA, health care instructions, wills---all without any govt assistance/subsidy/legislation to pay for it.

ivy:

The problem is that no matter what argument you want to make - you can find some economic theory to support it.

Economists come in all stripes, Supply-side, Demand-side, Liberal, Conservative, etc.

And to tell ya the truth - I think they are guessing just like every other political analyst out there. They just use a bunch more charts and graphs. So maybe they are more like Nate Silver than Chris Matthews - but at the end of the day - it is all just guess work.

You've been busy today Coreen. You give attorney's a good name.

Yes, we did miss lunch today, I've been missing a lot of them lately. And Solar been complaining about us behind our backs. That's why he's graduated to the bed of the pickup truck.

chloe,

I know quite a few. In fact, if you were raised in the South, the mountain West, rural New England, Penn, Wisconsin, Michigan, owning a gun does not correlate to your political views very well at all, I don't think.

divalicias: Supersoakers. I love it, This is the perfect counter-protest. It's non-threatening but it makes the gun nuts look silly.

Jamie:

That was a good article on how health care should have been done.

But I am sick of all the piling on Obama. Most of the critique is that he should have came up with a bill a jammed it down Congress's throat. In other words, exactly how the Clintons failed.

While all you dems continue to berate of Obama - think about this. The GOP made quite clear months ago they were drawing a line in the sand on healthcare. That talk about it being Obama's Waterloo was precisely what they are thinking.

They got people all scared with rationing and even worse - that once this bill passes - it will be impossible to roll back - so we need to stop it dead in its tracks.

So even if Obama played this perfectly - it would have still gotten ugly. People critize Obama for message control - but there are respected Republicans and a ton of news outlets spreading bald-faced lies.

So what I am getting at - is that the GOP sees this as the big battle. They are bringing out the big guns and holding the line.

And the Democrats need to unite and stick together to stand a chance. All this infighting is exactly what happened to the McCain campaign as it crashed and burned last Fall.

So either pile on Obama and help the Republicans - or fight back against the real enemy.

Diva,

At worst you could soak the politicians just like they constantly soak us!

"owning a gun does not correlate to your political views very well at all,"

I agree Joe.
I thought you were referring to liberal gun owners as 'opposed' to conservative gun owners. As though liberal gun owners were more 'responsible' than conservative ones. I misunderstood. I hear so much anti-everything-Republican here, that I see it where it isn't sometimes.

Md. police arrest 2 teens in alleged hate beating

The three suspects, all of whom are white, are charged with attempted murder, assault and armed carjacking, among other crimes.

Lockner, 28, a white supremacist who uses "Hitler" as a nickname and has a tattoo of the Nazi leader, was arrested shortly after the beating. He told police the attack would not have happened if the victim had been white, court documents show.

http://www.seattlepi.com/national/1110ap_us_black_fisherman_beaten.html

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253100

Warren,

In any contest between the President and the Republicans, I'm sticking with the President. That doesn't mean that I will support a bill without a public option, but that is a financial decision not a political one.

Without a public option, then the "reform" becomes nothing more than another massive give away to big pharma and big insurance. Those negotiations have been shameful.

If breaking the health care bill into pieces in order to get that public option (preferred type: add people to Medicare) works, then that is what should happen.

"divalicias: Supersoakers. I love it, This is the perfect counter-protest. It's non-threatening but it makes the gun nuts look silly. "

ROFL...ditto what Nash said.

Sturgeone, Those were really neat pix from Sofia. It seems as if it might be a beautiful place to visit, but isn't it a little shaky politically?

Solar, I certainly agree that docs can be irritating and very wrong and over-paid. That's why I said to change a doc you don't like or argue with him/her. to me th biggest thing you should know about your doc is whether she/he is board certified - absolute must. then what school(s) were attended. Then, internist, family practice, or specialist. The more omportant the specialty to my own state of health the more I'd be likely to tolerate a bad bed-side manner.

I was having my teeth cleaned once and the hygienist really hurt me twice, hitting on troubled areas. I told her to go easy, yet she did it again. I jumped out of the chair and said, "That's it! I'm outta here!" She freaked and pleaded with me and offered to give me a little gas so I took her up on it - boy, if she had blown it, she'd have been in DEEP doo-doo. As it was, she did fine. I'm prepared to do the same with anyone, medical or not, who pushes that last button. I am NOT a confrontational person, but I can do it - it's good to know your own boundaries.

I love a good spicy pumpkin pie, and pecan pie. Alex wants me to make him an apple pie, and teach him how. My good apple pie is so labor intensive that it takes about 6 hours in all, so he has to wait!

"So either pile on Obama and help the Republicans - or fight back against the real enemy."

Oops...I forgot that we can't criticize the New Joshua. Cause if you do you side with the terrorists. Get real.

And Warren -- it's not people like us you should worry about. We'll not be voting GOP anyway. It's all those glassy eyed kids who were mesmerized and may lose interest in politics as fast as they seem to have lost interest in helping create this great wave of young activists making America great.....

Utahns' earnings no match for skyrocketing health insurance premiums

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_13160946

Lobbyists who want to use taxpayer dollars to pay for artificial playing surfaces on all school playgrounds, have organized groups of protestors to pack town hall meetings.

They're called "astroturfers for Astroturf."

"So either pile on Obama and help the Republicans - or fight back against the real enemy.

Warren
I really think someone needs to convince President Obama who the real enemy is! I don't think were piling on the President,i think were trying to hold his feet to the fire! Its imperative we demand the President keep his promises..

I am trying to help two very young women run for public office. One is running for Congress, the other for local county supervisor. One of the biggest problems I'm having is the amount of chafe coming from women my age and older, who for some reason want to relegate these smart and dedicated young women to something less than a Barbie doll. I don't understand it. Our county DEM chair is under 30 -- a very bright young man. He is a little star-struck - but he has built our committee in a rural red county from a small insular knot of concerned liberals to well over 100 people. And the older folks are giving him grief! I have heard older women in NOW gripe about all "these ignorant young women" -- even in front of the young women who are sitting in the meeting. We should all be thrilled that young people are becoming more involved. I am glad to have some help with the damned torch that keeps getting heavy with each mile.

I think what Warren said is right. The more we pile on Obama or any of our DEMs, the more we're playing into the GOP playbook.

Let's keep pressing our concerns and focus on the *Issues* and keep on telling them what WE WANT. The other side has done a very good job saying what they DON'T WANT and getting people frightened and confused.

Give our leaders the strength to hold fast.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253023

"The Reason I voted for Bill Clinton the first time is because he said he would do something about the homeless. When he came into office the first thing he did was don't ask don't tell...I wish he would have at least addressed the homeless gay folks."

Ree
I loved the fact President Clinton had the guts to tackle gays in the military.I think you feel gays aren't a priority.Oh and homeless gay folks,what a joke...

On defense, Obama woos right, left on health care
"Yet for all the gnashing from Republicans and fiscally conservative Democrats, he faces equally tough opposition from lawmakers and activists on the left who insist any overhaul must include a government-run insurance option.

In fact, shortly after his comments Thursday, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi declared the Democratic-controlled House simply won't approve the overhaul without it." http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090820/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_health_care

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253095

No argument here, Warren...Economics is a "social" science...closer to psychology than physics. lol

Chloe, Natasha,

"Yes, we did miss lunch today, I've been missing a lot of them lately. And Solar been complaining about us behind our backs. That's why he's graduated to the bed of the pickup truck." Dang phone ring every 5 min. and not about work......

I drove, not complaining at all. I had a lot of fun with Ivy, she is a great lunch companion, she's just like any other pink.....likes to tell you when to make a left or a right...and we were discussing it a little is all.

Now, lets talk about this here pick-em-up trk, that you put me in now. Drive slow, watch the bumps, when making turns, take them a slowly , etc, etc ok.?? Now, lets talk about me talking behind your backs..........I did not do any such thing.....It was all out in the open.......I was talking in front of your backs, can't you pinks get anything ok=right haha....Tony get in here and help me out will ya...or Ill send Jamie's dillo after you.!!

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253103

Another civil case for Southern Poverty Law Center once the criminal convictions are bagged.

http://www.splcenter.org/index.jsp

."Tony get in here and help me out will ya...or Ill send Jamie's dillo after you.!!"

Ha,Solar
You got it.I was scrolling up looking for Jamie's "dillo"link to thank her,thank you Jamie.I got a laugh and did you get a look at those feet,believe me their perfect for digging!

Too bad Cindy Sheehan didn't carry an AR 15 to Crawford.
We'd have all those clips of Fox and Friends worried about the safety of the president.

Joan Walsh on The Ed Show just made my point. Failure to get "Public Option" would be a financial disaster for the country.

"likes to tell you when to make a left or a right..."

Solar --

Like Hubs, you'll have to learn about "thisaway" and "thataway." lol

Jim Cramer Thinks Food, Inc. Could Inflame The Justice Dept To Take On Monsanto (VIDEO)

Last week, Jim Cramer did a fascinating segment on the seed giant and Roundup herbicide producer, Monsanto. He posits that Monsanto could be a prime target for a Justice Department antitrust action for their monopoly on seeds.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/20/jim-cramer-thinks-food-in_n_264115.html

"Too bad Cindy Sheehan didn't carry an AR 15 to Crawford.
We'd have all those clips of Fox and Friends worried about the safety of the president. "

LMAO!!! Except -- she'd probably be in Gitmo right now....

In front of your backs, or behind your fronts. that is.

President Obama on Thursday said he and the First Lady are looking into setting up a farmers market just outside the White House, which might sell food from the White House garden or from local farmers. The president said it could give the city of Washington, D.C., “more access to good, fresh food, but it also is this enormous potential revenue-maker for local farmers in the area.”

http://www.grist.org/article/2009-08-20-obama-wants-to-set-up-white-house-farmers-market/

Froomkin column on "public Option"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/20/the-public-option-its-abo_n_264397.html

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-252922

"Let people run their own healthcare. How American is this? Remember, be smart. Avoid the co-op mistakes of the past and understand the government will be playing the role of the third pary. What an advantage for the co-ops."

Max
Thanks, lot's of great post's today! In reading them all;I just don't get why you prefer the complicated iffy co-ops vs. a single payer Medicare type plan that has been proven to work? I think your fantasy of bi-partisanship is nice, but really?Let us look back and see how bi-partisanship worked for the Clinton's on healthcare.

Favorite quote of the day. Stephen Colbert:

"The facts have a well-known liberal bias"

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253125

Reading that article makes you want to start a campaign: Bring Back The Cafeteria Lady

There was a time when children actually got served good food in schools.

Chlo,

I had to change that pic on facebook. Carol did not like that baby pic of me. I don't know why.......How do like that one?

Independent Farmers Feel Squeezed By Milk Cartel

The price of raw milk paid to farmers has dropped to its lowest level in 40 years. Dairy farms are going under across the country, and a few dairymen have grown so desperate they've taken their own lives.

As the crisis deepens, criticism grows that dairy giants are trying to monopolize the industry, to the detriment of independent farmers and consumers.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=112002639

"Let people run their own healthcare. How American is this? Remember, be smart."
-------------
Check, right after we learn what the 3 branches of government are.

For every five hours of cable news, less than a minute is devoted to science; 46 percent of Americans reject evolution and think the Earth is less than 10,000 years old; the number of newspapers with weekly science sections has shrunken by two-thirds over the past several decades. The public is polarized over climate change—an issue where political party affiliation determines one's view of reality—and in dangerous retreat from childhood vaccinations. Meanwhile, only 18 percent of Americans have even met a scientist to begin with; more than half can't name a living scientist role model.

Unscientific America (broadcast Friday, August 21st, 2009)
http://www.sciencefriday.com/program/archives/200908212

Historian Rick Shenkman laments the breed in his book, "Just How Stupid Are We?"

Only 2 of 5 voters can name the three branches of the federal government. And 49 percent of Americans think the president has the authority to suspend the Constitution.

http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/national/2008/06/03/the-ignorant-american-voter.html

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253131

Cbob

That is a milk co-op in action.
It is what happens when co-ops grow big. You can't tell them from the big corporations.

Jack

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253131

Oh, C-Bob
You are fab!! I thank you for this comment.

But jack, at least a true Co-op would be a 501c3?

George Carlin once said that he felt sorry for homeless gay people. They probably WISH they had a closet to come out of!

Hey Solar, don't put words in my mouth. I said your baby smoking a cigarette would more likely be appreciated down in my neck of the woods.

Is constructive criticism of Obama welcome?

"Froomkin column on "public Option"

Good article. Thanks, Jamie.

Hey Alicia, thx for the Supersoaker idea, I'm stealing it for our 3 thm. :-) My sign "Coops are for Chickens"

today was Lard's first day of radiation and chemo, would probably mean a lot for you guys to add a comment to his new blog.. It would mean a lot for my twitter pals to leave a comment on my brain cancer pal's blog.. http://bit.ly/DRPIz

Rez
It would be a 501c meaning a nonprofit but to be a c3 means that it would take tax deductible donations.

A coop is for the benefit of the members, so it would not be a charity. It falls under some other category of 501c.

I don't see much difference between a large medical co-op and a mutual benefit Insurance company like Blue cross Blue shield

Jack

Here is the 501c tax code listings of various organisations and where they fit in

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode26/usc_sec_26_00000501----000-.html#c_12_H

Jack

Hey, I love the supersoaker idea

and the " coops are for chickens"

Jack

Warren, Diva

I've come to believe that Obama needs the pressure of criticism to keep him on the straight and narrow.

If it is not there, then he will sell the farm.

Jack

Jack, Definitely not a tax expert but I was including the "3" because my health Co-op file a tax exempt form 900 as a 501c3.

I do see the difference from the large DFA in the Cbob comment and my health Coop.

I thought Obama wanted people to make him accountable.

I keep hoping he will develop some guts. I've never been a fan of Nancy Pelosi, but at least she has guts.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253149

Jack, My wife suggested that I change my sign since we belongs to a Coop and with my luck I might get asked a question by a reporter and get burned. 8-) lol

Carol, not really a pic of me as a baby, just a pic.

Rez

As i understand it the only thing keeping your little health co-op from being the DFA of medical care is the want to and the bylaws changes..

Dairy co-operatives all started small representing a few counties at the most. They kept consolidating to take advantage of marketshare and the reduced cost of volumn.

Jack

Horsey -

http://www.seattlepi.com/horsey/viewbydate.asp?ID=1980

Sorry Jack, that was form 990

Shttp://www.ghc.org/about_gh/co-op_overview/taxes/ghc990_2007.pdf

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253141

Ha,Corey
See I was right what a joke! I would have to be homeless to crave a closet to crawl back into...

Jack, I remember a few years ago while watching tennis they said that Roger Federer's girlfriend (now his wife) was a little bit worried because all the tennis commentators did nothing but praise Roger. She thought he also needed to hear people give criticism as well. Otherwise, he might get too cocky.

Rez

thanks , interesting

So how doe it work?
Does it deliver healthcare?
or is it a health care/ insurance combined?

Jack

First of 3:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7BRraVMZzc

The Leaping Gnome with #2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxNEiZhpinY

Corey

Obama, cocky?

Nah, never happen
;-)

Jack

Stevie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSRyf5G2uI8

And I fell asleep and dreamed
I dreamed I was in a Hollywood movie
And that I was the star of the movie
This really blew my mind, the fact that me,
an overfed, long-haired leaping gnome
should be the star of a Hollywood movie

But there I was, I was taken to a place, the hall of the mountain kings
I stood high upon a mountain top, naked to the world
In front of every kind of girl, there was
black ones, round ones, big ones, crazy ones...

Out of the middle came a lady
She whispered in my ear something crazy
She said:

Spill the wine and take that pearl, Spill the wine and take that pearl

Jack,

I just began seriously looking into our health provider this past year. It's through DW as a benny from her state University job. Each year we have to elect in or out or change providers. Group Health has received national recognition (model) as a decent low cost deliverer of health care. We pay about $225/mo for us two and her employer pays about twice that I believe, so it would be expensive if it was total self pay. Here's a link below that gives the nutshell. We like it but we're without 10 miles of the facilities. If we were rural it would be different. Some knock it because they have to bitch to get referrals for specialists and fight for preventative needs. But that's just being proactive in my book.

Both of us have been through a major health crisis in the past 10 years that would have bankrupt most without ins. and we did fine financially. So I have no gripes, especially after reading here recently.

http://www.ghc.org/about_gh/co-op_overview/fastFacts.jhtml

Jack, I forgot to add that it's a far cry better than the
Indian Health Service on which I grew up. The IHS makes V A hospital service look plush.

The failure of the towering Sayano-Shushenskaya dam, which accounts for 15 percent of Russia’s hydroelectric power and 2 percent of its overall power, highlighted what a risky investment Russia’s infrastructure can be.

By Thursday evening, 17 employees of the electrical company had been confirmed dead and an additional 58 were missing. Authorities said chances of finding anyone alive were slim. The force of the flood lifted one 900-ton turbine from its housing and bounced it off the ceiling of the machine room, Russia’s chief rescue official said. An oil slick stretched 80 miles down the Yenisei.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/21/business/global/21ruble.html?pagewanted=1&hpw

The BBC has a clip of that thing as it is happening.

Pablo speaks:

http://www.ucl.ac.uk/sts/fellows/ambrosio/artwork/guernica_template_woman.jpe

Lincoln's Prophecy for the GOP

By Harold Meyerson
Thursday, August 20, 2009

Republican ideology has shrunk alongside its geography and demographics. Where once its view of the role of government ran the gamut from Rockefeller activism to Goldwater libertarianism, today the party largely adheres to the religiosity and the anti-statism of the white South. (In its ideological uniformity, today's GOP looks -- O, the irony -- more like a classic European party than an American one.)

In short, the Republican Party with which Democrats could make deals no longer exists. The GOP is too narrow; the gap between the parties, too wide. Our politics are not those of the mid-20th century, when bipartisanship was fairly common. If anything, they're more like those of the mid-19th century, before the Civil War, when North and South combined only to make a house divided against itself -- a conflict resolved not by compromise, but, as Lincoln predicted, by a nation then half-slave and half-free becoming "all one thing or all the other."

Lincoln's prophecy still holds. Our current conflicts may be resolved only as the South becomes traditionally less Southern and more diverse -- home to more Northern transplants and immigrants. That process was already at work in the 2008 elections, when Obama carried Virginia, North Carolina and Florida on the strength of those demographic shifts. As that process continues -- perhaps only as it continues -- the course of reform in America may run more smoothly.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/19/AR2009081902901.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

bob.....went to see my childhood nanny today.......she's 94 and can't work her garden anymore.............but i did pick up a piece of sweet cornbread off the stove...........

she puts sugar in the cornbread..............like cake..........

maybe there needs to be some kind of winter project for the blue corn site.................

From N.S. Gill:

When Jason outfitted the Argo so he could go off on his quest for the Golden Fleece, his companions were the best and the brightest of his age, mostly sons of gods, although that depends on the list. [Here is one list, from Apollodorus.] This was the generation before the Trojan War. Jason's companions-catalogue includes the tamer of rocks and beasts Orpheus, the psychopomp and giant-killer Hermes' sons Echion and Eurytos, Zeus' twin sons, the horse and boxing-expert pair known as the Dioscuri, the best seer, Mopsos* (before whose amazing skill Agamemnon's seer, Calchas, will later admit defeat and die or be killed after laughing at Hercules), and Hercules. These were the men hand-picked to help Jason travel by sea on a fabulous boat to the eastern edges of the known world, to the land of Colchis, where the witch Medea lived and where her father kept the key to Jason's kingship, the fleece of a golden sheep.

Hercules does not stay the course. He may have been asked to leave, probably because he was too heavy, physically. Symbolically works, too, since Hercules could resolve all the obstacles the Argonauts encounter without breaking a sweat, and if he did so, what glory would remain for any of the other heroes? Pherekydes says the ship, the Argo, asks Hercules to get off at Aphetai, in Thessaly, because his massive bulk overburdens the ship. The ship can talk, thanks to the gift of a speaking timber, from Athena.

This is a follow - up to the first AP story today about the ocean temps this year. It is much scarier. I've read this stuff for years , and I've never read a report like this one.

"This warm water we're seeing doesn't just disappear next year; it'll be around for a long time," said climate scientist Andrew Weaver of the University of Victoria in British Columbia. It takes five times more energy to warm water than land.

The warmer water "affects weather on the land," Weaver said. "This is another yet really important indicator of the change that's occurring."
.............................. atmospheric science professor Judith Curry said water is warming in more places than usual, something that has not been seen in more than 50 years.

Add to that an unusual weather pattern this summer where the warmest temperatures seem to be just over oceans, while slightly cooler air is concentrated over land, said Deke Arndt, head of climate monitoring at the climate data center.

The pattern is so unusual that he suggested meteorologists may want to study that pattern to see what's behind it.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32495552/ns/us_news-environment/

Right...............the BOAT told Herc to disembark at Aphetai............

Ok................that sounds better than that Hercules just couldnt hang...................

Sturg -

Sugar in the corn bread, and raw honey on it.
Yum

http://www.grist.org/article/2009-08-20-obama-wants-to-set-up-white-house-farmers-market/

I sure hope this becomes their theme in the immediate future. They are about 1/2 mile down the road from my farmers market i do twice a week.

Sorry peeps - I;ve been busy writing a thank-you letter. I am seeing if I can cut it down to three pages...

Good one, Craig!

You look great, and you eat that stuff??

Amazing.

tt

Posted by: Colorado Bob | August 20, 2009 9:53 PM :
"Our current conflicts may be resolved only as the South becomes traditionally less Southern and more diverse -- home to more Northern transplants and immigrants. That process was already at work in the 2008 elections, when Obama carried Virginia, North Carolina and Florida on the strength of those demographic shifts. As that process continues -- perhaps only as it continues -- the course of reform in America may run more smoothly.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/19/AR2009081902901.html?hpid=opinionsbox1 "
*********************************************************
This may be wishful thinking. Studies going back to the '70s have indicated that Northern Whites moving to the Sun Belt tend to take on the characteristics of rednecks and crackers, whereas White migration from the South to the North merely changes rednecks and crackers into frigid rednecks and crackers.

I sincerely hope that this phenomenon was specific to a 40 year period, now ended.

Posted by: tonyb39 | August 20, 2009 6:08 PM :
"Oh and homeless gay folks,what a joke..."

I don't see any humor in homelessness.

16 years ago, Sweetie and I took in a frightened gay teen who otherwise would have been sleeping on the streets, and a prey to predators. There is hardly anyone more vulnerable to Commercial Child Sex Abuse, than homeless gay adolescents. john wayne gayce and jeffrey dahmer both collected them.

Of course, gayce and dahmer weren't commercial, but a fellow who preys on people is a predator, whether he's a pimp-predator like rupert murdoch, a john-predator like john wayne gayce, or a cannibal-predator like jeffrey dahmer.

Alright - down to 2 pages. What'd I miss?

OK - so Rachel is railing against Grassley because he wants a healthcare bill that gets 80 votes. How dare him!

You know what 80 votes means - it means an actual bi-partisan bill. And you may say well what good is bi-partisan for b-partisan sake?

Well if you have a bill like that - there will be Republicans defending the merits of the bill.

If you have a bill pass with 60 votes - you will have a unified GOP calling the bill as disaster - before and regardless of whether it actually works. (Remember the stimulus?)

And often perception becomes reality. (At least for half of the Country). Plus, the GOP often has better talking points.

Hillary 2012

The one thing I disliked about Rachel's Grassley critique was using the basketball hoop to make the point. She always talks down to the audience...and I don't think it's necessary.

some astounding photographs:

http://www.wunderground.com/blog/WunderPress/comment.html?entrynum=3

Great shots, sturge!

Eugene Robinson in the WaPo

"Where are the millions who so passionately chanted "Yes, we can!" at Obama's campaign rallies? Where are the legions who cried tears of joy on election night and tears of pride on Inauguration Day?"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/20/AR2009082003038.html

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253199
Sturg, I loved this caption on one of the lighthouse pictures:
"...HISTORY/Caption: The island mouro lighthouse... This Lighthouse entered operation February 15, 1860.Its silhouette recalls to a lighthouse of English rock.Until 1921 they inhabited in it 2 lighthouse keepers that on numerous occasions incommunicado several days by the temporary remained.In 1865 one of the torreros lost the life after to be dragged by one of the strong waves that whip it.In 1920 it withdrew the lamp of a wick, substituting it for a destellador of naked flame with burner, besides a viewpoint of drum. It does some years that the Lighthouse was beheaded by Coasts, passing to the category of beacon. The last incident of certain importance happened in February of 1996 when the system of lighting remained destroyed by a temporary one, remaining dull several days by the impossibility of agreeing to him. The Island of Mouro, declared reserves marine, is a habitual place of I dive. The waves that whip it in days of temporary they are used to surpassing the height of the lighthouse. Their light is situated to 38,7 m. above sea level."

Krugman!

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/21/opinion/21krugman.html?ref=opinion

Good lighthouse info Flatus -- I've always been interested that the Statue of Liberty was a functioning lighthouse for the first years.....

Was about to mention Paul Krugman's 'Obama's
Trust Problem", but Patsi had already posted it.

Seems there is an effort to fire up the administration
by him & Eugene Robinson---however---reality may
be that our elected officials are not willing to risk their
future.

Robinson's call for passion & conviction may be falling on deaf ears:

"Democratic leaders should stop backpedaling, stop apologizing and show their followers -- by words and deeds -- that the principle of universal health care is worth fighting for. They should even allow themselves to raise their voices at times -- not motivated by anger but by conviction. "

Patsi, you have the most interesting factoids!

This insurance thing is such a mess.

I read on Lard's blog how all the stars lined-up and his insurance _should_ carry him through his illness.

And, then, we have Alicia who worked for the critters responsible for our situation and is completely without insurance. While those same critters chat amongst themselves wondering why she, and the 47-million other uninsured, simply don't eat cake.

Noblesse oblige.

Off to the dermatologist for my check-up. Fully covered by Medicare as supplemented by Tricare for Life--as was my $9k infusion on Tuesday. I'll let lyou know when my infusions reach the million dollar mark--won't be too much longer--probably another two years.

Mr, president: Not counting the ones that have lost their homes already; there are over 2 million homes in foreclosure, and over 4 mil, more behind on payments.......please mention these little details when you go out on the trail to try and salvage your slipping #'s.....yes sir I know that you inherited this mess........but you said that you wanted, and could fix it.............

Faith in Obama is slipping:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090821/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_poll

My experience with co-ops happened to be a electric supply company which owned & maintained the lines & bought their power from a electric giant then sold to the public in which their lines ran . Of course it was much higher than locations which were served directly from the giants ,we used to call it the national dept.

Good morning...my friend has written a piece on how perhaps racism killed health care in the Truman administration. It reminds me of the racism that is still frothing at the town hall meetings. I dislike long posts, but here is the opening..not complete --

"In the household of John and Eleanor Thurmond, prominent citizens of Edgefield,
South Carolina, the crime of statutory rape took place. The year was 1925. a child of 15,
Carrie Butler, a black servant girl, was impregnated by Strom Thurmond, then 22.
In 1948 Strom Thurmond became the Presidential candidate of the “States Rights
Democratic Party”, known as the Dixiecrats. One of the planks of their platform was that
”miscegenation”, or sexual relations between blacks and whites be vigorously
prosecuted.Dixiecrat anger was focused on President Truman's push to desegregate the
Military, FBI efforts to prosecute the Klan and associated hate crimes and the Truman
Health Plan at that point stalled in the infamous “do-nothing” Congress."

here is the latter half...

It's hard to realize today that millions of Americans at that time would prefer to
suffer or die rather than accept blood from a black donor, be treated in a hospital which
also treated black persons or be transported in an ambulance used by black patients.
Familiar to observers of today's “rent-a-mob” pushback against health care reform
2009 were Truman Health Plan opponents' endless repetition of the words “Communist”
and “Socialist”, though “Faschist” and “Hitler” were too hot to mention by anyone only
3 years after WWII.
“Miscegenation”, still a crime in the judgement of many, resulted in the birth of
President Obama. This motivates those who are stuck in the attitudes of 1948's
Dixiecrats who refuse to abide anything President Obama, his family and his political
allies have any involvement in, particularly health care reform.
Primitive beliefs which associated sufferers of disease and infirmity with the
disfavor of God also obviously conflict with the notion of universal health care.
We will get universal health care in the US as soon as logic triumphs over racism
and ignorance—sadly, so much unnecessary suffering will have to be endured in the
meanwhile."

It's pretty clear that Obama needs to stop -- in effect -- voting "present."

I agree with this thought that someone posted on Daily Beast: "Obama was never my first choice, but I still support him because even though I don't agree with him completely I still believe he has a legit moral compass."

But that doesn't mean I won't criticize him or hold his feet to the fire....just like I would have done the same had my candidate become president.

Thanks for the article, BW -- I do believe that racism (and a LOT of big business BS) is directly behind the health care outrage. I think the lobbyists are doing their job and causing fear to take over, and they are playing a racist card on the sly to gin people up....

Posted: 8:20 AM Aug 21, 2009

W.Va. Settles Lawsuit Against Eli Lilly
Eli Lilly & Co. will pay $22.5 million to settle a federal lawsuit filed by the West Virginia Attorney General's Office over the popular anti-psychotic drug Zyprexa..........

Lilly settled a lawsuit over Zyprexa involving 30 states in January for $1.42 billion. The company still faces lawsuits in 11 other states.

I won't bomb you with a lot of things this am; but Jack said something yesterday that is apt for this time: He said something like we should ( Tony said it also) make the president keep his promises by reminding him daily.

Im not one for quoting past presidents...sorta like knowing the batting average of some past baseball player...know a lot of them; cos I have been around friends that can tell you anything, about any player.

Any, I remember that FDR said something like " I agree with you, I want to do it; now make me do it" .....think he was talking to the Democratic party........so giving him a present vote on our lives is not good enough........

Patsi...it explains why poeple like Grassley exist. No matter what the prez says, he is a "mulatto," don't ya know!

any=anyway......anyway; later

posted by solar
make the president keep his promises by reminding him daily

Ah, Solar, read my lips...(good morning)

None of them keep their promises. They all speak out of two of three sides of their mouths. I'd rather have an LBJ, someone who is ready to get in the face of congress.

BW -- Yes -- Grassley is an abomination. He literally makes me ill.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253184

"I don't see any humor in homelessness."

X-Rep
What BS!! My point to Ree wasn't that homelessness was humorous!
Oh and I of course know as a gay man homelessness does exist for gay people especially when families toss them.The point was gays in the military was no less important than homelessness.Its what i meant by "homeless gay folks,what a joke.."

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253190

I agree Patsi. Sometimes Rachel can also be a bit too snarky. Or too flippant about serious issues. But hey - if I was on TV for an hour each weeknight - I am sure I would give people plenty to criticize as well...

Tony, I was gonna comment on that, because I told that George Carlin joke, but I saw it was directed at you. I think the discussion was being taken too seriously.

Note to Obama:

“Of course, it’s a bit of a jump, isn’t it? I mean, er… chartered accountancy to lion taming in one go… You don’t think it might be better if you worked your way towards lion taming, say via banking?”

Monty Python

In the settlement unsealed Thursday, the Indianapolis-based company agreed to pay $15.75 million to West Virginia and $6.75 million to lawyers who represented the state.

The settlement says $14.75 million will be used to fund behavioral health care, and the remaining $1 million will go to consumer protection.

Lilly didn't acknowledge wrongdoing. West Virginia had claimed the company improperly marketed the drug

NEW THREAD.. http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/bring-on-the-liberal-dumbikaze.html

The teabagging crowd is so alarmed about taxation and double taxation, yet, are willing to pay the insurance companies two or three times for medical coverage which the companies rake-in never to be seen again. Medical on health insurance, medical on auto insurance, medical on home owner's insurance, etc. Double, triple payment for medical insurance. Where is their outrage? Distaste for Waste???

Grassley is running scared of his base.

It is time to call him out on his BS and make all of Iowa pay attention to his pandering to the extreme right and not serving all Iowa.

How about some ads with family farmers having to choose , "do I get treatment for the cancer and loose everything or do I die but preserve my families future"

It happens

Jack

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/08/defining-the-coops.html#comment-253225

Hi Corey
I agree...Did Michigan ever make it too 90 this year?I miss Michigan this time of year.I spent all of my summer's growing up in Oscoda,MI.The family had a place right on Lake Huron.It was fires on the beach and a lots of water skiing..Lovely

Blonde Wino -- Are you still here?