Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

Good morning all! Very funny Craig, look who's rattling the cage now!

Schwarzenegger says Prop 8 should be overturned...

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-protest10-2008nov10,0,4939340.story

"Louisiana's Bobby Jindal offer a path out of the political wilderness."

What about Jindah's participating in an exorcism in college...won't they Sarah Palin-him?

Craig - By why a cigar in the Picture ?

Response - How do the Republicans respond to the failed leadership that allowed poor fiscal policy?

Response - Wait and see which Barack really shows up... No Rush - Take your time.

The OFFICE OF PRES ELECT - has so many promises to filter that Republicans will be well suited to just sit back.

Good morning Patsi! Aren't Louisianians allowed a bit of the macabre?

Barack Promises defacto - Not so much of what he said - but by not saying much more then an over used Madison Ave pitch - Many People are looking for much.

Constitution, schmonstitution. It's just a goddamn piece of paper.

See, Gordo? The Dems will expose Obama's past after his term expires so that Schwartzenegger can cite it as precedent for his run.

"Aren't Louisianians allowed a bit of the macabre?"

Ha! I hadn't thought about that! And I've even been to the VooDoo Museum in the Quarter!

champ, a follow up from earlier post to you about certain studies:
"an excess of adult males begets aggression toward adult females, whose survival and fecundity drop, along with their emigration rate."
http://www.cees.no/content/view/357/69/

If questioned about the exorcism, Jindal could just pull a George Bush, call it a college prank and say: Laissez les Bon Temps Roulez!

[a repost re sturge's 9:02 to corey's 8:47 pm... i didn't see the new thread]

corey, pay no attention to sturge. elks bugle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VHxRoEE5bE

however, it's getting harder and harder these days to find a horn big enough.

Rest easy, Pat; I'm no lizard, though I can't speak for the rest of the male population.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/09/senate.lieberman/

Here's Harry!! "Lieberman can still help Dem's,Reid says"

"Socially moderate governors...offer a path out of the political wilderness."

Ah, Craig, but the righteous path is very, very narrow on social issues according to the right-wingers who have high-jacked the GOP. Do you really think they are going to let that happen?

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/story/55522.html

"Can a $100 billion stimulus save a $14 Trillion economy?"

One undisputable fact -

Bush has been the Number one factor in a developing a diverse Cultural government.
Both by his actions in his running of the Government and selections.

And his lack of action to allow failed fiscal policy which created the number one election issue

http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/archives/2008/11/10742_transition_rumi.html

Here's some interesting bits on possible security appointment's in an Obama Administration....

For the millionth time, religious interests haven't hi-jacked the GOP, corporate-controlled politicians who exploit the concerns of the religious interests have hi-jacked the GOP.

odd thing about obama's press conference
15 men''one women on stage with him
guess they needed someone to serve the
coffee and doughnuts

Tom,

Since Jason posted a picture of himself, I decided I should as well. I remember you having requested I do so. Here:

http://www.motherjones.com/photos/2007/11/tanaka.html

Nuclear power plants smaller than a garden shed and able to power 20,000 homes will be on sale within five years, say scientists at Los Alamos, the US government laboratory which developed the first atomic bomb.

The miniature reactors will be factory-sealed, contain no weapons-grade material, have no moving parts and will be nearly impossible to steal because they will be encased in concrete and buried underground.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/nov/09/miniature-nuclear-reactors-los-alamos

And now the Ironic element – Actions do not speak louder - Words just Words are much louder then action

2 Points:

Bush had the most diverse White House and created the opportunity that follows.

And in individual practice – Environmental reality – Bush by action has been much more responsible then his contemporary ie AlGore – Can I sell you more offsets Mr Gore?

Tony -- Interesting article in Mother Jones -- I'd like to see Witt take over at DHS. He ran FEMA effectivily.

Champ -- nice picture....ROFL....

mqw -- I think Obama will be very careful to make his top appointments diverse. He's too smart to do anything else. Or I hope so....

W's admin: Diverse? Yes. Competent? Not so much.
A bunch of folks who, despite gender and ethnicity, followed orders.

"Bush had the most diverse White House"

Bush did have a diverse crowd, Ping, and that's why I think Obama will. He would HATE to see headlines reading that Bush offered more diversity than did he.

For those interested- "Why Has Hero John McCain Not Risen To Sarah Palin's Defense"
http://theamericansentinel.com/2008/11/08/why-has-hero-john-mccain-not-risen-to-sarah-palins-defense/

I know his press secretary did, but just the same I'm glad someone poised the question.

Good article, Sea -- and I LOVE this threat:

"For sure, we need to know ALL the names of McCain’s staff so that we can ensure that they do not get near the next candidate."

Palin's answer about why they lost was pretty good. She said that Americans just asked themselves how the country went broke and lost a war under Republicans. You can't get more blunt than that.

I am a Democrat and I admire and respect Jindal. He is a Republican leader that can go toe-to-toe with a Barack or Democratic leader. So he believes in exorcism, so does the Catholic church and priests who excell in exorcising demons.

Sea - Thanks - nice link...
Now we know what happened for Barack when the attacks started. This might be the best thing for Sarah - and her response so far has been outstanding - most people will like what they see as they grow to know her.

Of course given those exceptions here that will fall for the folly or stir it up

Common misconception regarding Jindal: He used to do a lot of EXERCISING in college. Gotta stay in shape.

If people on this board or any other want to find Republican demons, they have a big bunch from which to choose. And I'd suggest Grover Norquist and his ilk who have been pushing the "starve the beast" theory. They are explicit about breaking the financial back of the government being the way to get rid of "entitlement" programs. If we can get over Sarah Palin's red shoes and start taking that crowd apart we might actually do something important.

"If George Bush wins , I'm moving to Canada."

Remember that nugget of wisdom ? I've been wondering where the GORDOs can migrate. Now we have an answer - Poland ;

" "The black messiah of the new left has crushed the Republican candidate John McCain, and America will soon pay a high price for this quirk of democracy," he added.

"Obama is an approaching catastrophe. This marks the end of white man's civilisation," he said in an address." ..............
Artur Gorski of the opposition Law and Justice (PiS) party told parliament last week.

"Gorski later apologised, saying his comments were strictly political, not racist."
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/news/2008/11/polish_govt_says_anti-obama_la.php

"So he believes in exorcism, so does the Catholic church and priests who excel in exorcising demons. "

Absolutely true. But it will be brought up, just as that witchcraft protection prayer was. There's a lot of bizarre ritual in any religion, and the Vatican owns a lot of it. (Nothing personal to the Catholic crowd....)

Poland is a good place for Gordo....historically, you couldn't find many more conspiracies and palace intrigue.

Circuit City files for bankruptcy -

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE4A936V20081110

So lets wait and see what the Republicans do... And they should go it slow....

Now for Pres Elect Obama--- I know two of the most important influences and advisors that he should pay attention - And that would be his daughters.

His eyes will open now that he leaves the Chicago Compound - He should want to protect his Parental rights - and maybe each of these causes he will think as a Father and not as a captive to a liberal community.

" protect his Parental rights - and maybe each of these causes he will think as a Father and not as a captive to a liberal community."

Be specific, use examples.

"Now if there is a pattern (a la Palin) that is quite different. "

Be specific, use examples.

The German newspaper Bild published never-before-seen architectural plans of the Auschwitz extermination camp on Saturday that reveal, in their unequivocally marked sections, that everyone involved in the operation of Auschwitz knew full well that it was intended for the systematic extermination of human beings, the paper said.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1225910066286&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

"But I have never seen anyone here attack Jindal for his political views -- they just throw "exorcism" into their comment."

If you had actually read and comprehended what I said, you'd know I was saying that it would be USED against him.

Sea, from the last thread:
"sociopath [(soh-see-uh-path, soh-shee-uh-path)]
Someone whose social behavior is extremely abnormal. Sociopaths are interested only in their personal needs and desires, without concern for the effects of their behavior on others. (Compare psychopath.)" Posted by: oldseahag | November 10, 2008 1:06 AM

May I add they have no conscience Sea. Although it is intrinsic to your definition, I think it's important to point it out.

If you were referring to what I think you were referring to, I've thought that for many, many months now.

Now I need to catch up with today's thread.

The Fed in a move to protect the very very few... Now gives very young girls protection on their medical records. So if you are trying to protect your daugther, act as a responable parent and want to have her tested for STD's and know the results- you are in the blind. You are automatically a BAD PARENT and have no rights.

This is simply wrong - and yes - the few need to be protected but it just hides a problem and damages the whole

Also study the impact of the FED with this policy and the impact of Empowerment to these young children. It is the wrong message. Only correlative data at this point but that it may be a contributer to the unhealthy rates.....

A thought on Lieberman

If the Republicans are true to form they will be obstructionist in the Senate. So which Republicans can you peel off to get Obama's agenda passed without Liberman in the mix?

There aren't very many moderate Republicans left.

Jack

Anon- Don't read every post but I haven't seen Gordo say he wants to leave the country. His concerns, as much as you disagree with them, remain concerns for his country that I believe he genuinely loves. I haven't seen him say anything unpatriotic, just questioning the chosen one which is not yet considered unpatriotic.

Patsi- agreed!

mornin' all.

Craig, good post - lord knows SOMEONE better show them the path out of the wilderness unless they want to live off the land for a while.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171690

Ping, words, just words. You leave out one TEENY WEENY little part of your assertion - what has Bush done aside from trying to promote more oil and coal development and use, refuse to enter into international environmental cooperation agreements and roll back pollution standards? (Oh, and news flash - Gore is not a politician in the sense that he hasn't run for anything since 2000. Bush is still in the WH screwing up the country from top to bottom. Good riddance). And btw, Bush followed Clinton's lead on federal appointments. After 12 years of Reagan (Shining City on the Hill) and Bush 41's records of less than 25% "diverse" judicial appointments(106/545), Clinton placed over half "diverse" judicial appointments (194/366). And for his cabinet, Clinton nominated three black men, a black woman and two Hispanic men to join nine white Cabinet nominees -- three of them women. And not everyone agrees with you about Bush's diversity credentials.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200412020010

i think lieberman needs "time out".......surely there are at least enough republicans of moderation to help the dems get over the sixty mark......they, too, might wish to be re-elected......tell lieberman to become a republican and who the hell cares.....he wont be there past HIS next election time, I be sure........

"Sociopath" is probably a consensus......9/11 had some nice posts on that subject a while back.....

Ooops ! Chloe- agreed.

Is your shopping cart in?
And can you repost the link.

Jack, Did you get my email?

"Now if there is a pattern (a la Palin) that is quite different. "

Nothing is more complex than the world's extraction and use energy resources. Plain's repeated chant of "Drill Baby Drill", and "Mine Baby Mine", shows a complete lack of understanding of the issue . It's a throw back to Huey Long's brand of politics.

"Every man a king, but no one wears a crown."

“One of these days the people of Louisiana are going to get good government - and they aren't going to like it.”

"...9/11 had some nice posts on that subject a while back....."

Yes he did Sturge. Miss having him around.

"it may be a contributer to the unhealthy rates..... "

I hate to say this...but I think that many other things contribute to current problems, including incredibly bad parenting.

Hey Chloe, no sadly not. I worked on it for hours yesterday till I was blind only to find out the program I had chosen was too limited in its capabilities. Will be adding more items at end of day but probably not the cart. In the meantime you could email me your order or call. I will be making fresh Turtles on Wednesday. They are great for Thanksgiving!

www.newmoonmagick.net

Ping, you're getting terrible about pontificating on things but not providing links to them. What the hell fed program is providing privacy rights to young girls re: STDs and pregnancy issues that doesn't already exist?

The single most important thing (well, maybe next to keeping children safe) in parent/child relations is communication -- the child's knowledge that they can tell their parents when they are in trouble without being shamed.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171719

sturg, ditto. Screw him - he made his bed...

Sorry, Don't know why it didn't link.
www.newmoonmagick.net

“Hard work is damn near as overrated as monogamy.”
Huey Long

Patsi - And the Government should make no laws that are not fully supportive of your point.. I agree

Off to my evil Capitalistic world to check out what is happening to the BOND Market.... and the impact

OUCH

"The single most important thing (well, maybe next to keeping children safe) in parent/child relations is communication "

Hear Hear!
And one that has to be constantly worked on.

60 votes -

2 votes from Maine
1 vote in PA.

Pogo.......In re Lieb: "Actions have consequences."

“The time has come for all good men to rise above principle.”
Huey Long

You talkin' abaout HIPAA? The Health Insurance Portability and Accssibility ACT of 1996? Many states have laws that do the same thing - even we have them here in East Bumfuck. I don't agree with them as a blanket proposition, but they have their place - and the young girls can always consent to release their records to their parents. Patsi's comments about communication are particularly apt - that's the problem in most cases - kids want to have sex, parents don't want them to, and most parents don't handle the subject worth a damn.

While the shadow from the phenomenal 2005 hurricane season still looms large, Hurricane Paloma has pushed the 2008 season into the record books for a number of reasons:

http://blogs.usatoday.com/weather/2008/11/powerful-paloma.html?loc=interstitialskip

Feeling the Power
http://realclearpolitics.blogs.time.com/2008/11/10/feeling-the-power/

Have a good day.

"That's what I was getting at with the defense of Jindal."

And there is much about Jindal to admire, so we agree on that. And I put his college experience where I put anyone's religious beliefs, their own. The thing I had noticed about Palin before all this hoopla, when she was in fact, at war with Republicans in Alaska, was that her religion didn't seem to have much play in her governing,

And of course, I have always stood at the opposite end on that troopergate thing. No one, ex brother-in-law or not, should be threatening the state governor. And if that person is being protected by someone then that official has to go.

Having said that, I certainly didn't want to see her in office. But no more than I wanted to see most other Republicans.

I am thrilled -- by the way -- that Obama's first order of business appears to be rolling back the Bush exec orders. It's the best news of the season.

But I do not see how people can shrug off any bizarre behavior on the part of some Republican candidates or their families, and call Sarah Palin trash for having a pregnant daughter.

"Don't like anyone being reduced to driveby language."

Then, dog, I don't see how you could have listened to anything throughout this political campaign. Because that's about all it was.

"Don't like anyone being reduced to driveby language."

PS -- you mean like "racist old hag"?

(just kidding....)

Anybody here about the norovirus that has broken out here in Holland? The local college (Hope College) has been closed until Wednesday. Over 400 cases of norovirus.

I'm sure we can all look for and find many examples of bad behavior in others, especially politicians.

If you like to read, there is an in with the late RFK's daughter Kathleen in the latest Reader's Digest. I read part of it at my Mom's. I read part of it. It was sad because she talked a lot about the tragedies her family has gone through. All the people in her family who died way too young.

Thanks for the Newsweek link, dog. I'd seen it and meant to flag that series, then forgot. I just scanned for now, no got it flagged. The interesting thing right off is that Michelle asked if somebody was setting Obama up...good observation on her part. She has an obvious mistrust of the politicos and I think that is a good thing.

*Interview*, I mean.

"There are only 2 rules in tv: Don't swear and don't whip it out." - Krusty the Clown

ROFL Corey!

Someone may have put this up already, but shall we start offering suggestions to the cable channels on what to do to hold their audiences now that the election is over?

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iQSDElWyrvuJ0q6N3mXW5P1pXuiQD94BJ77G0

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171671

Ping,

Arnie and his cigars are a team. He uses them unlit as a prop and lit asa sort of thoughtful pose. He had a tent put up at the capitol so that he would have a place to meet with others outside the no smoking building.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171710

New movie now in limited release:

The Boy In the Striped Pajamas

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0914798/

Corey, hadn't heard of it but wish you well and wash your hands fanatically!

Schwarzenegger is a jerk

http://www.smokersclubinc.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1415

Anyone concerned about Obama's judgment should consider this - Obama has made Lawrence Tribe one of his legal advisors. In my book, that is good judgment.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-11-10-obama-gitmo_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip

I'm beginning to like this guy a little more.

In the nothing new column: What a politician does all the time.

http://tinyurl.com/pissingpeopleoff

Don't take it personal Joe, Philly fans boo their own team.

http://tinyurl.com/phillyfansdobest

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171753

It may be my imagination, but Scarborough has seemed very cranky since the election. He gets all edgy, with little mini-tantrums whenever anyone disagrees with him even mildly.

Maybe they should just put Joe and Chris in a room together and keep whichever one emerges alive. The viewing public can take only so much haranguing in any one day.

The voice of reason rears it's ugly head.

Ugly, you forgot ugly.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171762

Arnie is a brilliant, funny and genuinely thoughtful man.

Jamie, I think Joe doesn't know what to think - he claims he was a conservative democrat before he was a republican, he seems to be socially liberal (contrary to his congressional voting record) and he recognizes that McCain blew it when he chose Palin for VP. All the things he championed when in Congress (cutting taxes and government programs, particularly eliminating the Depts. of Education, Eneergy and HUD) are going to be swept aside. Plus, he's got Mika and Chris to deal with. I'd be snippy, too.

Schwarzenegger is Sarah Palin with less experience.
Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger Only 38 percent of registered voters approve of the Governor's job performance, which is only two points above the Governor's all-time lowest rating. 9/28/08

Schwarznegger only cares about himself and a potential run for the senate.

oldseahag,
"I haven't seen him say anything unpatriotic, just questioning the chosen one which is not yet considered unpatriotic."

The Obama term will be very interesting to watch how criticism and those who deliver/report the criticism of a Black POTUS are portrayed? For example: The comments of Bill Clinton during the primary in SC this year were blown way out of proportion.

"Schwarznegger only cares about himself"

You mean like every other politician?

Anselm- Yes, will be watching, hope it doesn't reach post 9-11 proportions.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171770

Arnold is stuck with a legislature that has gerrymandered itself into cemented districts. It is the worst of both parties with far left at war with far right.

He is trying to govern a state that has about 15 million more people than it can house, has destroyed its best agriculture land and is now using up water like an alcoholic on a major bender. Throw in the great fires of recent history and the costs associated with those disasters any you have an ecological mess.

You have the very wealthy islands amid some of the countries worst poverty. A school system that used to rank as the best in the nation now one of the absolute worst. A population of multiple ethnicities enriches the culture while putting a horrid strain on schools and law enforcement. Drug wars, gang wars, and a rampant illegal immigration are just a few of the proplems.

Those that can are fleeing the state while those that can't grow in numbers. The tax base is collapsing while the needs increase. The state Constitution is a slave to the initiatives and the legislature doesn't help with its way to expensive pet projects and unwillingness to compromise.

Given all the problems totally out of his control, Schwarzennegger has done a very good job. The only reason his popularity is so low is that he has managed to piss off virtually everyone about something while trying to do it.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171688

Champ, my EX~ would love you !!!!

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171699

HEHEHEHEHEH that was really funny.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171769

In exchange for all the entertainment and aggravation that MSNBC has given us over the past several months, not to mention their good taste in employing Craig at regular intervals, I think we should make suggestions about their programming and what we would like to see.

If you were referring to what I think you were referring to, I've thought that for many, many months now.

Now I need to catch up with today's thread.

Posted by: chloe | November 10, 2008 8:19 AM

As weird as many people can be in here, I have yet to find one I could define as a "sociopath" in the classical definition of the word...

Take care

Speaking of California....this was on a friend's blog, and I think worthy of comments. Pogo -- you are a lawyer...thoughts? Craig?:

"The reality is, marriage from a legal standpoint is a civil contract first. You go to the county clerk's office to get a license, first. We have a secular government in this country, and the government's only concern about marriage is from a civil, legal perspective. Issues of property ownership, inheritance, child custody, healthcare benefits, etc. are not religious in nature, they are civil.

We do not exclude any group of citizens from entering into legal contracts. It is unconstitutional to restrict gays and lesbians from entering into a legal contract, just as it was unconstitutional to restrict African Americans from entering into legal contracts with whites. It is absolutely a civil rights issue from this perspective.

Some folks on the right might wish to muddy the waters by bringing religious belief into the argument but the bottom line is, religion has no part in this argument because we have a secular government. We have separation of church and state. Therefore, the government can no more mandate that churches marry gays and lesbians than the church can mandate that the government restrict GLBT people from entering into a legal marriage contract."

Maybe they are talking about George Bush, dog.

And compared to names I've been called here, sociopath is mild.

Or maybe they were talking about this guy:

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/27643324/

A sociopath and a moron. The very worst kind.

" California's recent governors (like 40-50 years) with highest approval ratings? Am guessing Ronald Reagan might have been one of them.... "

Not among the homeless.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171780

Patsi, This is at the heart of the Constitutional argument regarding gay and lesbian relationships as opposed to heterosexual ones.

It is patently discriminatory to force one group of citizens to pay huge sums of money to acquire a set of rights that are given to another group simply by virtue of a marriage license. And even if the restricted group does jump through all the legal hoops that are other rights and privileges denied to them that even a contract cannot grant such as filing a joint tax return.

These very personal "partnerships" should be licenced in the exactly the same way with all the rights and responsibilities that go with that condition. Then if they want to solemnize it in some religious service in front of friends and relatives or just hold a big party, it shouldn't be a matter for the state or law.

Patsi, you are my favourite sociopath !! (ET ducks) :-)

Oh wait, did I mean my favourite socialist?

Nah, you're one of my favourites period. When I first joined the blog, it was you and Jamie who really connected with me. I remember you and I having some private convos regarding Jackie Kennedy and other famous peoples. I think you are clever, strong and witty.

By the way, can I publish your 1980 article in my blogs? I'd like to share it with others.

Tom

P.S. I wasn't challenging Sea or Chloe... I was just not seeing who would qualify as sociopath. Even Gordo doesn't deserve THAT tile :-) Now, paranoic, that's another thing altogether... xoxoxo

ET -- I'll proudly be your favorite sociopathic socialist!

(Sure put the 1980 thing up....it does tend to remind one that this is an old fight. Not to mention it reinforces that even all those years ago, I was willing to take a stand on behalf of a (gasp!) Republican woman.)

Sociopaths here? Never. Other words come to mind at times, but never sociopath.

Schwarzenegger is like Palin and so was Reagan

Brown spoke condescendingly of Reagan's inexperience and ridiculed his film career. But he was no match for Reagan's homespun magnetism. The Reagan campaign capitalized on popular anger at student demonstrations on the Berkeley campus of the University of California, and it portrayed Brown as an old-fashioned politician out of touch with the people. Reagan, in contrast, presented himself as an ordinary citizen fed up with politics and committed to making government more efficient and accountable. He defeated Brown in a landslide.

Handing over the White House

The US President-elect, Barack Obama, is to visit the White House with his family at the invitation of outgoing President George W Bush.
During the visit Mr Obama, wife Michelle and their two young daughters, Sasha and Malia, will be given a personal tour by Mr Bush. The Republican incumbent, whose policies Mr Obama frequently criticised on the campaign trail, has appeared keen to smooth the transition to power for his Democratic successor.

But it hasn't always been like this. Here is a look at some of the trickier transitions.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/us_elections_2008/7719862.stm

I am off to watch THE WEAKEST LINK , original version.

Corey, did you read the comment I sent you re: the birthday gift that made you feel so bad?

Patsi, I hope we get to meet someday! Maybe you and Tony can both come and visit ;-)

Tom

heck bring Jamie too !!!

Patsi, as if you didn't know - it's a complicated subject. I'm just noodling here, but the "contract" view of marriage is fairly recent legally. Marriage has evolved legally, and relatively rapidly in the past 50-100 years from what was once little more than a state sanction of a religious rite (there were actually parallel paths, e.g. Justice of the Peace marriages), but the state's role has been largely administrative, and the staate laws governing who can/can't marry, etc. are deeply rooted in and largely preserving the traditional notions of one man-one woman marriage found in Judeo-Christian religion. Of course, the notion of equality is a fairly recent one as well, but I digress. While the argument that it is unconstitutional for the state to deny man-man, woman-woman couples the rights and privileges available to man-woman marriages is pretty much a matter of state law to this point (thus, MA and CA STATE COURT decisions that denial of those rights was unconstitutional, then CA changed its constitution), there is always the possibility that a case could rise through the federal courts challenging a state constitution's violation of federal equal rights - if someone can figure a way to get around the fact that states aren't subject to suits like those (sovereign immunity, ya know). Considering the makeup of the SCOTUS, I wouldn't expect it to be a successful challenge. The contractual rights angle isn't one that strikes me as particularly strong, since contractual rights as peculiarly a creature of law that is subject to state limitations. I mean, why one man, one woman as opposed to multiple partners? If you take the religious angle out, it's wholly arbitrary.

"Maybe you and Tony can both come and visit ;-) "

ROFL, Tom -- Tony would be my best looking date in about a decade....

On popular California governors, I would vote for Pat Brown, Sr. He owned the job for 18 years.during what was one of California's true "golden" eras from 1959 to 1967. Some rotten things happened while he was governor, but over all he was good for the state.

He was followed by Reagan who, while popular with a large part of the population, was very bad for the state as a whole and set it on a downward spiral that it has never truly recovered from.

Isn't PEOTUS Obama opposed to gay marriages? I think he is in favor of civil unions, but not gay marriages.

"He was followed by Reagan who, while popular with a large part of the population, was very bad for the state as a whole and set it on a downward spiral that it has never truly recovered from."

Kind of like what happened with the country...huh?

I spent a day with Maureen Reagan during her father's first campaign. (She knew I was voting for Carter and didn't question it.) But she talked a lot about the businessmen who thought they would control her dad. She said she hoped they would be surprised that he couldn't be controlled.

"I mean, why one man, one woman as opposed to multiple partners? If you take the religious angle out, it's wholly arbitrary."

As long as it is consenting adults, why would that be a problem? A lot of societies swear by the practice.

October 2, 2008 Vice-Presidential Debate in St. Louis, Missouri

IFILL: Let's try to avoid nuance, Senator. Do you support gay marriage?

BIDEN: No. Barack Obama nor I support redefining from a civil side what constitutes marriage. We do not support that. That is basically the decision to be able to be able to be left to faiths and people who practice their faiths the determination what you call it.

Meant to type 8 rather than 18 for Pat Brown. Here is the whole list

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Governors_of_California

Patsi, Maureen was a truly class act who died way too young.

OT:
New Bamiyan Buddha find amid destruction

BAMIYAN, Afghanistan (AFP) – "We got him!" screamed Afghan archaeologist Anwar Khan Fayez as he leapt from the pit beneath the towering sandstone cliffs, where the Bamiyan Buddhas once stood.

Seven years after Taliban militants blew up the two 1,500-year-old statues in a fit of Islamist zealotry, a French-Afghan team in September uncovered a new, 19-metre (62-foot) "Sleeping Buddha" buried in the earth.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20081109/wl_sthasia_afp/afghanistanarchaeologybuddhismunrest_081109053934;_ylt=AkoInZxkw2JM8.19TF5JNMcUewgF

Speaking of:

"When asked by Chris Wallace what "conservative solutions" the GOP would bring to their current minority-party status, Pence said social issues like "the sanctity of marriage" will remain the backbone of the Republican platform."

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/GOP_leader_Rebuild_party_based_on_1109.html

Marriage ------I wear the pants around here!

Wearing the pants in the family.....
A young man was about to get married and his father wanted to give him some fatherly advise....he said, son on your wedding night when you are getting ready for bed, you tell her like I told your mama 25 years ago when we got married, I took off my pants and handed them to her and told her to try these on.....she took them and tried them on and said, I can't wear them they are too big and he said and don't you forget it, I wear the pants in this family and we have been happy ever since....so the young man decided to use his dad's system and on his wedding night, he took off his pants and gave them to his new wife and said tp her try these on and she took them and tried them on and handed them back to him saying I can't wear these they are too big and he said and don't you forget it I wear the pants in this family so she took off her panties and
threw them at him and said put these on, he took them and said these are too small I can't get into your panties....and she said "and you never will if you don't change your
friggin attitude"....

Postal Unions won't like this, but they can't do much about it. Strike won't work, they tried that once and the president at the time said he would bring in the military to deliver the mail.

http://www.ksla.com/global/story.asp?s=9247633

RezDog- I tossed it out last night as just a little food for thought. Read the thread if you like. As for Chloe's comment this morning, I can only surmise who she meant I won't put names in her mouth,

Does Putin see the Obama victory in the same light as a retired coach returning to his old job believing he has an easy schedule? Is this why Putin is talking about returning as president?

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=081109233753.lmtu9caj&show_article=1

Too much Chocolate osh? :-)

Now I wish I lived in Virginia. Terry McAuliff running for governor. That will be a fun campaign.

A very thorough scrubbing. No traces can even be found at http://www.archive.org/, you would normally find some traces of a web site, but not in this case.

http://washingtontimes.com/news/2008/nov/11/exclusive-obama-deletes-agenda-from-transition-web/

A condom only reduces the chances, they do not prevent the chances. Abstinence, prevents both.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601070&sid=aKrIK33ovrk8&refer=politics.

jamie, I agree - anyone who doesn't think we dems (I don't mean you and me :-)) aren't hypocrites on the issue should think back to the thrumming we gave Mitt Romney over the issue. I personally have found it challenging enough to try and be married to one woman at a time (and I imagine my spouses have foundn it challenging enough to be married only to me)... I can't imagine why anyone would want to multiply the complications.

Jamie,
"Now I wish I lived in Virginia. Terry McAuliff running for governor. That will be a fun campaign."

Wouldn't it help if he was likable and not so condescending?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171817

LOL. Condoms on the other hand are a real world solution that work very well when they are used, and they are a whole lot cheaper than AIDS drugs. Abstinence - works when it is used - right up until kids hit puberty. No amount of education keeps kids (and adults) from screwing.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171817

A condom used properly pretty much minimizes any chances of HIV transmission. Human nature is such that mistakes are made or safety disregarded. But if we use your argument Anselm (and it has some validity), we can demand total sexual abstinence country-wide. HIV is only one danger from sexual activity. Pregnancy is often dangerous so perhaps everyone should abstain in order never to get pregnant. Smoking is dangerous, so everyone should be forced to not smoke. Obesity is dangerous, so all fast food restaurants and pre-packaged foods could be forbidden. Drinking creates a myriad of health problems so spirits could once again be prohibited. Cars are deadly, so maybe everyone should abstain and rely on public transport. Since high speeds are dangerous perhaps the maximum speed limit should be 30 !!!

Anyone else want to add to the list of what we should abstain from to maintain health and safety

Anselm,

"The 25 agenda items are still available on Mr. Obama's campaign site."

Just exactly what is your beef?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171821

Well pogo, enforced castration could be instituted to ensure no sexual activity happens. Abstinence saves lives !!

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171823

His beef is that he is a Republican who dislikes the Democratic party. I understand because I feel the same way about his party. It's the nature of the beast.

No, I hardly ever eat it. Just little nibbles. But I screw up every time on the dogs and the pogo ping pongs.

Terry McAuliffe and Global Crossing. Oh for the good old days.

http://www.judicialwatch.org/archive/newsletter/2002/0402a.shtml

I sort of feel sorry for Sarah Palin. She was thrust in this campaign with virtually no background and suddenly the eyes of America were focussed on her. I disagree with her politics, but I find her comments over the ticket loss to be pretty correct and honest.

I believe this link has already appeared, but it's worth reading:

Palin: GOP ticket was too ‘status quo’

laska Gov. Sarah Palin said Sunday that she and running mate John McCain lost because the Republican ticket “represented too much of the status quo.”

In an interview with the Anchorage Daily News posted on the paper’s site Monday morning, Palin pointed a finger at the Bush administration for souring the GOP brand, adding that it was “amazing” that the McCain campaign did as well as it did.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1108/15474.html

"Maureen was a truly class act who died way too young. "

yes, indeed, Jamie.

"....and she said "and you never will if you don't change your
friggin attitude"...."

ROFL, Solar.

"Terry McAuliff running for governor."

There's one campaign I won't be donating to....

ET, you're missing Anselm's point - it ain't about letting people know what will and what won't work, and it ain't about doing good, it's about telling people how to live their lives and saying "See, I told you so" when they don't follow the way of the Puritans. And it ain't about giving people things that will make their lives better, it is about depriving them of those things that aren't part of their moralistic agenda but that would do much more to prevent the horrible effects of not following their way than their way can ever do, and making yourself look like a great, caring guy in the process.

OSH - "the dogs and the pogo ping pongs??"

Do what?

Well in the early days of the AIDS discovery, it was just that.. :"told you so, you filthy, horrible homosexuals. This is God's judgement... " blah blah blah...

I agree with what you are saying Pogo, and I am just playing Devil's advocate. If we are going to continue on "protecting" people, why not take it outside of just the regular obsession of regulating normal sexual behavior? That's my point, and my post is basically tongue-in-cheek. But maybe we could create a fun list anyway.

Oh yeah and the photo of Arnold there is a good one... I say no more. :D

It just seem every time I post to either one of the dogs or you or pingpong I screw up the name somehow. Sincerely sorry, no disrespect intended.

Would it help if I reported that Gay marriages in The Netherlands, Belgium and Spain has not spelled the decline of Western civilization? I often wonder how the hell so many Americans have become obsessed with sexuality in a negative way. I am grateful that this hateful divide is not rearing its ugly head in Belgium. I feel less American every day because the fundamentalist "values" run counter to what I felt the founding of America stood for.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

Those precious words speak to my heartfelt vision of what America is and what s/he most always stand for...

One more question... how is it possible to vote against people rights by majority rule when the U.S. Constitution was instituted to protect the minority from majority opinion?

none taken - was just curious. this may help - dog is a canine, pogo is a possum (or up & down - take your choice), ping pong is back and forth. Well, maybe that doesn't help much. Oh, well. :-)

ET - I was kidding. Besides, I think republicans love to do the things they tell you you can't.

No amount of education keeps kids (and adults) from screwing.

Well education is a factor with the proper use of condoms, you do need to know how to read the instructions. Many an adult has tried to put them on backwards. So you can understand in the heat of the battle in the back seat reading the fine print for proper use my not top little Johnny's or Jane's list of things to do. Of course if your kids start having sex at the age of 12, then by 16 they should be experts on the proper use of condoms. But lets not forget oral sex which is very popular among middle school, high school age teenagers. Obviously the teenage girl can't get pregnant but she sure as hell can contract HIV, or any number of other STD's. Teenagers these days just can't seem to remember to bring their oral dam with them.

The whole oral-ain't-sex idea has always amazed me. I remember even back in my day (dinosaur time) that guys would try that line. And in the music business....well, it's the 11th commandment of guys on the road.

LOL - There are instructions? I never read the instructions - seemed to me to be pretty self-explanatory. I've offered to use the old banana trick to show LP how to use a condom - he's 11 and he wants to know.

The oral sex angle is true enough - my how things change. It seems that we agree that education is a factor - but it is not sufficient. I still scratch my head over the concept of a dental dam - i would think a flavored condom would be preferable, but I wouldn't know about that. STDs really can take a lot of the fun out of sex.

I am grateful that this hateful divide is not rearing its ugly head in Belgium.

Are gays welcome in Germany, Italy, Great Britain?

ET,

Been doing more research on my move overseas, and I just learned as an American living and working abroad I can write off the first $85,000. In other word I don't have to pay taxes on anything I make under $85,000!!! I am sure you know this but housing is included in that figure. What kind of apartment can I rent for $2,000 a month?

I don't know - I just found this column by Nick Kristoff funny.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/09/opinion/09kristof.html?em

I don't know either, pogo -- in the piece, Kristoff reminds me of a fellow student in my college honors program. He was a philosophy major. I was a history major. He talked and talked and talked. Usually about things that could be summed up fairly succinctly. And he couldn't stand me. I once asked the professor why the guy was so hostile to me. He said, "Because he takes such pride in being a serious intellectual, and hates knowing that a funny chick in a sorority jacket is as smart as he is."

Patsi, HEHEHEH.As an English major, polysci & philosophy minor, I knew plenty of those types. I drank beer with them at the Chukker and listened to their ramblings while I tried to get laid. They were self satisfied - I had different ideas about satisfaction.

Miriam Makeeba has died after collapsing on stage

http://www.comcast.net/articles/music/20081110/EU.Obit.Makeba/

You Tube is either down or overcrowded so I couldn't pull up some performances.

Anselm

McAuliff is brilliant, funny and successful. Sometimes that can lead to condescension I don't imagine he suffers fools too well.

Pogo, Patsi
This jumped out at me.

"Perhaps John Kennedy was the last president who was unapologetic about his intellect and about luring the best minds to his cabinet"

And remember they were the ones who lead us into Vietnam.

Jack

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171843

Anselm yes in Germany, somewhat so in Great Britain, and sadly not so much in Italy except in the private chambers of the Vatican itself...
http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/10/13/gay.monsignor.ap/

I need to make a small correction... In Nederland, which was the first land to have official Gay marriages, there was some controversy in the beginning. In Catholic Belgium we also ran into a few roadblocks but the VLD Prime Minister Guy Verhofstadt was determined to see it through. The biggest problems was issues of "personal morality" whereas some public servants did not want to issue gay marriage licenses. Some were moved to other jobs, some had nothing done. In my opinion, if you work in a secular job for all the people, and you cannot follow the law, you should be OUT and OUT immediately.. (not out of the closet, out of the job) ;-)

Anselm, I cannot answer your question re: taxes. I know there was some sort of loophole, which they tried to cap (and may try again) but I have never attempted to not pay the taxes. It's my intention to permanently live here, so I pay the taxes as any other member of my host country would. Also I should mention that I am in the process of seeking Belgian citizenship....

Anselm, re: apartment costs... I don't know that either. My apartment is around 450 euro a month, but it's an older apartment that not in the best condition. I have friends in Amsterdam who pay 1200 euro a month and they have a NICE place... both Americans. Although I am a business owner, I do not make an enormous salary... Right now my priority is building pensions for my retirement.

All this talk of sociopathy reminds me, I need to take a couple of mornings off and see if I can kill something.

Bambi on the BBQ,

Don't get no better than that.

Jack

Back to work

Later,

Jack

Jack, and the Bush dolts lead us into Iraq.

Patsi, only the 11th commandment? I got the feeling it was re-ordered for them :-D

But, actually oral sex has very minor risk for HIV transmission. A little factoid... If someone is planning to "do the service" s/he should make sure they have healthy gums and no open mouth sores. Also, I'd recommend doing no flossing of gums or brushing of teeth at least a couple hours before.... uh... contact is made.

Also it is a fact that HIV is a fragile entity. The power of stomach acids will kill the virus... HOWEVER... you must also recognize that having an ulcer or any other disorder, could be a major problem.

"Many sexually transmitted infections (STIs) such as gonorrhea, herpes, hepatitis B, HIV, syphilis, Chlamydia, chancroid, and HPV can be transmitted through oral-genital contact. In addition, while herpes virus type 2 has historically been found to infect the genital region, herpes virus type 1, most commonly found in the region of the mouth, is now appearing in the genital region. Oral sex has been identified as a significant factor in this transmission. HIV transmission is possible via oral sex, but is extremely rare. "

http://www.stateuniversity.com/blog/permalink/College-Students-and-Oral-Sex-What-You-Need-to-Know.html

In other words, HIV is horrible, but so are many other sexually transmitted diseases which don't get enough attention by educators and the public at large.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171795

Hey Tom
I would love to meet you sometime,Patsi too and of course Jamie.Oh the laughs,I think you all would be a riot to hangout with! HA HA..Fun,Fun,Fun...I think my IQ would jump a few notches.....

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171798

Hey Patsi
Thank you for that!! I would be honored!

I read this morning that when Mrs. Eisenhower was showing Jackie Kennedy around the White House for the first time that Jackie was very prenant and visibly tired. Mrs. Eisenhower neglected to tell her that there was a wheelchair at the White House that she could have used. When someone asked Mrs. Eisenhower why she failed to tell Jackie Kennedy about the availability of a wheelchair, Mrs Eisenhower replied, "She never asked."

Miriam Makeeba - The "click" song

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHxkiXALQjU

Miriam Makeeba with Paul Simon singing her most famous song, "Pata Pata"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MB26L8nbRiw

Palin has had numerous requests for interviews since the election ended. If she wanted to fade away gracefully, the media wouldn't let her. It would probably be worse for her if she turned down every interview request.

What a great economy - the bright spots are Wal mart and McDonalld's. I suppose that should tell me something...

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/business/AP-McDonalds-Sales.html

Tom, my Mom read aloud some of that book that I disliked. In jest, I repeated some of what she read aloud to my sister. Everything I repeated to my sister she said she already knew. Well, that proved my point of that book being ,ostly about common sense. What good is it if it tells people things they already knew?

Jack, that would be "led". (I be a moron sometimes.)

Pogo,
This is an awesome economy to start a new business.
Expand while everyone else is whining and pulling back....

Ahhh, but what kind of business - therein lies the rub. (A chef friend tole me NEVER open a restaurant if you like to eat).

told - damn typos

Cheap, good food always does well but especially so during a downturn.....I'm in international/domestic transport and manufacturing....it is still pretty good down here in the gulf....the energy sector is still going strong.....If you'll look where most of the downturn is you'll see it's in the same places it always is....primarily heavily unionized manufacturing areas..

Well, gotta go feed LP's tapeworm before basketball tryouts.

Manana

I find myself agreeing with most of the things said today,,and thought that a little joke about marriage was in order,,,,,,there is however some thoughts about what patd and champ were talking about----but decided to leave it for another time

Good luck Jack and hope you fill the freezer!

"I drank beer with them at the Chukker and listened to their ramblings while I tried to get laid. They were self satisfied - I had different ideas about satisfaction."

ROFL, Pogo. There are many paths to wisdom.

when something scares me my natural reaction is anger'' is this the basis for the media and democrats
ongoing palin bashing ' are they scared of palin'?
is she going to be a threat in 2012'are they already
anticipating a failed obama presidency' a one term
for obama' getting head start just in case

Patsi-the teen prenancy thing could be fixed with the whole parent/child communication you mentioned earlier. Esecially with older teens like 17 and 18. it's called taking your kid to get proper birth control when they decide to become sexually active.

How many bailouts/handouts does this make for the car companies....???? They had their chances...many times over.....I think the time has come to let them go...

hey jaxtrader say your on the gulf
i'm here @convent la. just dropped 35loads of grain
picking up northbound tow '
might be one bright spot in the economy'the farmers had a good year' they are loading grain barges
as fast as they can from natchez ms .to st louis'
all the towboats are busy as they can be right now

mqw,
My boats are running the Gulf Intracoastal.
Between Brownsville and Mobile. Based in Houston.
Enjoy the volume now...it's gonna be slow in 60 days...

Teen pregnancy happens, even to kids who you least expect it to happen to.

jaxtrader
i don't run the canal or icw''have a friend works for delaware marine and another one works for golding
out west'' strictly LMR man myself

" Esecially with older teens like 17 and 18. it's called taking your kid to get proper birth control when they decide to become sexually active."

Absolutely, Rosie. And even if by chance a kid slipped up and got pregnant because of a broken condom or whatever, hopefully they have the kind of relationship where they could easily talk to the parents without fear.

One of my daughter's classmates got pregnant her senior year. She was an honor student, president of the class and a cheerleader. Her parents stood by her and together they made the decision to have the baby. They stood with her through college and law school, and she is a very successful woman now. But the decision about what to do was hers. Her parents are to be commended.

My parents kept up a good dialog with my sister and me. They always meet our dates, and talked to us if relations became more serious. It's very true that they will wait (at least longer than the first couple of dates). My sister and I were lucky to have parents that were involved.

The guys will wait, I mean, if they really like you.

A friend of my oldest niece got pregnant when she was a junior in high school. The rumor of her pregnancy spread very fast. My sister asked her Mom about the rumor and her Mom got pissed at my sister. She couldn't believe my sister would believe such a rumor. Turns out, her daughter was pregnant, she just hadn't told her yet. She later apologized to my sister. Luckily, everything turned out fine. She had the baby and she and her boyfriend got married recently.

FYI- A lot of folks up here are pissed 'cos Bristol's(is it Bristol or Willow?) boyfriend dropped out of highschool and got a job working on the Northern Slope. Now, that is a very, very cherrie job, but everbody else that works there has to have a HS deploma. Not even a ged can get you a job on the slope.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171876

I doubt that is so Mqw... but hey, I Could be wrong...

Patsi--Rosie

I agree with the both of u about the parent/child communications,,,,buuuut,,i have a sister in Atlanta that raised her children--2 girls in a very strict and religious way----they over did it, in the sense that even after high school she would have them in by 11-13 after dates,,well anyway she would not let up with the religion all the time for breakfast, lunch, and dinner ( just another way that religion ruins families) the two girls left one day and never came back home---after being married they called my sister and her husband, to let them know where they were living,,about six months later they got together----all my sister was interested in was if they got married in the church------they live in diff states,,,as does the brother---he is a detective in chicago---while golfing, and having a cpl of beers, i can tell that he knows that his parents will never change as long as they remain true to their ideas of religion---she is another sister lost----not dead but,she feels that she doesn't need anyone except her bible,,,when we see each other at weddings etc...we hug and say the most superficial things ----she does not think that i am worth talking to cos i don't believe in the catholic faith---so i think that one should talk to their children from the moment that they are born, as an individual, with mentoring all along the way,,some discipline, but if u forgert that they are people too that make their own choices, some good, some bad, just like u did when u were young, then that is when thing start to turn for the worst--i am by no means saying that they should do what they want,,,just have try to know when to let live a little on their ---if u did your job right u got nothing to worry about??? if u r a screw up---well they got it from u???

Rosie, it pays to have good contacts... I wonder if the teens will still be getting married..

ET-If he wants to keep his sweet new job they will.
Solar-My dad is very religious, but he trusted my sister and me to use our good judgment, part of which was being able to talk to the parents when we needed to without worryng about being beat.

hey all, just wanted to let you know that i'm dropping in now and then, and, as always, enjoying your discussion. but for the next few weeks i might not be as interactive as usual due to this exteremely pressing book deadline. must write about 70,000 words by Dec. 1

Just get Bethy and Solar to help. Between the two of 'em, you'll get it done easy:)

We know a married couple, one is jewish the other is catholic,,,they have 2 gills and one boy,, all three are grown up and in their last years in college ,,,they decided not to raise them within the jewish or catholic faith------they are some of the most interesting, respectful, young people that u can be around,,,i always fell a little bad when we leave them, and look forward to the next time that we see each other-----they don't understand what the big deal is about religion-----they know what it is---what is really a pleasure to see is the way that they communicate with their parents,,,,wonderful,,thanks

70,000 words? That's like 70 pictures!

He im sensitive

November 10, 1975. The Edmund Fitzgerald disappeared during a storm on Lake Superior.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_8s2zsNhSM

Hey im sensitive

Craig,

Once we get past the first of the year, let us know your speaking schedule and book promotion dates and locations.

The we can start trying to put together a meeting or meetings for the crowd.

US is victim of nerve gas attack.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-Chemical-Weapons.html

Oh, wait, that's just one of ours leaking.

Patsi, I have dedicated my life to the pursuit of enlightenment. :-)

1. Sorry I'm late. Did I miss anything ?

2. If it weren't sex, why would we call it 'oral SEX' ???

3. Sweetie and I shall be travelling for a month or so, and attempting avoid the tubes, both boob and internet. Co-incidence, Craig ?

4. I hope that by the time I get back dink cheney will have found the WMDs he let rumdumb sell Iraq in the '80s, and that GORDO will have found that missing birth certificate, upon which rests the peace of mind of this entire galaxy.

You can look north to positive gay marriage legislation as well.. Marriage laws are provincial jurisdictions, however, legally (for tax and spousal benefits purposes) we are all now in civil unions, whether opposite sex or same. A wedding, or a marriage for that matter, is a religious rite. We also decriminalized marajuana, so at the next gay wedding I attend, I shall light up a spliff at the reception to celebrate! (I'm kidding)

XR, they found them in Kentucky and Virginia. See, just like they said, they knew where they were all along.

Have a good trip.

Oh, and good point on the oral sex thing - always struck me as sex.

"My sister and I were lucky to have parents that were involved.'

Same here, Rosie.

70,000 words in three weeks? Holy crap!

Rosie -- re Bristol and the boyfriend. They'll probably end up divorced no matter. But you know what, the world will go on. I have many friends who married as teenagers, pregnant or not. Few are still married to that person.

God! What a tightrope to walk between 'involved' and 'overbearing'. I'm glad I never had children. It would have sucked if the 'parents curse' of 'I hope you hae kids just like you!', had hit me. Blah!

pogo writes 70000 words to Gordo every day; you should be fine.

Edmund Fitzgerald

several years ago I had the fortune to meet, on a usenet group, a lady who was a reporter in the upper penisula, She was just out of college and with her first reporter job.
she was one of the first reporters to cover the story. She wrote this about the experience.

It's a good read

http://members.peak.org/~kightp/scribble/fitz.html

Jack

at least Pogo makes sense and they are his own words...

GORDO spews spurious websites by right-wing nut cases who search for any sort of conspiracy theories because the Dems are back in power again.

Oh BOO HOO HOO...

I'm impressed by the restraint employed in not linking to that awful Edmund Fitzgerald song on youtube. Someone will eventually, I'm sure.

oh and re: teens, parenting and sex...

I'm not sure how mr tylenol and i did it, but in the age of Brittany, Christina, Buffy, and a host of others, our daughters grew up just fine. They're both adults now, but after much consideration, i've decided that how your kids turn out is about 50% parenting and 50% pure blind luck, cos at some point, their friends and peers mean more to them than we do. Ya can only hope that what ya said meant something, and that they'll come to you when things are rocky (even better, when things are great!)

Interesting little aside: you can sing the star spangled banner to the tune of the Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald.

Gordo's assertions are more valid than the refutations of them. Obama's hiding something. You know it, I know it, everybody knows it. Won't make a difference either way.

Psst
Champ here.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171900

Jack

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171922

Champ, bitter? Table for 1?

Actually why don't you and GORDO work together on the deep dark manchurian candidate? Now there's change YOU can really believe in.

And this is especially for you...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99rOzMVtcx4

Gordon Lightfoot is great !!!

LOL Jack. I should have known better.

LOL@ET

Tom,

Your mom.

It's a masochistic thing Corey.

Champ, can you explain "your mom"?

Am I missing something?

So if a Democrat was the worst candidate, you'd still support him or her. Says a lot.

Oh! It's a "I WANT TO SEE HER GET HER ASS KICKED IN 2012!" thing? That's not very nice.

That'd be like me saying "I hope Obama screws things up even worse than Bush did, so people can see he was a fraud."

I only resort to saying things like that for sports teams.

Champ, some people only vote party line. My Mom told me that my Grandfather was staunch Democrat. He died at age 63 when I was 4, so I didn't know him that well. I voted for two Republicans in this last election. Sam Reed, Washington State's Secretary of State whom I find an honorable and non-partisan man, and I voted for awesome Marcia McGraw (Republican) for Lieutenant Governor against socially conservative Brad Owen whom I think is a total shit.

Here's a little write up about Marcia and I am always happy to vote for women in leadership positions as long as they aren't right wing nutcases.

"http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Content?oid=729189
Marcia McCraw, the Republican running for lieutenant governor, isn’t your typical Washington State Republican. This summer, the 54-year-old Ballard resident partied at both Sturgis and Burning Man. She supports gay marriage and wants to legalize marijuana. And she received a 100-percent rating from NARAL Pro-Choice Washington."

Champ, some people only vote party line.

Posted by: EuroTom Author Profile Page | November 10, 2008 7:15 PM

I refer to such people as "assholes".

The best version of the national anthem IMHO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RcxiP7fZM8

Well my Grandfather wasn't an asshole. He was a hard working man. I think he was probably staunch Democrat because of the Great Depression. But I don't know... I think he was born in 1899. He was 13 years older than my Gram who died in 1999 and who I miss incessantly.

Parents should also warn their children about commercial sex abuse as early as possible. Children need to know that the people who are used in porn, stripping, and prostitution are being hurt by their pimps. Boys especially should learn early that looking at porn images is exploiting victims, and that the money spent on porn funds the recruitment of more victims. Every adult should know that porn is nothing but the visual record of prostituted people at work - the most dangerous work in America. The life expectancy of prostituted women is less than 50 years.

champ,

Dems are the worst candidates when there are no republicans, libertarians, independentists, reformites or nadirs in the race.

For Pete's sake.. the election is over.. can ya all just can it??? I swear it's worse than kindergarten.

I have one more YouTube link for folks...

Cher sans Sonny working with Nilsson on "A Love Like Yours" and solo singing "Baby, I love you" both produced by Phil Spector, recorded circa 1974 or 1975.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ypT6VzfNfE

We're looking ahead to 2012. Join us! LOL!

Even with the fighting and the annoyance of one paranoid conspiracy theorist, I really love this blog. Interesting people and chat.

I enjoy it immensely. I am off to bed. it is 1:35 am. Thank god tomorrow is national holiday in BE.

Tom

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you, ET.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRvVzaQ6i8A

"For Pete's sake.. the election is over.. can ya all just can it??? I swear it's worse than kindergarten."

Oh yeah....

Rosie - ROFL! You're dern tootin' - wouldn't take me long to whip out a couple of long-ass chapters for Craig!

Tylenol.........By Jove........If it could be canned there'd be a fortune made............

2012 is just around the corner and the campaigns are starting. Huckabee will be in Des Moines Nov. 20th and Jindal will be here Nov. 22. Who's next? The spin will be interesting to hear.

Zoey

What will they be doing?
I suspect I'm like most folks, I'm ready for a break from the campaign.
Are they going to feel out local Republican leaders?

Jack

Corey

I wouldn't inflict the Edmund Fitzgerald on you, but I love the equally long, Canadian Railroad Trilogy. Anyway here are two more appropriate for this place. Let's home McCain finds Carefree (AZ) Highway and stays on it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhjiM0qjX9k

And all the politicians continue to tilt at windmills

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwUyBcpZU0E

Grey Davis was recalled because he wanted to triple car registration for one year only... and Arnie was elected so he could come up with a better idea... HA!
At least he has some energy and talks firmly.

Gay marriage? How about the 10th amendment? How about equal protection? How about separate but equal?

I've always wondered about laws against polygamy, how they could be legal, even if I do believe polygamy isrepulsive.

haha.. sturge.. I'd pay money to hear you say "by jove"

Canadian Railroad Trilogy should be our national anthem.. problem is, would take FOREVER at Olympic medal ceremonies.

Jamie, a few years ago, my best friend and I were sitting in a bar in Toledo, Ohio. I casually said to my friend, "You know what song I wanna hear played in this bar?" "What song?" He asked. "Sundown" I said. "Sundown? By Gordon Lightfoot?" "Yep." I answered. 2 song later, "Sundown" started playing. We both started laughing.

Jack,
Gov. Mike Huckabee will be signing copies of his new book, “Do the Right Thing” in Des Moines on November 20th.

Gov. Jindal will be delivering the keynote address to the Iowa Family Policy Center on November 22nd.

I think I might have to miss those two events. I am grateful the press forewarned me.

KO's outrage cup will running over tonight with a "Special Comment" about Prop. 8

Tylenol, the greatest rendition of "Oh Canada" I ever heard was by Sarah McClachlan at one of the Toronto Blue Jays World Series games back in the early 90's.

Tylenol,

I don't know if you saw it, but back in June for Canada Day, I linked to the trilogy. It really is wonderful .... but long, very very long

http://jdurward.blogspot.com/2008/06/canada-day.html

Check your PBS listings. Tonight at 9:00 west coast time there is an "American Experience" about the 1929 crash followed by a show on the building of the Palomar telescope.

If Renee or Rez are around that is followed by Navajo weaving.

Oh, Tylenol,

Our national anthem should be America the Beautiful but we are stuck with The Star Spangled Banner that no one can sing well.

Repubs won't scurry for votes where I live:

Ottawa County 2008 November election results:

John McCain: 84,823 votes 60..952%
Barack Obama: 51,925 votes 37.312%

Jack Hoogendyk (R) 79,979 votes 59.031%
Carl Levin (D) 51,606 votes 38.089%

Peter Hoekstra (R) 97,380 votes 71.647%
Fred Johnson (D) 35,099 votes 25.824%

Stem Cell Research:

Yes: 52,021 votes 38.107%
No: 84,489 votes 61.892%

If Renee or Rez are around that is followed by Navajo weaving.

call him drunken Ira Hayes............

Jamie, that's why people sing America the Beautiful. Some singers can't hit those high notes. Kid Rock has sang that at Pistons games for that reason. He's not nearly a good enough singer to sing the National Anthm.

I know, I know......it's Pima, It's Pima.......

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171970

Probably one of the few things both you and they would agree on

Jack

The interesting thing is that "Marijuana for medical use" had more "yes" votes than "no" votes here.

I think I got off on the wrong foot with that zombie quiz when I answered the first question: "Grab a beer.....them zombies is slow....."

Sturge.... scroll down to Sept. 26th, 2006. This will help you with the Zombie problem.

http://blog.myspace.com/johnmayer

I still say that this should be our country's song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YYzIWTE1L4

If you like to read, there is an in with the late RFK's daughter Kathleen in the latest Reader's Digest. I read part of it at my Mom's.
~~~~~~~~ C orey: I've been getting RD for almost 30 years ... you are right, that article, it was very sad ...
---------
www.newmoonmagick.net
Posted by: oldseahag | November 10, 2008 8:37 AM
~~~~Sea .. enjoyed your web site & will check back often for updates .. !:^)
viv

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171975

LOL
Another sign you"ve never left your block.

Jack

"We sympathize"

We do?

Nobody took me up on reprogramming MSNBC now that they have lost their main reason for viewers. In the interest of keeping Craig gainfully employed how about some ideas? It's better than refighting the recent and or future political wars.

Design programs, staff them with current people appearing. Suggest a little something for late hours and weekends other than documentaries for the brain dead.

Not confusing you with Bri -- Jack, ha.

"Nobody took me up on reprogramming MSNBC now that they have lost their main reason for viewers. "

Honest to God, Jamie -- I tried to come up with some ideas....let me think some more. It's like trying to figure out a way for Jackass to be anything you'd want to watch....

"No need to sympathize for me Patsi, I have insurance."

Does anyone wonder who the sociopath is now?

The first of the inaugural event invitations are starting to come in. On a lark I thought I would check out the train schedules to D.C. They are all booked (the Chicago legs) right now for a ten day span of before and after the inauguration. Hopefully, Amtrak will get its act together and put on some more trains/cars. We had extra cars coming back from the convention in order for them to handle the crowd.

"Nobody took me up on reprogramming MSNBC now that they have lost their main reason for viewers. "

Keith, Chris, Scar, Mika, etc. in their own version of "Survivor." The only difference would be no one would care who won since we would just leave them on that island for the rest of their lives. Oh wait, that was a dream I had the other night.....

what an odd forum

Jamie.. Please OH please could Chuck Todd get MTP? I'm so damned SICK of Tom Brokaw

Sickiness

It is not a forum. It is a community. Kick back, pour yourself a libation, and join in the discussion. We are almost, sort of back to normal after flaying each other alive prior to the election.

Brain: I can't wait till Jan. 20th, 2009. Then I will be able to come here, day after day, and point out all Obama's Flaws. I only hope, I will have the same tingle up my leg, as you seem to get every time, you bash Gov. Palin.

l give it a day of observation

thank you

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171974

I don't have a clue Diva. Just heard on this morning's news that he had filed the papers to declare candidacy. Governor does seem a strange place to start an elective career.

It's more of an asylum, "sickness". Run away, save yourself! It's too late for us!

Patsi----is this your psychopath

A young man was recently pulled out of a well-known lake, his death ruled accidental by the police. Initial findings ruled he had died from alcohol abuse and misadventure.

He was wearing a lacy black frilly bra and girdle, stockings, and the panties were down around his ankles. He was wearing a Toronto Maple Leafs jersey at time of death.

His family requested that the police remove the jersey before moving the body to avoid any family embarrassment.

of course you guys are free to say what you will, just understand you do me no favors by constantly trashing msnbc

Craig,

I was actually trying to come up with some good ideas for variety in the programming. Leaving the things that work such as Morning Joe, Matthews, Olbermann, Maddow, and the new (are they keeping it permanently?) 1600.

I would really like to see at least one program that had a quiet round table that actually discussed things maybe with a different topic such a a finance panel one day, foreign affairs, the white house etc. but with a group of people who knew the fields and actually talked to each other.

Jamie

I would like if msnbc would do a series of diff types of subject,,,an example is Christine Amanpor's ---Gods Soldiers,,,she featured in three 2 hour long history's of Christians,Muslims,and Jewish, faiths,,,,I taped them to watch again, they were so good????

My wife and I watch msnbc pretty much constantly, although I still watch Imus on RFD instead of X-mouth Scarborough.
Craig, no one trashes msnbc like Imus. He really pours it on.
He still hates David Gregory, Jon Meachem, Evan Thomas, and especially Harold Ford, Jr. , for their takes on the Rutgers scandal. He regularly trashes Secaucus , the station,the management, the old guests...
Imus has really changed, now praising Sean Hannity and Limbaugh and OReilly ...all the FOX people like Neil Cavuto, many others. No more attacking Bush and Cheney from him.

Jamie

msnbc---could do one hour interviews with the new people that is on the obvama team----but not a got u session-------i think that the country would love to see them up close and get to know them----start with Mayor daley's brother???

Jamie, some things (people) haven't changed here. Never will. I realize that. I don't hope Obama fails, just Palin. That's patriotism, for ya! LOL!

Solar

If they did that what would Charlie Rose do?

I agree with you but who would they get to do it?

Jack

Solar,

I know they use the after hours documentaries to cheaply fill time, but some variety might be nice. All crime all the time sort of guarantees a lack of viewers.

It makes sense to have a news channel on the left side of the spectrum to balance out Fox on the right, but there must be one commentator on the right who can present an intelligent position rather than just knee jerk buzz words who is somewhat under the age of mummified.

Jack ---that is a problelm----maybe David gregory to start with----they don't have too many serious reporters-----Andrea might if she could just be her self--she was pretty good before she sought so much attention---??

Brain: I did not, sayanything about Obama failing. I said, " I will only be to happy, to point out his flaws." Please don't try and put words in my mouth.

I'm definitely on the Chuck Todd to MTP bandwagon. I like David Schuster and hope he keeps a regular show on MSNBC., but there really does need to be something in place of the first Matthews show that is then repeated two hours later. Once a day is enough.

David Gregory is good. My favorite part of Stephanopoulis "This Week" is the panel discussion. That is what I envision with a revolving panel of their regulars and guests. With all the problems right now, there is more than enough material for

politics
finance
military
domestic issues
Foreign Affairs

Lively, but a real discussion, not yelling and spitting.

Jamie the big problem is anything we would come up with won't work on cable. They thrive on sensationalism, it is the only way they know how to drive the ratings. Fox started it, now MSNBC seems to joined in and CNN is not far behind.

That is why none of them are my news source anymore.
I'm mostly NPR as I work through the day. I try to catch some PBS documentaries and a little C-span.

Jack

Sickiness and any new lurkers,

Up on the left hand side under links is the blogroll. This is a connection to all of the regulars that have blogs. There is a map as well, showing where many of the regulars live.

It must be about time for another map drive. anyone who wants to be on it, just post a message for Tip Toe. Blue lights are liberal, Purple moderate, red conservative and green for the ardent environmentalists.

I realy like K O before he got to big for himself------he had a fun show with Monica novatnie? i would try to get him to go and redo his show ---but he just might yell and cry,,,and put me on the most wanted list------they have a real problem imo---they better get serious about getting serious???

Jamie---that used to get me pretty angry (the CM extra time slot ) i haven't watched msnbc in over a year---but i will if it helps your cause,,,,instead of the extra slot they could do Political history,, they could fill it with the history of how wall street started,,,etc,etc.christmas is coming up---i could fill that 1 hour slot by exposing all the bs ---the last part not serious ???

Just saw Craig and his panel on c-span taped on thursday - interesting.

Craig - Your point re msnbc is taken, but rejected. I have sent so many emails to msnbc, and would have sent more if they hadn't made it so hard to send them for awhile.

The only good thing I can note re msnbc is that they finally started having you on again. I remember the shock on Dan Abrams face on your first appearance
back after your ankle injury when you said you had been surprised at the bias in the media. He did not like your comment and it was obvious, and then you disappeared - that led me to finding you and this blog.

MSNBC should be glad to get straight forward information re the public's view of their work, and for free. If they can't tell that their programming is way too partisan and violently spoken from what we say, then they have no connection with American society.

I use the term violently because most of their programming is attack. It was non-stop attack on Hillary Clinton, and at one time attack on Bill. I think Bush is pathetic, but is also constantly attacked.

An attack carries violence. KO is an un-balanced man -re-view some of his attacks and watch the saliva gather at the corners of his mouth.

CNN got Fareed Zakaria - a great move, but msnbc wants no part of presenting an intelligent intellectual calm discussion re world events. They are a side show, with barkers and all the rest. If they hold my views against you, they just prove my point.

They have chosen to to try to attract extreme demonstrative sarcastic viewers, and if they are disappointed that they can't turn us all into firebrands and haters, they have to admit the lesson - many many people want to think for themselves. Msnbc has a choice - present us with Caligula and the Roman
colisseum and its strife and screaming, or with some people who are interested in examining other points of view and new information and exhibiting good manners.

If msnbc doesn't like what I just said, they should pass me a message thru you and I'll just start emailing them again. Of course, I'll keep commenting here, too.

Jack,

I do NPR and BBC America and when I can stay up, Charlie Rose. Still I like MSNBC because I"m a political addict and I would just like to see them be better.

Craig, I can understand being critical of MSNBC is doing you no favor. But, is it doing you harm? That, is a most serious question with very serious ramifications.

Good night folks. Be kind to each other.

Alex Witt---has a way about her that kinda makes u want to watch---sat am's she was pretty good when she used to talk to PB and ? she called them oh boy's oh boy's ---sorta like peaches and herb oh boy's- :-)

Stephanopoulis has been the best of the Sunday morning people the past couple of months. Thoughtful discussions about important stuff.

Flatus----that was my first thought also-----are they doing harm to Craig, but did not want to get negative------if they do get serious maybe they should offer craig a show,,he could fill in the extra time slots that are just horrible??--2 diff thought i know.

Flatus

They have been and have seemed to get away from the shouting spokes person. or maybe I've just been kucky at the times I've caught them.

Sunday morning around here anymore is catch time with the wife.

Jack

"An attack carries violence. KO is an un-balanced man -re-view some of his attacks and watch the saliva gather at the corners of his mouth."

Bethy, I completely agree. Listening to his broadcast under any circumstances validates him as a reflection of ourselves; I refuse being his toady.

I know what would make them #1

Dig up Tom Snyder and clone him.
I used to be able to listen to Tom all night.

Jack

"Sunday morning around here anymore is catch time with the wife."

Jack, that's a hell of a lot more important than any talk shows.

i really liked the black lady that went to npr---she did a few shows for K O---better than he did K O---what is her name?

"sorta like peaches and herb oh boy's" Ha! I really liked Alex,but no MSNBC,sorry Craig,bitter still....

His employer is ultimately the St Pete Times. If his appearances on MSNBC are contingent on us being kissy-ass to their 'personalities' than screw-it life is too short for this BS.

now that the elections are over he wants to be gracious to the host of this blog----hahahahaha,,that is a good one

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-172037

Flatus
Your so wise!! Great comment.....

He was asking us to self-censor, otherwise he wouldn't have said that. i censor myself all the time, believe it or not. Considering what I decide to post, imagine what I choose not to.

Champ- lol

Like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STB4s7Qhf40

Vomiting is a symptom of that norovirus that's been going around here.

Corey

Some one needs to call 911,
Then again maybe it is the dog food.

Jack

I can get wrapped up in the heat of the moment like anyone else, but when I realize I'm contributing nothing but negativity, I take a break. Mostly, I just try to be funny, my success at that being subjective, of course. Personally, I think I'm hilarious.

We never did find out who the sociopath was today, did we?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-172055
Champ
Yes! Hilarious and so smart..Its always better when your around! T

imus is way on the wrong side of history. But he realizes that the klan, and the idiots who mistake offensive acts while on the time clock for free speech, supply his bread and butter. Both he and his audience are geriatric, sick, and soon to be buried.

msnbc is all about making money for the execs. They leave serious news commentary to NPR and PBS. Serious news doesn't draw enough eyeballs to pay the rent. Remember, in show biz, news is the filler between the ads. This is not dumping on msnbc, it is dumping on all the commercial slop-shovelers.

Btw, I saw Gwen Ifil moderating a candidate 'debate,' despite all the lies and invective dumped on her by republican spinmonsters. Apparently, no one ever considered imus to be good enough.

Enough happy talk. Goodnight. See you in late December.

Champ

Monty python doing vomit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2Bs1ZZ-7b8

Watching an old movie (cuben) i just saw my first car---a 1955 plymouth,,black hood ,with a red body---3 speed on the column ,,it was a tank,,had a lot of fun in it-----there are some great shots of cuban life----and some great old cars that go way back to the 30's i thnk----the movie is called strawberry and chocolate

xrepublican- sorry, but you are quite mistaken about Imus, you should really watch to know what you are speaking of before criticizing him

Craig - is it possible that your employability is proportionate to our not criticising a news program? I would really hope that you can find other networks to appear on, and even talk about your experiences at msnbc. Go to cnn and talk with Dana Milbank and join the apostates and heretics.

If such a scenario is indeed possible, then I would say we have met the enemy, and the first salvo is an attempt to silence free speech using you as a hostage.

Or do the people there just rag on you re your trail mix of dis-agreeable people?

Well, I've done my good deed for the day, might as well quit while I'm ahead.

*whistling*

Frankly, I self-censor all the time, too, altho I know that's hard to imagine. I'm a bad typist so go back and re-read the whole thing, taking out or adding words and /or paragraphs.

Champ - I know you self-censor. There are only one or two who don't self-censor here.

Keith Olbermann on Proposition 8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GplfilGESrA

"There are only one or two who don't self-censor here."

Bethy
Some days I do it better than others.

But I would hate to have my job depend on what the comments of a blog were. If it did I would close comments like yesterday.

Also, it begs the question. What kind of people is it that worry about what a bunch of commenters on a blog say?
Kind of sounds like the lady across the street and they've got her locked up until they can get her meds adjusted.

Jack

The Terminator was on today. I thought about Arnold.

tt

My first car was a sweet 1962 bug, mint green, her name was grasshopper. Cruising and listening to tunes was lots of fun, but I had a whole lot more fun in that car doing other things!

Tony

my favorite car that i had was a blk on blk on blk---all black body,with leather black int, a black rag top,,it was a converable,,,man what a babe magnet,,,it made u feel like yu were in a cock pit of a plane,,,named it sugar bear

tony---i must be tired---left out that it was a pontiac bonnevile 1965

"Kind of sounds like the lady across the street and they've got her locked up until they can get her meds adjusted."
The commenters or the people worrying about their comments?

Jack - I know you self-censor, and I think you do it just fine. I like your posts and always read them. As I said, I think only a few don't self-censor - strong feelings can be shown without name-calling or spewing hate and intolerance. Some people don't want to hold back.

I don't like the idea that Craig could be black-listed again because of this blog. How are we hurting msnbc when we talk about our dislike of the network? They already know they're low on the list. If there are so many people who just lurk here, what is msnbc thinking of to make Craig aware of their dis-approval?

OSH---in a bug im shocked

I was a gymnast!

OSH

Those with so little to do but worry about comments on a blog. Sounds a little strange don't it?

It sure does Jack, seems to me that hiring Craig was their brilliant move, they ought to be watching what the others are saying right on their own network.

The "meds adjusted" part also brought to mind a few commenters!

yeah but u r still enticeing people----but now its with chocolate,,,mmmm good

Bethy

I can't think of a better way to draw attention to Jamies thought experiment then to do what Craig did. was it done on purpose? eh?
Did we walk into his trap?

Have we been made suckers?

Those answers and more tomorrow
Same Bat time same Bat channel.

Jack

I wouldn't worry about any comments this time of night. Anybody over there up this late isn't sober enough to read.

Jack

Solar- it's all about the candy!
Jack- I often think what fun Craig must be having and the chaos he can create with a simple post. We are his lab rats!

OSH

lol true

Night all

Jack

how long before the talking heads at msnbc
realize they have worked themselves out of
a job'' they done their part to get obama elected
whatever are they going to do now
whats the point of their existence now
sorry craig

Allow me to do you a favor, Craig:

Craig, as an employee (contractor?) and personality of MSNBC, is a representative of them. I can't be sure, as I don't watch, but I believe he has promoted this blog on "their" airwaves. I know he has promoted this blog in some public forum, if not that specific channel, once again, as a de facto representative of MSNBC.

If viewers of that channel are led here as a result of such promotions, and it's obvious that is the case in some instances, and as a result become privy to vitriolic ridicule and criticism of it, such exchanges could cause said channel to question their association with "the host" and their provision of air-time for him, if for no other reason that they are directing viewers to a forum which may dissuade continued viewership. That may cause a disassociation between said parties, resulting in a loss of income from both the TV appearances, and the cross-promotion of other endeavors, such as this blog, books, and public speaking appearances.

That being said, if you don't like said channel but wish "the host" professional success, don't watch it, or voice your criticisms in forums designed for that purpose. Personally, I opt for the former, although I used to enjoy the late-night prison shows.

msnbc destroyed their credibility as a reliable
source of news '
whose fault is that ? ours ?

Whoa.. msnbc just re-signed KO to 4 year extension.

I remember the first special comment.. NO ONE in the media, anywhere, said what he said. I remembering standing in my livingroom... watching jaw-dropping left-of-center analysis... it was brilliant, and while everyone's welcome to change the channel, I rather like the one-two punch of KO and Rachel. And please, this is politics. There will ALWAYS be something to talk about.

didn't the auto makers already get 25 billion
they are asking for another 25billion
thats understandable though 'the executives
are probably due for their annual bonuses

Jack - Craig's comment and what looked like a request is so bizarre that I have wondered if we were being set up. I can believe it, but am not completely sold. Craig did make a point of saying KO is a gentleman.

On the other hand, I find it hard to reconcile the idea of the reason for this or any other blog with the idea of a major "news" outlet supposedly dedicated to freedom and the bill of rights having the power to covertly quash criticisms of that "news" outlet.

If that news outlet is doing so, it should be shouted from the roof tops. If the blog is widely read, the story should already have received plenty of attention.

As for suggestions that I and a few others are being inconsiderate of our host, I find them humorous, considering the sources.

So, I guess we will have to wait for our host to tell us the basis of his comment.

"major "news" outlet supposedly dedicated to freedom and the bill of rights"

-it's not. It's a business. Pursuing 'truth' is your job, not theirs.

"So, I guess we will have to wait for our host to tell us the basis of his comment."

-He won't, and I already did.

...should have quit while I was ahead.

Tylenol - I remember that first special comment, too, and was pleasantly surprised. I wasn't sure why he was particularly qualified to be saying what he did, but I agreed with him. After the next one, I got tired of them. It was gradual with me to realize what exactly he was really into.

His special comment and other diatribes re Hillary and anyone who wasn't in the tank for Obama tipped the bucket, but gradually. He stopped making commentary and began to campaign and try to destroy his opponent, and he was quite vicious and nasty about it. I find nothing to admire or respect in that.

BTW, I am one of those wild-eyed liberals conservatives hate. I just don't feel that I have to like or admire or respect all liberals. (not a reference to anyone here, but to ko and tweety and a few others)

Michelle Obama is hot. 21st century Jackie O. I want whatever drugs they're giving Laura Bush. Lithium, perhaps?

I accidentally logged on to David Corn's blog and found it kinda interesting. It's about the game of who wants to be asked and who might be asked.

Good night. Really.

lordy, i shouldn't have said anything. was trying to head off another repetitive thread of msnbc bashing, and actually started one, ha. never mind, it's ok. i do work for the place, but no, there is no danger of recriminations, so have it. still, you guys could at least trash the other networks for some balance now and then

craig'
i think they mistakenly thought you were threatening censorship

My guess is that Terry McAuliffe figures that Obama will be a one term president. People will be so disappointed with his performance that there will be a large field of democratic primary candidates.

Governorship of Virginia gives him the bonafides to run for president.

somebody might want to tell all the young voters that went for obama there is no santa Claus' no Easter
bunny' and campaign promises are just that promises
to gain votes' how could obama possibly meet their
high expectations''they will be disappointed and let
down when they wake up January 21st and the world
is pretty much the same as it now' reality is a bitch

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171995

Maybe Alaska is confronting "30 Days of Night"... Eerie fricken film. I met the comic book creator at FACTS 2008 in Ghent. He also wrote the screenplay. If you like horror, this is truly that.

http://www.apple.com/trailers/sony_pictures/30daysofnight/

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-171862

Jamie thanks for the song link by Miriam Makeba - The Click Song 1966... It's great !!! She was truly a talent. South African music is beautiful

mqw, I agree, just a quick scan of today's paper:

Obama prods Bush to Aid Detroit

Intelligence Policy to Stay Largely Intact

New Administration Would Risk Backlash with Gas-Drilling reversal

Obama Leans towards Asking Gates to Remain at Pentagon for a Year

Obama Is Expected to Put Education Overhaul on Back Burner for a Year

Trasnition Poses Cash Quandry: Obama Team Weighs How to Raise Funds While Limiting Corporate Donations.

Change We Can Believe In!

Re: MSNBC... back in 2000 I was watching their daily political program online. It was really a great source of information, especially since I was experiencing my first real disconnect in American politics having lived in Europe for little more than a year...

I don't mind msnbc's slant. However I was strongly put of by the attacks on Hillary during the primary season. I still think msnbc has a lot to offer in programming. Witness Keith Olbermann's commentary on Gay marriage.

Tom

I learned a long time ago---that when someone asked me for a favor u have two choices---yes---and---no it is that simple,,,i think about what is asked, if no one is hurt,,how will it affect me,, then having done all of this i can decide to do what is asked----if it is a reasonable request i always say yes,,,,

When Craig and jamie asked for the opinions for msnbc i did not see any harm in it, so started to give my 2 cents worth,,,,when i signed up for this blog, i knew that there was going to be some manipulation of it---thru the comment section, and there for of my head---to this day i have not found it intrusive,,,some of the time i think that he starts a new thread just to shut off the bs that occurs, and most of the time in order to get the stale conversation in a new direction,,,,it works,,,i think all the cable news (95% or more) suck,,,i found cnn lacking in worthy news also---they just did not go overboard like msnbc,,,so have most newspapers,,,now im the one taking this too far, so i don't feel that i like a lab rat, or used or ass kisser----some one just asked me for an opinion, and i gave one that is all.....

solar, i wasn't asking for opinions about msnbc. thought i explained myself here: http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/11/arnold-to-the-rescue.html#comment-172101

manipulation? you must be kidding. i don't think Machiavelli his own self could ever manipulate this unruly crowd