Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

Hi HO Haven't been first in ages

Craig,

I don't know if any other Republicans are doing it, but here in Washington for the gubernatorial, the Gregroire ads identify her as "Democrat", but the Rossi ads identify him as "G. O. P." ... you can't run away from being Republican any more than that.

Thanks for putting the opposition forces in the video.

I just tried to log into my 2 retirement accounts at 2 different places. Humm.....couldn't get into either.

This is the kind of thing that causes worry and worse.

What are they thinking?

tt

Jamie, you innocent angel,

In 1975, in the aftermath of the 'Watergate Revelations' the republican party of Minnesota changed its name to "Independent Republicans" as though crooked Cabimet members like Minnesotan, and nixon Secy of Commerce, Maurice Stans, were somehow unrelated to our party.

To my shame, it took me until 1979 to understand all the way down into my gut that Minnesota republicans weren't "Independent", and that the crooks were the NORM in Minnesota's republican party. I was the lonely one who wasn't a nixon acolyte, who wasn't a stans kind of guy. The rest were all out to grab the main chance, screw the public, and retire to the South of France or a Caribbean Island.

We're not getting very many ads here is the northern bay area, but I guess so cal is being hit. I doubt anyone expects our area to go rep and they're saving their money. thank god cuz I hate watching those things, no matter whose they are.

No ads in Dallas yet. It's a good thing.

tt

Bethyboo,
I hope that a phone call in the morning will straighten things out. In the mean time, don't worry, 'cuz worry only makes for ulcers and a depressed immune system.

Jamie,
I guess I looked disgustingly patronizing in my last comment. I only meant that criminous republican activities, like developing happy-sounding aliases, is prolly foreign to a person like you. After years of working in criminal defense cases in the '80s, I can't tell the diff anymore between a father-raper and rush limbaugh, or donald rumdumb a trunk murderer. They all use the same decptions and excuses.

It's past my bedtime, and I am in my cups.

Goodnight all !

Let us hope and pray that when we awaken, we will find out that all this was only a bad dream, and that Al Gore has just won by an unprecedented landslide.

XREP - I'm not sure I understand what you mean about a phone call straightening things out.

Debt, Debt, Debt on the American consumer is strangling the economy. Why, Why, Why do the officials and geniuses who propose these financial bail-out solutions at taxpayers expense not include components that benefit the actual people footing the bills? Forgiving the bad debt and decisions of so-called informed financial institutions without some debt-relief for the consumer? Lending the financial system hundreds of billions of dollars of low-cost or free money without provisions for passing on some part of that relief to consumers in credit liquidity instead of just padding their bottom lines? That's why those guys (and gals) could not run a corporate business and vice-versa.

I am glad to see Obama on the attack...the more the better, and there is so much negative stuff about McBush there is not enough time and money to put it all in TV campaign ads anyway.
USA citizens have to be told about how Rove is running the campaign and how McCain is really a pawn in their game.
He did not want a damn thing to do with the Alaskan that Rove stuck him with...it's so obvious he wanted Lieberman as veep.
Now we must educate the voters as to how McCain is so ruthless and so determined to be POTUS he will do ANYTHING, including lying constantly, to try to use his solid block states to propel him to victory by edging out Obama in Ohio and Florida.
I have been studying the CQ map...it seems clearer by the day that this Buckeye state in which I reside may indeed swing the election again. And it may come down to the vote in Cuyahoga County, Cleveland and environs.
The Sec'y of State here has huge pressure to make sure not one voter is disenfranchised.

I'm sorry, Bethyboo,

I meant to address the comment left by tiptoe, and typed Bethyboo in error.

Goodnight, and a cheery tomorrow !

For those who are horrified by the McCain/Spain gaffe...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws

yikes!!

**addendum to my previous post**

and he even thought about the 57 for a couple seconds

BWWHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Linda....lol......

Is it "Families", or "Individuals"? You know, "People" has a nice non-specific ring to it.

The D primary debate held in Philadelphia, between BHO and HRC. BHO has unwittingly told us who will have their taxes raised to pay for his laundry list of "free" give aways. That figure will be brought down overtime from people (it is actually families not individuals, but when they say people it make you think of individuals), making over $250 to $75K, as there is no way he can pay for all his "free" give aways. Either that, or as he has said, it all depends of the economics at the time. Well since the economics aren't about to change anytime soon, that means he can't raise taxes, a good thing, and he won't be able to fulfill his free give aways, another good thing.

transcript: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/us/politics/16text-debate.html

Joe's gaffs. The gift that keeps on giving.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080918/ap_on_el_pr/biden_taxes_3

This pretty much speaks for itself.

http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=177523

http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2008/sep/18/tennessean-state-reps-son-contacted-palin-e-mail-p/

This is similar to waving a red flag in the face of a bull. Break and the law, and then brag about it. LMAO

2 Milk stories.

Lets hope there isn't a connection.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/2976181/Swiss-restaurant-to-serve-meals-cooked-with-human-breast-milk.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7622371.stm

The always articulate Josh Howard.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/091708dnspomavslede.112d818.html

Craig Good Facts thanks

Now add the multiplier of dollars spent and number of times the ad runs and Obama runs away with the Negative and Obama is the #1 Blame game player

In the "Nothing New Category"

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=washingtonstory&sid=aVPBaUbYV_qQ

BHO would engage in "aggressive personal diplomacy". Seems that toughness isn't having much affect on the likes of Russia, Iran or anyone else.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4781027.ece

not so sure about someone who rhymes "McArthur" and "Pearl Harbor"

CABLE RACE, WED, SEPT 17

Well I see KO has beat Rachel, and both have beat Larry King. But no one is beating FOX!!!

FOXNEWS HANNITY/COLMES 4,921,000
FOXNEWS O'REILLY 3,839,000
FOXNEWS GRETA 3,561,000
FOXNEWS SHEP SMITH 2,184,000
FOXNEWS HUME 2,108,000
MSNBC OLBERMANN 1,854,000
CNN COOPER 1,719,000
MSNBC RACHEL MADDOW 1,716,000
CNN KING 1,646,000
MSNBC HARBALL 1,145,000

Fry where did you get your data on the numbers who watch the different programs. I have been splitting my time between Fox and MSNBC just so I get the partisan spin from both sides. I never watched Fox before and thought I never would until this campaign. Now I want to get the BS from both unfair and unbalance networks.

Carol-still very afraid of both choices

"What's the Top Electoral State This Year ?"
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/09/whats_the_top_electoral_colleg.html

Ahoy mateys! Here's a fine editorial from me beauty Hillary, and for those lubbers and bildge rats that don't like it, well thar be the plank for the likes of you.http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/19/opinion/19clinton.html?_r=2&th&emc=th&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

Arrrgh! Read this now you scurvy dogs!
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/19/opinion/19clinton.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin

ct

Drudge Report. I think it is published everyday.

http://www.drudgereport.com/

Captain Jack's Pirate Hats.........

be the first on your block:

http://www.captjackspiratehats.com/

Sea,

"bildge rats" LOL

Now there is a term I haven't heard in many a year.

Arrh Matey, Avast I say,

The local news just had late breaking news. Chris Dodd just said the US financial system is just days away from total melt down.

Is it time to take over some vacant lots and do the urban farmer.
Beans and rice, me hearties. Beans and rice.

Jack

Aye, too much time on the shore me laddie!

Chris Dodd just said the US financial system is just days away from total melt down.

LOL, Damn, and just after he received that that special sweetheart mortgage.

http://comments.breitbart.com/d939a0eg9/

ROTFLMAO @ #4

Dodd must not have read or heard about this.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080919/world_markets.html?.v=16

Laura Ingraham was on IMUS this morning and just knocked the cover off the ball with her very humorous Joe Biden observations.

FD

That is just one of numerous sarcastic thoughts that went through my head.

That said, if this crisis has penetrated down to the air headed babel that presents itself as morning news. Then even the people who never pay attention will do so.

this is now issue #1, Forget all the left and right wing talking points from many years past, forget Palin , Spain. the eye of the undecided voter will be on the candidates response to this crisis.

Jack

Jack

For a piece of eight I've a fine chemise in my shoppe to go with that there hat, covered with a skull and crossbones rubbed from the ancient grave of a sailor in these waters.

LushIsLinda,

Yes Michelle was here yesterday, but one had to be invited to see her, and Sunday the enlighten-one comes to Charlotte, but again, according to the local radio, you have to obtain a ticket, but they never said from where. Guess I'll be missing that event. Good thing the Panthers are playing away this Sunday, or BHO might have been the halftime show.

HAHA @ BHO being the Panthers' halftime show

FryDaddy...call the station...get a ticket...you HAVE to go!!! 8~D

oldsea, our mates from down under the "Ye Auld Australian Association of Rum Riddled Rapscallions – YAAARRR for short" sure know how to celebrate
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,24370328-2,00.html
speaking of imus, was there anything of substance to the crawler that said "impeach 43" and went on to quote poppi? shouldn't get my hopes up so early in the morning cause it'll be all down hill for the day....aaargh

I think I hear'd the Imusians point out one time that Charles writes some of the crawls......for humorous effect.................

Jack,

Yesterday the DOW soared up over 430 points based a speculation that the government would buy up all the bad debt created by the mortgage crisis, and then resell the assets. Today the worlds markets erupted over that new and the DOW futures are up 300 points this morning. There is one small point to keep in mind, no one knows if this is constitutionally legal, as they would be creating this new fund with tax payer money. Some, as myself, believe that the government should stay out of it altogether and let the markets self correct themselves. But when you have companies like AIG who insure money market account, the safest of all non-government investment, to sit by and let it go under, I think that would be the linchpin to cause a worldwide financial melt down. Sometimes the government does have to step into area that would otherwise be better that they stayed out of.

LushIsLinda,

It is my birthday, I want to be able to enjoy it. LOL

Fry- just an fyi - tickets for appearance events are distributed to people while they wait in line. They require you complete part of it with your name, they collect them at the door when you go through security.

I have to run, will be back later. I do think all you BHO supporters are going to be very disappointed should BHO get elected as he has already said, a sort of CYA, that the tax rate hikes on those(?) making over $250K wouldn't be implemented if the economy was faltering, which would also mean he couldn't pay for his free give aways, and also BHO would be forced to maintain the Bush Tax Bill.

Promise them anything, but once elected have a memory lapse.

HAHA @ "Imusians"

UB,

Oh no not my name! All in the name of security?

Well that means I would have to show them some sort of identification with my name on it, otherwise I would how would they know I say I am? So it is more than just your name. "Let me see your documents!"

Opps,

UB,

Oh no not my name! All in the name of security?

Well that means I would have to show them some sort of identification with my name on it, otherwise how would they know that is really me? So it is more than just submitting your name. Big Brother, BHO. "Let me see your documents!"

Happy(early)Birthday, FryDaddy

there's something about sp's voice or delivery that reminds me of gilda radner's roseanne roseannadana character. must be the high pitch, the timbre or maybe the bending into the mike. or maybe it's the nonsense. as she would say "if it's not one thing it's another".... anyway here's a link to judge for yourself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qd_syuD-N_k&feature=related

FD

The 400 point gain in the DOW is just a sign that the markets are in a panic mode. Give me a week of boring, up 10 down 10, and I will be happier.

I hope they use the S&L RTC model. If a company needs to place them selves in recievership, then and only then, do the feds come in. Then in an orderly manner seperate out the good parts of the company from the junk. Sell off the good and put the bad assets into the trust for processing. In no way should the stockholders be bailed out. They would lose a valuable lesson in market economies if we do.

I suspect that what needs to be done is for congress to create a special bankrupcy system just to deal with this crisis.

Jack

My 84 year old father-in-law sent this link to me --

http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=wQK1al91drs

BHO 57 States Remix(feat. Sponge Bob, Oprah, Caitlin Upton)

too funny!! 8~D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMo0WlSvrIY&feature=related

Blonde wino...that link is hilarious!!

Lush

~~~~how dare you post things that make fun of my candidate, Don't you know this election is important, enough with the trivialities. ~~~~~~~~

(channeling Statler and Waldorf)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7h15xIoVwWw

Keep them coming

Jack

LL...rove...a lump of dough!

bethy

Centennial Savings and Loan the poster child for bad behavior. Two Guerneville reporters wrote about the problems -- The Inside Job...
Not a bad review for what is going on now

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147660

Thanks for the "innocent" and the "angel" though jaded and imp might be a shade more accurate.

after watching mccain/palin ticket, I believe they are the best campaigners for mr. o...it has become an issue election, not personal for me. So what if I do not like mr. o? I can not longer vote for the repug machine than I would think of abandoning my grandmother, or something like that.

Excellent Krugman on the parameters of what the Fed is proposing and why is not implemented correctly will only make matters worse

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/19/opinion/19krugman.html?_r=1&ref=opinion&oref=slogin

I'm watching the muppets,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z24LaD-Lh18

Jack

Jack...didn't spot Ms. Piggy, but she was the original pig with lipstick!

McCain is looking more alert this morning, but he still doesn't understand what money people make or how the taxing of those of lower income actually works or what the cost of living is for those people.

He used example of a family of four earning $35,000 as one to which he would give a "deduction" of $5,000 to pay for their healthcare. If they had the kind of money that could shell out $3,000 to $5,000 up front tor health care in order to get reimbursed with having non taxable deduction off the top, they would have done it.

If they get it as a straight deduction, the chances are that they don't pay that much in taxes and a deduction won't benefit them at all.

Here is what it looks like when the Muppets brief the President...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcpTCKOzJjA

KGC

Thanks, The problem is what works for a little country like sweden may not apply to the world. This is a world problem, not just ours.

But at .05% interest at least we can afford to borrow the money

Jack

I saw Warren Buffet on TV this morning.

He was peddling furniture.

I guess he had to take a second job.
Be scared be very scared.

Jack

Jack
the key point in the Krugman article is this:
"And if they aren’t, this could turn into the wrong kind of rescue — a bailout of stockholders as well as the market, in effect rescuing the financial industry from the consequences of its own greed.

Furthermore, even a well-designed rescue would cost a lot of money. The Swedish government laid out 4 percent of G.D.P., which in our case would be a cool $600 billion — although the final burden to Swedish taxpayers was much less, because the government was eventually able to sell off the assets it had acquired, in some cases at a handsome profit." (just like the US did with the Resolution Trust)

It's still a top down bail out. It would have been cheaper and better to just bail out the mortgage holders.

"Obama is drawing together the best and brightest in economics to hash a plan that will work....."

Does this mean Howell Raines and Jim Johnson are now under the bus? If you are ready to lead on day one, when the financial crisis call comes at 3 am -- can you really wait for the nursing home to wake up your council of economic advisors.
I thought 72 was too old . The average age of Obama's economic advisors is methuselah

Fry, please no lengthy copy and paste. I replaced your debate transcript above with a link to the debate transcript (they are easy to find): http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/us/politics/16text-debate.html

Bear

I was a fan of Ladysmith black mombazo beginning with their appearance on Paul Simon's Graceland album. It was such a shame about the racial killing of their bass singer, but the reconstituted group still has wonderful harmonies.

KGC

I hope it is not a bailout that lets the same characters in place to do it again. As I said earlier, if it is a expedited bancruptcy that get good assets back out on the market where they will do some good then OK If it just a system for the government to by every idiots bad debt, then not so much. Not that anyone gives a damn what I think.

Got a busy day see you later

Jack

"It's like the gop doesnt mind at all losing this one and are even having to go to great lengths to lose it.......why?" [sturgeone 9:29 pm]

why indeed sturge? must be something they know that's lurking out there that we don't. aaarrrrggghh, and cue the spooky music.

Is this the kind of judgment to lead we’ve all been hearing so much about?

Now imagine Obama in an intense negotiation with one of America’s enemies — only in an Obama presidency we won’t have enemies, we’ll have “countries with opposing viewpoints.” Any-hoo, just imagine the scene: tea and cakes have just been served on the official Oval Office tea set — festively adorned with Obama’s personal seal — and Obama, in an attempt to lighten the mood and relax his guest, says to Kim Jong Il, “Hey, I just added a great song to my iPod. It’s called ‘Short People’ by Randy Newman. Remember that one? It goes like this: ‘Short people got no reason to live … they have little hands, little eyes, they go around telling great big lies.’ … Hey, where are you going? You didn’t finish your tea!”

Gross exaggeration? Of course. But considering how The OneTM has unraveled on the campaign trail in just a matter of weeks since the entrance stage right of Sarah Palin, Americans have reason to be concerned how he would react under the very real pressures of the presidential office. What tough decisions has he made that illustrate the judgment to lead that he’s been claiming for the past 19 months? Surely it can’t be day-to-day campaign decisions, as much as he’d like us to think that, because that’s his campaign manager’s job.

Another saying that’s been around even longer than “lipstick on a pig” is “caveat emptor” — “let the buyer beware.” It’s one that American voters would do well to heed in November, regardless of what our more enlightened European betters think.

From real clear politics-Hey Obama - How's that Judgement to lead meme working out?

Financial crisis solutions have occurred over the weekend and with solutions coming at 3 am...

Starting with Bears Sterns..at 3 am

Volcker is 81 according to some too old.

Obama stayed on the stump today and had no answers for the troubled financial sector. All Obama did was blame Bush and say hey we need to change. He provided no plans, no ideas, and no commitment. Yet John McCain did come up with an crisis plan. John McCain say the financial issues in 2005 and proposed legislation to correct the problem. The democrats opposed the proposal and we have the crisis today. John McCain offers a real plan today and the stock market rallies for a 400 point gain. The largest one day gain in over 6 years.

This is yet another 3:00 am moment and Obama is AWOL. John McCain answered the bell and the rally today was a direct result. Just like his vacation in the Georgian crisis Obama decided to stay on the sidelines. McCain engaged and provided leadership. Obama wants to change the crooks in Washington; McCain wants to reform Washington by providing leadership and ideas. DO we really desire a Democrat government when all they do is take vacation when America faces a crisis?
http://thelizardannex.blogspot.com/2008/09/economic-crisis-obama-no-clue.html

Remember the Hillary & Obama debates? Obama always waited for Hillary to answer and either said I agree with Hillary, or gave an insufficent no basis answer. Looks like that is what he is doing again, he refuses to be pinned down to anything.Like Senate vote Present.. Just present.

Fry - usually the majority of people submit their name without an issue, however, they do not check I.D.s, SO if that process bothers you , or anyone else, one could go in as any name. I bet you could go in as Fry Daddy and they would not even blink an eye. It's just the process with many different reasons behind it. Try not to read too much into it.

BTW the secret service so professional and stealth, and they are awesome to watch in action. There were so many in the crowd in plain clothes, it was really interesting, however, I didn't spot any snipers at the Biden event.....

mornin' all.

Yippee - installed a wireless router this morning, and it works. I-net throughout the house. While I was installing the router, McSame was in the background blathering on about the economic crisis - it was apparent that he had no idea what he would suggest other than firing the chair of the SEC, who he was quick to say is a good man. I don't fault him for not throwing a precipitous fix out there - this is a very complex issue that doesn't lend itself to the kind of shoot from the hip policy making we have gotten used to. But the hilarity of McCain calling for MORE regulation of the financial markets (read - bigger government and less free market operation in the most basic sector of our economy) just cracks me up. Another position shift for him. Anyone keeping score?

And fuhchrissakes, Fry, do you own stock in Fox or something? Using your logic, NBC is king of the braodcast news heap and the NYT is king of print media. And btw, Spongebob Squarepants, with his 3.99M viewers beats H&C and all the cable newsies except O'Reilly, except when H&C had Palin on Wednesday.

The numbers are at tvbythenumbers daily.

http://tvbythenumbers.com/2008/09/16/monday-night-football-the-closer-and-coco-chanel-lead-cable-viewing/5128#more-5128

hey all, more on this later, but sadly last night had to write Jamie and cancel my plans to attend Nov. 14-17 Trail Mix Roundup in monterrey. Can't get into details yet, but I've taken on a major writing deadline for early December and no fun for me until Christmas. Of course, those who were going can still have a good time without me. Tho I would like to reschedule for after the holidays.

Stocks soar as officials confirm gov't rescue plan

By TIM PARADIS, AP Business Writer

Friday, September 19, 2008

(09-19) 07:26 PDT NEW YORK, (AP) --

Wall Street extended a huge rally Friday as investors stormed back into the market, relieved that the government plans to rescue banks from billions of dollars in bad debt. The Dow Jones industrials rose nearly 360 points, giving them a massive gain of more than 770 points over two days, and Treasurys fell as money flowed into equities.

Obama was still looking in his cupboard for an answer

Here's why this mess is too difficult to throw a financial bandaid on.

http://topics.blogs.nytimes.com/tag/wall-street/

The "experts" don't really agree on what the hell to do. Look at the 4th issue - identifying a troubled bank, and learn.

Threadiness is next to Godliness

today from blistersyeahbutchannel

The Slacker Generation is In Charge:
Chinese Bailout means Better Take Out
or Why do Demicrats Hate America and what it stands for

Special to blistersyeahbutchannel

September 15, 2008
Categories: Mike Bloomberg
Bloomberg agrees with McCain: Economy 'fundamentally ... strong'

I just now asked the New York mayor, a former Wall Street hand who's been in the mix in the current crisis, whether he agrees with McCain that the fundamentals of the American economy are strong.

"I do agree that fundamentally America has an economy that is strong," he said. "America’s great strength is its diversity, its hard work, its good financial statements, its broad capital markets,its enormous natural resources" and its work ethic, he said at an afternoon press conference devoted to reassuring New Yorkers that the city's finances and its economy are intact.

"I'd rather play America's hand than any other country," he said. "Without problems? No."

RCP's latest EC map. Notice - WV is NOT considered a tossup.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/maps/obama_vs_mccain/

Notice also - it is as close to a dead heat as anyone could ask for. So much for that "not filtering down to the state level" Polyanna nonsense.

btw, Ohio looks like crap and PA is no gimme.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/battleground.html

by the way, folks, the bobbleheads in today's video are courtesy of Jamie and Blue-in-Dallas

sock, this is what Obama has said about the crisis.

http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/samgrahamfelsen/gGgmmL

Doesn't strike me as imprudent as calling for Cox to resign without a plan other than in the same broad - more oversight, bi partisan, admin-congressional cooperation - outlines Obama proposes and McCain echoes.

PA has me concerned -- I saw a Franklin and Marshall College poll yesterday for PA-11 with the GOP guy up 9 points over incumbent DEM Paul Kanjorski. The GOP guy is the mayor of Hazelton, PA which last year passed local ordinances to ban undocumented immigrants. Paul's one of the good guys in Congress -- stands up for the little guy and middle class, good to his staff, thoughtful legislator. Lived in a small apartment in DC during the week and always drove home for the weekends. When I was working on the Hill, I was friends with some of his staffers. It would be a shame to have him get beat by some racist GOP jack-crack.

Sorry about the Asilomar cancellation. We are now open for suggestions for locations in the Spring. So far I've heard rumbles of

Asilomar Rewind
Washington DC

Anybody who would like to add to the list, we can then take a vote and let El Grand Poobah decide from among the finalists. :-)

... and create the MFI trust to bail out troubled financial instuitutions. Jack, it sounds a lot like the S&L RTC model you favor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d73KlhUq1W8

Ron Paul on the economy.

QUESTION

does anyone here know who will be doing the questioning in the first debate next Friday?

1. I wonder how many Republican who are against "welfare" will decry this bailout as corporate welfare?

2. If Ted Stevens and Don Young are in significant trouble in their Alaska races, does Sarah Palin have to campaign and endorse them to preserve their seats since they are leading in their own race? If she does, will being a hypocrite hurt her there or nationally?

3. If one candidate is on both sides of the same issue within 2 hours of his first policy statement of the day, does that make him a political opportunist or extremely prescient?

If one candidate is on both sides of the same issue within 2 hours of his first policy statement of the day, does that make him a political opportunist or extremely prescient?

Joe Biden?

from the former thread

So you will follow the Republican road that you know will put the most boulders in your way and raise mountains for you to climb to get out of the ditch they dug for you.

At least with the well worn Democratic path, you know it stands a chance of taking you close to where you want to go.

Posted by: Jamie Author

Jamie,

Reading the above only reinforces my lamentable paradox, I agree with you...but there are mitigating factors that must be included into the mix. Since I distrust both the far left, far right zealots I am left with a difficult choice. My thoughts are personalized by an incident which made both my wife and I reassess the democrats, and we realized how keenly they too hold prejudices and apply them with equal vigor as senselessly as the right.

As a moderate I earnestly weigh the pros and cons of voting for McCain, but I am also been mindful to include benefits coming from divided government. Most dems possess a near blind certitude that the democrats controlling both the W.H. and the congress is vital for governance, liberty and all felicity. I haven't the stomach to share their certitude. All I can be certain of is an aggressive agenda asserted by unsheathed partisanship leaving moderation as a failed experiment. Also, with Obama comes a "new kind of baggage" the ascendency of far left moveon, the DNC, and the empowerment of the MSM confident in their supremacy over reason. I may be faulty in my decision to vote McC, but I will ameliorate such sadness in the knowledge I was not an enabler.

Bill Clinton served during divided government and they were truly wonderful, productive years, Bush on the other hand has not, his presidency a lesson in calculation and excess. As regards Bill Clinton, I have not witnessed altruism or magnanimity In Obama, if these traits exist in him they are vaporous, because he "never" displayed such kindness to Bill or Hillary, yet magnanimous behavior is the very cornerstone qualities that marks a leader great.

Lastly, I feel that the MSM has ushered in a truly harmful environment by their egregious reporting, unlike some dems I rejected the unseemly attacks against Hillary, and very unlike most dems I also deplore mindless attacks on Palin.

Jamie, again I respect your decision fully.
PUMA/Clintons4McCain

regards,
toast

No Sock,

John McCain...

The deregulating smart regulator...

The debate moderator will be Jim Lehrer of PBS

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/05/presidential-and-vice-presidential-debate-moderators-announced/

ubns,

Jim Lehrer

http://www.debates.org/pages/news_111908.html

No Bear

Biden.

Political Radar: Biden Bails on Anti-Bailout Stance
Sep 17, 2008 ... But Wednesday, at a campaign stop in Mansfield, 0hio, after the Fed's $85 billion AIG bailout, Biden sounded a less emphatic tune. ...

jamie, jinx.

Or perhaps Palin sock?

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/19/us/politics/19trooper.html

Milquetoast

"Bill Clinton served during divided government and they were truly wonderful, productive years"

The whole latter half was almost ruined by the bickering and attempt to impeach.

While I wouldn't expect the Democrats to try to do that to McCain, it will still take a united WH and Congress for at least four years to dig us out of the mess that the Republicans have dug us in to.

It is going to take at least that long to clean out all the cronies of the Bush criminality and move necessary legislation to put us on the road to recovery.

If they betray that trust, then the Congress can always be over turned at the two or four year mark, but to deny the Democrats the opportunity of holding two branches just as the Republicans have for more than a decade is the height of foolishness.

Or McCain, sock.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/18/opinion/18collins.html?em

Then it's both Sock...

McCain Shifts Opposition on Government Bailout of Insurance Giant

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/5050/story?id=5821886&page=1

McCain Warns Against Hasty Mortgage Bailout, Dismisses Clinton Plan

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/25/mccain-warns-against-hasty-mortgage-bailout-dismisses-clinton-plan/

McCain didn't mind a bailout of Bear Stearns did he?

Asked whether the Fed went too far in helping Bear Stearns, McCain said: “It’s a close call, but I don’t think so.” He said he doesn’t support federal bailouts unless it has catastrophic effects on the entire financial marketplace and there were indications that a Bear Stearns failure would have rippled across the entire economy.

Obama

"The fundamentals of our economy are strong..."

Obama quotes McCain ..leadership

Wow, this is bold...now that the Fed has used all its ammunition with regards to bailouts. Now that Wall Street gets the help they need at the detriment of Main St...now McCain says the bailouts should stop...

http://www.reuters.com/article/vcCandidateFeed7/idUSWBT00975420080919

If that's going out on a limb, then the tree dwarfs anything in the redwood forest...

Obama
fumbling and tentative who is advising this man?

Obama

No point -- he is the Friedman Unit of the economic crisis

Sock what are you watching?

McCain came on with a whole slew of memorized, boiler plate, Republican platitudes.

Obama is thoughtfully responding to all questions by reporters and showing that he is analyzing the situation to do the right thing rather than just jumping to conclusions.

Guess what? Nobody knows everything. Obama has the good sense to know that this is a complex problem and advertising slogans won't fix it.

The facts are people did know this would happen.

Obama is doing nothing more than pointing his finger at the problem.

In fact, the Obama proposals are similar to McCain's.

"it will still take a united WH and Congress for at least four years "

Democrats united?

Did it happen when Carter was president? Nope

The first 2 years of Clintons presidency? nope.

So why should we believe there will be harmony and team play If Obama is president?

The same wing of the party is in control of congress and they will want their agenda passed.
Look for problems from both the Dems and the Repubs

Jack

2 points re: OHIO

1. Ohio allows voters to change party affiliation at will, making it difficult to gauge where voter loyalties lie. The Columbus Dispatch, however, reported that Ohio has added 1 million registered Democrats since 2004, while Republicans added 356,000 voters in that time.

2. AP-The state says Ohio's unemployment rate jumped to 7.4 percent in August, up from 7.2 percent in July. It's the highest rate in 16 years

Sock,

As chairmain of the Commerce Committee, McCain should have had some clue that the practices of the firms in question would get us to where we are today.

I could tell back in 2005 that the housing bubble was going to blow up hard and I prepared my clients accordingly. As such they were in a position to sit on a pile of money they cashed out of their properties and put them into the safety of bonds. Now they are jumping back into the market to bargain hunt.

I can't remember who the quote is attributed to, but there was a financier who knew it was time to get out of the stock market when he heard two janitors discussing stocks.

Since investment banks, like Merril and Lehman could get their MBS rated AAA even though they were experiencing high defaults, they could continue to book earnings. They were creating a false revenue stream that would exist so long as value increases continued to pay off bad loans.

McCain could have championed a minor reform...the tax deductability of Mortgage Insurance, and that would have prevented a lot of the mess that occured...he didn't though. When that would have mattered, he was more worried about Iraq...something he actually knew something about...even though he was chair of the "Commerce" committee...

Now imagine Obama in an intense negotiation with one of America’s enemies — only in an Obama presidency we won’t have enemies, we’ll have “countries with opposing viewpoints.”

Posted by: Julie Young Author Profile Page | September 19, 2008 10:07 AM

wonderful post.

regards,
toast

jack, those are politics words - Will Rogers was closer to right abut us dems.

lunch

McCain - Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005 ... McCain did champion reform. It's why he can separate himself from Bush.

Who took the most amount of lobbyist money from Freddie and Fannie? Shoots a big hole in the "no special interest "
theory for Obama.

Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005

Bill Summary

1/26/2005--Introduced. Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005 - Amends the Federal Housing Enterprises Financial Safety and Soundness Act of 1992 to establish: (1) in lieu of the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight of the Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD), an independent Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Agency which shall have authority over the Federal Home Loan Bank Finance Corporation, the Federal Home Loan Banks, the Federal National Mortgage Association (Fannie Mae), and the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation (Freddie Mac); and (2) the Federal Housing Enterprise Board. Sets forth operating, administrative, and regulatory provisions of the Agency, including provisions respecting: (1) assessment authority; (2) authority to limit nonmission-related assets; (3) minimum and critical capital levels; (4) risk-based capital test; (5) capital classifications and undercapitalized enterprises; (6) enforcement actions and penalties; (7) golden parachutes; and (8) reporting. Amends the Federal Home Loan Bank Act to establish the Federal Home Loan Bank Finance Corporation. Transfers the functions of the Office of Finance of the Federal Home Loan Banks to such Corporation. Excludes the Federal Home Loan Banks from certain securities reporting requirements. Abolishes the Federal Housing Finance Board.

What was Obama thinking with that...wait until Monday for more details...

On Monday the deal will be done and no one will care what he has to say. If you aren't ready at 3 AM...you aren't ready

Sock,

That Bill you refer to never became law and while it would have fixed some of the issues with the GSE earnings issues, it would have done nothing to improve or repair any of the fundamental problems with the mortgage markets.

McCain is in Spain

Privatized Profits and Socialized Losses.

It's the McCain-GOP way

Sock,

People who focus on Fannie and Freddie as the problems with the Mortgage mess are making the same mistake as those who in 2001 were saying that Iraq was responsible for 9/11.

Again...It was the Sub Prime and the Alt-A markets that had the vast majority of loans that went bad after markets plummeted.

Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac set the guidelines for the CONFORMING MARKETS. By definition, Sub Prime and Alt A are as such since they don't fit the conforming guidelines.

Fannie and Freddie ran into problems because they were buying Sub Prime MBS to get a higher yield on their investments to meet those flawed earnings targets and after the market went into the tank, to provide liquidity to the market so lending could continue to take place.

McCain declared: "I believe the chairman of the FEC should resign and leave office immediately."

What an idiot!

Bernie Sanders was just on and read a statement he read on the floor of the Senate back in 1999 opposing deregulation. Very prescient. He also said,

"If a company is too big to fail, it might be too big to exist"

Taft-Hartley anyone?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147839

Good to know he finally found it. He had it relocated to South America a couple of days ago

McCain went up against the leadership of his party in 2005
and failed to reform the mortgage markets. It shores up his maverick credentials.

Blaming the subprime market is incorrect as well.
You sound like Howard Fineman who just blamed Bill Clinton and the Community Reinvestment Act

With the Federal Government bailing out Wall Street and with McCain pledging to Bailout the auto industry, can we guess who the first state or city that demands a bailout will be?

BEAR - Heads up

Great blog article about "Lil Hardin"

http://thiseclecticlife.com/2008/09/19/standing-in-the-shadows/

For those who are saying Lil who? She was the incredible woman, pianist, and composer who became the power behind the throne. You may have heard of her husband: Louis Armstrong

Sock Drawer,

I work in the mortgage industry. I think I know why my industry failed.

What is your rationale that the sub prime market isn't what caused the mortgage mess, considering the default rates for Sub Prime and Alt-A are anywhere from 3 to 10 times higher than conforming loans in the same markets?

I would value your input sock since I work for a multi billion dollar mortgage company that positioned itself the way we did because of the early realization that the markets were shifting in 2006 and we made a flight to safety...away from the Sub Prime and Alt A markets...because of this move, we are on pace for a record year...

Work in the mortgage industry? Part of the problem eh?

http://www.pathtoinvesting.org/investinggoals/homeownership/understanding-subprime-crisis/causes-of-mortgage-meltdown.htm

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147843

Bear

There is a reason it sounds like Iraq all over again. The same folks are pushing the agenda. Rowe was doing his best to keep the meme going on Fox the other night. I don't see all Republicans spouting it. But the nut case right is all over it.

Jack

one more sake,

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147844

the FEC? what did it discover Repug shenanigans in OH & FL again?

Subprime Lending Not to Blame For Credit Mess, Says Study
By: PAUL JACKSON
July 30, 2008

It’s almost taken as common knowledge at this point that out-of-control subprime mortgage lending — the funding of home loans to borrowers with less-than-perfect credit — was the chief culprit behind the unsustainable boom in U.S. home prices that eventually derailed the real estate and mortgage markets.

But new research, published Wednesday by UC Irvine’s Paul Merage School of Business Center for Real Estate, suggests that subprime loan products themselves may not have been the primary cause of U.S. home prices’ rise and fall.

Instead, the study argues that the considerable 2003 pullback of government-sponsored financial service corporations Fannie Mae (FNM: 0.7213 +67.74%) and Freddie Mac (FRE: 0.59 +78.79%) from the mortgage credit market and their subsequent replacement by aggressive, private mortgage securities issuers in late 2003 had a significant impact on home prices and was more responsible than subprime lending for the drastic price runup that peaked in early 2006.

“We were quite surprised to find the intensity of subprime lending was insignificant after controlling for all the other factors influencing the market, but we were really blown away when Fannie’s and Freddie’s continuing presence in the market was shown to be so important,” said Kerry Vandell, UCI finance professor and Center for Real Estate director.
http://www.housingwire.com/2008/07/30/subprime-lending-not-to-blame-for-credit-mess-says-study/

The actions of lenders are directly attributable to the policies of the Fed: when credit is cheap, why not loan money more recklessly to individuals who normally would not qualify? Even with higher default rates, lenders could make huge profits simply through volume. Subprime lending is a symptom of the housing bubble, not the cause of it.

http://www.house.gov/paul/tst/tst2007/tst031907.htmhttp://www.house.gov/paul/tst/tst2007/tst031907.htm

Ron Paul Rawks!

"can we guess who the first state or city that demands a bailout will be?"

Now that the Dems are in control of congress, That would be the state of Mr Pork himself aka Robert Byrd, West Virginia. He may not be able anything else but he can still bring home the bacon.

Jack

Jack I would be surprised and disappointed if WV weren't first to beg - it would mean Bob Byrd has died. Of course, we'll be frst in line - whether we need the handout or not.

Californian's should chip in and send our legislators to the Bob Byrd school.

Now here's a nice switch - the US leads the Ryder cup after day 1.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/sports/AP-GLF-Ryder-Cup.html

Better not wait too long, KC, Bob's no spring chicken, not in the best of health and any successor to him will look positively bush league.

Ahnnold ran on a platform of getting back more of our tax dollars from DC. So far, big failure. Although not enough for the prison guards to get momentum for their recall.

Sock,

The study you cite is missing a valuable point.

If they are blaming the mess on the pull back of Fannie and Freddie from the mortgage market and on the void the left with their pullback...

"Instead, the study argues that the considerable 2003 pullback of government-sponsored financial service corporations Fannie Mae (FNM: 0.7213 +67.74%) and Freddie Mac (FRE: 0.59 +78.79%) from the mortgage credit market and their subsequent replacement by aggressive, private mortgage securities issuers in late 2003 had a significant impact on home prices and was more responsible than subprime lending for the drastic price runup that peaked in early 2006."

Then the void was filled by loan programs and entities that BY DEFINITION WERE NOT FANNIE OR FREDDIE, making them SUB PRIME.

Let try this a different way...say Fannie and Freddie were Jesus Christ and they pulled back from preaching on a day to day basis...

If their preaching void is filled by someone named Budha, they can be preaching but if he isn't preaching the same thing as Jesus, can he be called a Christian?

The fact that this study can so easily contradict itself within its own findings is illustrative of why we have the problems we do.

Here is a good response to your citation...
http://economicsofcontempt.blogspot.com/2008/07/subprime-mortgages-werent-main-trigger.html

Pogo,

No Tiger means a Ryder Cup win...he's only a stud when there's money on the line.

Except the point the study makes is about the pricing and the burst of the housing price/valuation bubble not the source of the loans. Nice comparison of oranges and onions.

As for your silly religious analogy - stick to calling Pallin -Pontious Pilate--how did that work out for you.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147660

XRepublican, have we talked about this before? Are you Minnesotan? I grew up in the NE suburbs of Minneapolis.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147668

John, interesting point. Of course the credit card companies with their usuary rates are guaranteed to keep people in debt beyond their means. PEOPLE, TEAR UP THOSE DAMN CREDIT CARDS! They are not liberating; they are ENSLAVING. A simple card to handle travel, tickets and the like is understandable. But using credit cards to supplement insufficient income is a recipe for disaster! And now it is much more difficult to file Chapter 7. Americans save the least of any westernized nation. Isn't that just sad? But heck, who can save? We're all trying to get out from under our credit card debts and we're swimming in red!

Of course unexpected medical bills, lack of health coverage, or under-coverage, sudden job losses, the sub-prime debacle... it's all horrible. But at times like these, using the credit cards in a "spending as usual" mode isn't going to make the personal financial problems go away.

DON'T BE A SLAVE TO YOU MASTERCARD !!

perception is everything

your perception is heavily medicated

Bear, Tiger didn't do so badly at the K club - had 3 points - highest of any American, beaten only by 2 of the Europeans - Garcia and Westwood. He won his only singles match and had a win and a loss in both Fourball and Foursomes. I'd bet they wouldn't mind having him there.

Your views and perception are worth less than Lehman
Brothers Stock

Sock,

It was sub prime mortgages that expanded credit and income guideline which allowed people to qualify for more home than if they went with a Fannie Loan or an FHA loan.

Ratios for a conventional loan are typically 28/36
Ratos for an FHA loan are typically 29/41
Ratios for a Sub Prime Loan were 55% on average.

The first number is just the payment/income the second number is all debt/income

If you make $3000 a month and have $500 a month in other debt, this is what you qualified for, assuming a fixed rate at 6%, 30 year note

Conventional Loan $96,739
FHA $121,757
Sub Prime $191,810

In order to expand qualifying ratios for Conv or FHA, you needed to show a strong credit history and have reserves in the bank.

Sub prime loans had inferior credit standards and no reserve requirements.

Repeating the sentence doesn't make it any more relevant.

The credit crisis is no longer just a subprime mortgage problem.

As home prices fall and banks tighten lending standards, people with good, or prime, credit histories are falling behind on their payments for home loans, auto loans and credit cards at a quickening pace, according to industry data and economists.

The rise in prime delinquencies, while less severe than the one in the subprime market, nonetheless poses a threat to the battered housing market and weakening economy, which some specialists say is in a recession or headed for one.

Until recently, people with good credit, who tend to pay their bills on time and manage their finances well, were viewed as a bulwark against the economic strains posed by rising defaults among borrowers with blemished, or subprime, credit.

“This collapse in housing value is sucking in all borrowers,” said Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody’s Economy.com.

“Subprime was a symptom of the problem,” said James F. Keegan, a bond portfolio manager at American Century Investments, a mutual fund company. “The problem was we had a debt or credit bubble.”

The bursting of that bubble has led to steep losses across the financial industry. American International Group said on Monday that auditors found it may have understated losses on complex financial instruments linked to mortgages and corporate loans.

The running turmoil is also stirring fears that some hedge funds may run into trouble. At the end of September, nearly 4 percent of prime mortgages were past due or in foreclosure, according to the Mortgage Bankers Association.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/12/business/12credit.html

Ha, I guess I'm stuck in '04 thinking OH is the key for Obama, at least according to E.J. Dionne.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/18/AR2008091803046.html

He thinks the key is MI. Maybe we're both right?

The debate between Bear and sock is a great example of why a quick fix is not prudent - even the cause of the problem isn't clear. Leadership is not an exercise in providing solutions to problems we don't understand. Point to Obama.

"As home prices fall and banks tighten lending standards, people with good, or prime, credit histories are falling behind on their payments for home loans, auto loans and credit cards at a quickening pace, according to industry data and economists."

Could someone explain the correlation in the above paragraph.

As the value of my house decreases, I'm going to start defaulting on my bills. ?? Why would this be occurring?

Obama and McCain both have plans. I don't agree "point to Obama."

Monday the deal will be done and Obama will be just another lagging indicator. What's he going to do tell Paulson and Dodd wait a minute until I read it over.

Hey Pogo,

Maybe McCain was now only responding to the viagra question.
FEC?? And complaining about the Feds messing with his Erection Control. lol

Rez,
I don't know what that paragraph is trying to say. I see two statements there.

But if you are in the position where you HAVE to sell your home good luck.....fewer buyers can get credit.....market is slow...therefore, if you need to SELL, for whatever reason (usually financial ) you can not....and that's how people end up getting behind.

a few reasons people end up in that position: job loss, divorce, lawsuits, accidents, re-location, death of a spouse

I have a friend that has had her home on the market for 2.5 years......

UB,
That was a paragraph contained in an article posted by sock at 1:58. And it didn't make sense when I read it.

Sock, the bandaid may be applied Monday,but if there is a solution that will be implemented for the long term by then, I will happily admit - in 6 months or so after eveything seems to have settled down and it appears to have worked - that I was wrong about the complexity of the problem. I don't expect you to agree that the point goes to Obama - but it certainly doesn't go to McCain. The point is for exercising the prudence not to try and throw a solution out there when you're in no position to have it implemented.

Rez, LOL. You may be onto something there.

lol Rez.....which "sock " was it?

it's a beautiful day

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NmmLvfzMuE

U2

" you own the road but you got no destination....."

" It's a beautiful day - don't let it get away! "

voom voom.....

peace~

"a few reasons people end up in that position: job loss, divorce, lawsuits, accidents, re-location, death of a spouse"

Those reasons make sense.

Great job sock...

You are realizing now something we were aware of 2 years ago!

Go to www.ml-implode.com. Lenders number 10-47 are the first 3 months of 2007. You are hard pressed to find a conforming lender on that list.

48-69 are just the month of April 2007 and still only Sub Prime lenders.

Wells Fargo was the first big bank to hit the list, 9/07 and it was for their Alt A and Sub prime divisions.

Conforming borrowers got pulled the mess after the economies of heavily foreclosed areas saw economic factors worsen with layoffs becoming pervasive in those areas.

The real shock waves in the industry were in the Summer of 2007 when the panic really hit the banks and investment companies who were providing the warehouse lines lenders were using to make loans. Once they started to panic and started demanding complete reimbursement of any outstanding funds on their lines, that's what caused credit to severely tighten on the lending side. People were afraid to make any kind of loans because with MBS performing so poorly, no one knew if they could resell the loan after the fact.

From what I have seen, a lot of the conforming loan delinquencies aren't on primary residences but on investment properties. While the rental markets have improved, rentals in areas like Florida, Vegas have tanked. When you factor in the increased property tax burdens for property owners in these areas, it's not surprising that delinquencies went up.

Had the Fed not waited until today to declare they were going to buy MBS and instead did so in 2007, the landing for most would have been softer and a lot of wealth would have been preserved.

What happened this time around is very similar to what happened in the late 90's when the failure of Russian Hedge Funds caused some high profile failures

The Big 10 Battleground Polls listed on the left column of RCP show why McCain was in Iowa this week..

Iowa ..Tie
Penn..Tie
Minn...0 +2
Everyone should take a look at the states listed there.

Thank you to those who post information that just doesn't support their point of view.

Rezdog,

Well stated and there is a reason why "marketing gurus" for Loan officers tell you to partner with CPA's, Financial planners, divorce lawyers to get leads.

Rez, I guess he wasn't referring to the Federal Erection Commission after all.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/19/mccain-confuses-sec-with_n_127686.html

Election, Erection, S, F, who could possibly keep all that straight?

Ok Bear, that's it, investment property devaluing and causing problems.

Bear

Don't get too exercised. You are arguing with one of the anonymous trolls who don't even deserve to be read much less responded to.

RCP also has interesting Marist polls and their RCP
averages..I think if you look at it all, you can get a reasoned picture of how things are going.

It wasn't just investment properties...but in areas like Florida and Nevada, they were the major reason. The market conditions led to a lot of speculation in the market and people got burned due to greed.

Hey OD,
I have most poll site bookmarked but for us lazy aholes could you post a link. TIA

I'm not getting exorcised but thanks Jamie. I always find it laughable when someone outside the industry thinks they know it better than people in it...lol

The point he's missing is that this has been a domino effect...

Wow...McCain pissed off Fox with a new Ad...

http://www.politico.com/blogs/michaelcalderone/0908/Fox_demands_McCain_camp_remove_Garrett_from_ad.html?showall

OD, these things change, but RCP shows 10 states as tossups. MI, PA and OH are obviously the biggees, with a total of 58 EVs. Forcing the data, RCP would project an Obama win of 8 electoral votes, including MI and PA, but not OH (consistent with E.J. Dionne's prediction), but they've changed the status on 5 states this week alone (actually 4 since MN changed twice), with Obama bettering McCain by 6 EVs in those states if the trends held.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/maps/obama_vs_mccain/?map=5

Interesting noodling.

McCain being accused of injecting race into economic crisis...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYI0mHWQeD8

If people in the mortgage business are so wise -- why is it the victim in this mess. Being a part of an industry doesn't imbue you with special knowledge, more like puts on blinders not too mention --your self congratualatory dance about how great your company is.

Bear,

What is funny is that five years ago, I told my right wing buddy that we were heading for a crash and to put his investments in as many safe places as he could find. He told me it was going to be a boom with the Republicans in charge.

Today I sent him an email asking if I could put a check in the "I'm officially right!" box and asking if he was okay. Got back an answer, "check the box all is well, I took your advice! lol"

A day later, McCain echoed Rove's advice. On Thursday evening, the Senator's campaign released an advertisement declaring that Frank Raines was an Obama economic adviser. "Shocking," declared the ad, citing the mismanagement that occurred under Raines' reign, as well as his large compensation package. Shocking, indeed. The Associated Press and other news outlets reported hours later that the claim was not honest. Raines had even told a senior McCain aide, in a private email, that he was not an Obama adviser.

Why did the Washington Post lie about Raines role in obama's campaign

http://althouse.blogspot.com/2008/09/so-is-franklin-raines-obama-economic.html

And it's denying that Raines is an advisor. But then the Washington Post would have to be wrong. You can't bash McCain for basing the ad on the info in the Post and specifically identifying the Post as the source.

Here's what the Post has today:

The McCain campaign cited a July Washington Post profile of Raines as the source for his connection to Obama. In that profile, it was reported that he had "taken calls from Barack Obama's presidential campaign seeking his advice on mortgage and housing policy matters." In a statement issued by the Obama campaign late Thursday, Raines strongly denied having provided counsel to Obama, saying: "I am not an advisor to Barack Obama, nor have I provided his campaign with advice on housing or economic matters."

That's all, which I take to mean the WaPo stands behind its original reporting. If the original reporting is true, then Raines is an Obama advisor and a liar.

Bear

Now a fanny mae executive is the same as Willie Horton?

I gotta say it,
One consistant thing about the Obama campaign. when they get their backs against the wall they start screaming racism. Is this
from the Obama campaign or silly supporters like those morons in Ohio.

Jack

Rez..In the past a couple of people generously instructed me about how to post a link. It did not work. If someone would do this again, I would try once more.
Three months ago I got a new printer and had to have a friend install it for me.

Pogo..6 months ago I wouldn't have dreamed such a close race at this point. I pretty much assumed a fairly close race at the end, but figured Dems would have a
hefty lead in late Sept..

Hey Sock Drawer,

Couldn't help but sense some anger...did someone charge you 4 points for the Option ARM you're stuck in? lol

The problem with cutting and pasting to make your points is that you fail to read what you post...it causes you to miss the point that you are contradicting yourself.

I know it's stuff blogging in your "socks" while living in your mommies basement but the adults are trying to have a conversation here. Maybe you should go turn on the cartoons...

If you don't want to lose an argument to the flaming liberals...don't pick a fight in an area where you clearly know nothing.

Next thing you are going to tell us that Barack Obama is a better pilot than John McCain because he has a higher score on the Flight Simulator game he has on his laptop...

OD,
when posting a link. . go to the page and drop down the edit menu, click on copy and then go to comment box and put cursor in box and hit Ctrl V at same time or click paste from edit menu again.

Whatever

Vinegar is not made with sour grapes.

I cut and pasted nothing but presented alternative theories and evidence to the conventional wisdom being presented here as fact. Of course if you subsist on hope then facts get in the way of your narrative.

Jack,

That's a HuffPost assessment, not a campaign assessment. I think as a political ad, it will work well because it will sway the people like Sock that don't understand the nature of what happened.

If one want's to question the fact that the bad faces in the ad are black and the hapless victim is an older white woman, then that is something that can be argued.

The bigger story is that Karl Rove said on Fox news Wednesday that he would attack Obama with that line of attack and it's magically an ad the next day...remember Rove has said he isn't an advisor to the campaign.

OD,

try going to the page you want to link and then click in the url box at top of browser then go to drop down edit menu and clink copy then when you want to past use either Ctrl v or paste from edit menu.

What is it with Liberals, far of the Left wall Liberals, and race?
Just a very strange for a self-proclaimed lesbian feminist to say.

http://www.monstersandcritics.com/people/news/article_1431947.php/Sandra_Bernhards_gang-rape_warning_for_Sarah_Palin___VIDEO

One question I haven't seen asked today...if Republicans are for this bailout, can they still claim to be for smaller government?

Is this grab at sweeping new powers over the economy any different than using FISA as a power grab for domestic surveillance?

Fry,

Why are you watching anything with Sandra Bernhard in it?

In housing...

The House Financial Services Committee adopted H.R. 6694, legislation designed to reauthorize and reform down payment assistance programs that the Bush Administration banned in July.

HR 6694 would allow qualified borrowers with credit scores of 680 or above to use seller-funded down-payment assistance on FHA-backed loans. Borrowers with scores between 620-680 will be subject to risk-based pricing and higher insurance premium fees.

"One consistant thing about the Obama campaign. when they get their backs against the wall they start screaming racism."

Jack, we had a nice little discussion about this last nite. And in summary, several agreed that in SOME instances(states), not all, racism is a possibly a rationale for Obama lagging. Actually Pogo alluded to it yesterday in regards to southern WV.

And my main emphasis was that notion is an elephant in the room in some of these cases. And where to even suggest it, gets a race baiting retort. i guess it depends on ones sensibilities and the one pointing it (racism) out. i.e. no one accused Pogo of race baiting yesterday.

Dude,

I tried to read your link Fry and I decided after seeing her face that I would much rather see Joe Theisman's leg snap on a loop before I try to look at her again...closest thing to Medusa alive right now...

Bear,

She is a big BHO supporters. One of your kind.

Have I missed something? Bear and sock disagree on the root cause of the financial crisis. Since when is disagreement a problem?

OD

point with cursor and Right click on the URL you want to bring over
this will highlight the whole URL
on the drop down menu left click on "copy"
Come here
left click to put cursor in the comment box
right click
then left click on "Paste" on the drop down menu

Bear

Huffpo makes sense , like MSNBC they seem populated with sensationalist creating idiots.

I don't believe the Obama campaign wants anything taking peoples attention away from the news of the day. I know I wouldn't.

As for Rove saying something and McCain doing something there is a lot of connection between Rove and the McCain advisors. Which is the dog and which is the tail? Who knows. Shop talk may flow freely.

Jack

O Brother, Where Art Thou?

http://www.breitbart.tv/html/178233.html

Fry,

Them is fighting words..."One of my kind"...

When the lipstick on a pig was the issue...she was the poster...

What I am surprised about is why your kind never ran with this story Fry...

http://www.dailysquib.co.uk/?c=117&a=1227

Speaking from his Kentucky office in Dawson Springs, the Imperial Wizard exclaimed that anything or anyone is better than having that "crazy ass bitch" as President.

This is the first time in Klan history that any member of the KKK has ever publicly supported an African American candidate for the presidency.

"The boy's gonna do it. My Klan group has donated up to $250,000 to the Obama fund. Anything is better than Hillary Clinton. Hell I'll even adopt a black kid from Africa before I vote for Hillary."

"A few years back we were lynching negroes. Now we're gonna vote for one to be president of the US of motherfu**ing A, damn it! Anyone or anything is better than Hillary Clinton - anything!!"

Rez and Jamie..

Thank you..I will give it a go tomorrow..Off to work now..

Bear, I didn't ask the question exactly, but I mentioned the contradiction.

"But the hilarity of McCain calling for MORE regulation of the financial markets (read - bigger government and less free market operation in the most basic sector of our economy) just cracks me up. Another position shift for him. Anyone keeping score?"

Hey, OD, try this - highlight what you want to copy by putting the cursor on the first character, left click and drag the mouse to the last character, right click in the highlighted block, left click on "copy", come to the comments block, right click your mouse, left click on "paste" (or just do "control V" when the cursor is in the comment block before you right click.

Bear

That is the kind of hatred that the Clinton supporters were seeing from all sides, with particular venom coming from other Democrats. No wonder we felt as if we were under siege. I may be backing Obama now, but it took a lot to get over the hurt, anger, and very decided feeling that the voters had made a serious error.

Obama Surrogates Claim Race Is Factor In Voting.

http://www.wytv.com/news/local/28423644.html

Silly goobers. BHO will lose because he is unfit to serve. It has nothing to do with "race". But please keep making race the issue. Your stupidity uttering such foolish assertions will only seal BHO's defeat. This is why you don't let your children play with live grenades.

A question for Joe Biden, U. S. Senator from the state of Dealawre.

If paying taxes is patriotic, then the poor who don't pay taxes are what?

A question for Joe Biden, U. S. Senator from the state of Dealawre.

If paying taxes is patriotic, then the poor who don't pay taxes are what?

Posted by: FryDaddy | September 19, 2008 3:48 PM

FryDaddy, can't you even stop your attacks on the poor when it's your birthday? We are all glad to know you are so financially secure and happy about your wealth, but the question is mean spirited. And btw, the poor pay more taxes than you think.

No different than the corporations that don't pay taxes either Fry.

The poor don't pay because they are told they don't make enough. The corporations don't pay because they make enough to pay someone to make it look like they don't make enough to pay.

You really should start your own blog Fry...I'm curious to see what you'd do with it...

Rez

Your statement and Pogo's statement are two different statements.

Nobody is denying there are racist in the world and that they are voting in the election. What you are trying to say, that if not for Obama, these racist would vote Democratic. That is silly as they haven't voted democratic in years.

Obama is not making the sale in the suburbs. I know a black man can compete in the suburbs, I've seen it. Why is this man having trouble when other blacks don't? In Missouri he has lost independents that voted for him in the primary.

Jack

Fry, I see that you don't need to wonder why people hold the opinion that republicans don't have compassion for the disadvantaged.

Franklin Raines, who's now an Obama insider, economic advisor. Another name you better get to know, cause you'll be hearing a lot of it. LMAO How much money did Raines leave with? $100 million. Is BHO aware of this, has no one told him? Jim Johnson? Freddie and Fanny gave how much $$$ to BHO? Always look at their friends as this will tell more about the person, then all the pretty picture they keep trotting out.

True ET,

Everyone pays sales tax and if you own a house, you pay property taxes.

Jack, what statement did I make about race? I don't recall making one.

Pogo,

You said you knew people that would never vote for Obama because he's black...

This was funny last night...
http://www.examiner.com/x-243-Progressive-Politics-Examiner~y2008m9d19-Colbert-cuts-to-the-chase?cid=Examiner Link To Post

Jack,
Ask Pogo what he meant about why Obama was not doing so well in WV. You were the one wondering ?? If I recall he said in many places there Black could never be elected.

"What you are trying to say, that if not for Obama, these racist would vote Democratic."

Wrong. Not what I was saying or intending to say.

What you not saying (denying) or believing is that some people, Democrats, are not voting for Obama because of his race. Hell, many indicated that in exit polling during the PA primary. Did you not catch that?
MO was not a part of the discussion and it is agreed that racism is not an issue in all instances(locales).

Repeating the lies, Fry. Raines wrote directly to Carly and informed her that he does not advise the Obama campaign and that the Post's information was in error.

Forgot the all important link.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/23/AR2006052300184.html

Fry, I see that you don't need to wonder why people hold the opinion that republicans don't have compassion for the disadvantaged.

Posted by: pogo | September 19, 2008 3:57 PM

Amen Pogo... Let them eat cake...

I really believe that Republicans would rather go to the times described in Oliver Twist... slave labor, debtors prisons, and the like. The Repugs are mostly like Scrooge. They'd like to see the poor and needy just die off and do away with the "excess population"...

Same thing with abortion. "Life is sacred" they say. Yet the opponents of abortion are the same ones who don't give a care once the baby is born.

Sick!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/19/itimei-new-mccain-attack_n_127670.html

ET, and of course they support capital punishment.

pogo,

Just using Joe's own words. He is the one who associating paying taxes with patriotism. I thought it then and I think it now pretty foolish, but that is Joe for you, always opening his mouth and inserting both feet.

Fry when someone confronts you with a response to what you have written, you rarely respond. Instead, you move on to something else or create some sort of "red herring" to twist the discussion around. It's an "avoidance" tactic.. throw up these partisan-laden templates and then move on to another such attack. It's a really bad tactic, I am sorry to say.

Oops, forgot to mention - this was for Fry.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/19/itimei-new-mccain-attack_n_127670.html

Pogo,

The only time that rich folk have had any use for the poor is when they've needed bullet catchers to either draft or staff the army...

AND: WaPo's Howard Kurtz says:

The commercial's main charge is based on an April story in The Washington Post that said Raines has "taken calls from Barack Obama's presidential campaign seeking his advice on mortgage and housing policy matters." Reporter Anita Huslin says Raines told her that during an in-person interview....

Anyone catch the Bill Clinton interview on CNBC yesterday?

Actually, I rather agree with Joe Biden (glad to hear he is still around; maybe the Powerpuff Girl is over-staying her adorning welcome).

Biden is basically saying that if you love America, you are patriotic. If you love America, you would gladly pay taxes because America is worth it! if you don't think America is worth supporting, you would continue to complain about having to pay your fair share to keep the country up and running.

Opposing taxation is unpatriotic...

The United Socialistic System BHO, or simply the USS BHO, is going down by the bow. This is the last lifeboat, women and children off first. Mr. BHO I said women and children off first, the captain has to remain with his sinking ship.

If being a part of the mortgage industry meant anything
then that would make Angelo Mozilo an oracle. Doubt if anyone is a beating a path to his door.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147999

There you go again Fry. To try and firm up your position, you use incendiary labels to make the case that taxes bad, poor people bad, rich people good. Off with their heads!

Pay your taxes. Be patriotic like Joe wants you to be. If you pay more than your share of taxes, you'll be even more patriotic.

LMAO. Team BHO, what a bunch of hypocritical goobers. LMAO

Pogo,

The only time that rich folk have had any use for the poor is when they've needed bullet catchers to either draft or staff the army...

Posted by: Bear | September 19, 2008 4:06 PM

Not true Bear, they are also valuable to clean hotel rooms or work for rich families, cooking, cleaning and taking care of the privileged children.

Fry, do explain. what EXACTLY is "more than your share of taxes"?

Hey ET,

How is the station doing today? Did you have a disruption of supply when Russia went into Georgia? If so how long did it last?

ET,

You'll have to ask Joe Biden.

My station is doing fine thank you very much. We have no disruptions of oil deliveries in Belgium that I am aware of (and I am not even sure that it comes from Russia, but maybe..)

But back to my question, what EXACTLY is "more than your share of taxes"?

Someone refresh my memory...

Al Gore's social security lock box was mocked since insolvency was something like 40 years away.

Now that McCain wants to privatize a portion of SS, he's arguing that it will be insolvent soon and it's a necessary step.

If the insolvency period has been halved at least, what did the Republicans do to waste that money...did it all go to Iraq and bailouts?

Pogo

Firedoglake's West Virginia contingent is weighing in...
it's the economy stupid..

http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/19/whats-up-with-west-virginia/

No Joe Biden didn't use that phrase, you did. I have yet to read anything from you saying taxation is ever good, and you seem genuinely irritated that people have to pay taxes. So offer alternatives... what taxes should be paid? what shouldn't? How do we keep the system healthy and running if the tax base is basically eliminated?

Should you have missed it, in BHO's own words. See link. It will take some reading, a pencil and paper to figure it all out.

Is it "Families", or "Individuals"? You know, "People" has a nice non-specific ring to it.

The D primary debate held in Philadelphia, between BHO and HRC. BHO has unwittingly told us who will have their taxes raised to pay for his laundry list of "free" give aways. That figure will be brought down overtime from people (it is actually families not individuals, but when they say people it make you think of individuals), making over $250 to $75K, as there is no way he can pay for all his "free" give aways. Either that, or as he has said, it all depends of the economics at the time. Well since the economics aren't about to change anytime soon, that means he can't raise taxes, a good thing, and he won't be able to fulfill his free give aways, another good thing.

transcript: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/us/politics/16text-debate.html

Rez, jack, bear, that is true, I did say a black could not get elected in many parts of WV. I didn't realize Jack was referring to that comment from yesterday. I stand by that - it's based on my observation of bias here. If that's race rearing its ugly head, I plead guilty. I also said the 2nd amendment issue would seal the deal here. I wasn't bemoaning the fact that race will be a factor here, just making the observation. For that matter I am also aware that there are people I know in OH, lifelong democrats, btw, who are taking the same position - and no efforts of mine have dissuaded them from declaring their intent to vote for McCain because Obama is black. It's a stupid reason to vote for a candidate who stands for everything they oppose, but that's what they tell me they are going to do. Wven so, I don't see race being the issue in the broad sense in this election that some others do. There are other issues that I believe will swing the election to one candidate or the other in close states, and am not one of the people who blame Obama's soft support on race in most close states.

If I already posted this, shoot me.

I am going to expand my question to Fry to ask everyone here who has an opinion, particularly if you are against taxation. If you don't want to pay taxes, what is the alternative? What are the ramifications if taxation is eliminated or even greatly reduced? What services are you willing to give up in exchange for a smaller tax obligation? Do you object to taxation? Is it ideological? If you end taxation, is it also time to end Corporate welfare? I would like a real discussion about this. I have thought a long time about taxes and I can't imagine how a society can thrive, much less survive, without them...

Let me tell you how it will be;
There's one for you, nineteen for me.
'Cause I’m the taxman,
Yeah, I’m the taxman.

Should five per cent appear too small,
Be thankful I don't take it all.
'Cause I’m the taxman,
Yeah, I’m the taxman.

Don't ask me what I want it for,
If you don't want to pay some more.
'Cause I’m the taxman,
Yeah, I’m the taxman.

And you're working for no one but me.

KC, Christie is a good one. She could be right and I could be wrong. But if WVians voted their economic interests, GWB would not be president today In the past 2 elections they voted for the good old boy, gun toting dumya instead of the Dem who was singing an economic tune that should have appealed to them. Maybe a few of them have waked up. CHS is right about the need for Obama to practice retail politics here if the 3-5 point margin is real and he thinks the state could swing his way, but as i noted yesterday, one of the 2 pollsters who came up with results in that range thinks that's as good as it will get for Obama here.

Sock Drawer...

If being in the Senate for 26 years means anything, it makes McCain an Oracle too right?

I left a lot of money on the table because I would never originate option arms where I could make 5 points by selling just the minimum payment, which would reset the loan in 20 months, while putting a 3 year prepay on the loan.

I saw people do that and would make $75,000 on one deal.

My conscience wouldn't allow me to do such a thing to a client. You won't say what your background is, fine. If you worked in the mortgage business, I would like to hear your story. I've always treated my clients the same way I would treat family or friends.

Raines lying now or lying in April?

Doesn't say much for the Post's reporting

Howard Kurtz is the media critic

AND: WaPo's Howard Kurtz says:

The commercial's main charge is based on an April story in The Washington Post that said Raines has "taken calls from Barack Obama's presidential campaign seeking his advice on mortgage and housing policy matters." Reporter Anita Huslin says Raines told her that during an in-person interview....

MONEY !!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkRIbUT6u7Q

Well, I think I'll be moseying along now. Everyone have a good weekend.

Oh, KC, btw, wadr to Christie, RCP still shows WV as bright red in the pres. race.

Pogo,

Thx, that was what I gathered from your post yesterday. In the link KGC put up, race doesn't appear to be much of an issue. But didn't you specifically mention the southern portion of the state. ?? Anyway, I wasn't suggesting that you were screaming racism, just mentioning it as a contributing factor as much as any others in his soft showing.

Pogo

Hopefully she is right! And Obama's campaign takes her advice.

ET
I was very disappointed when Pelosi took the Obey war tax off the table. Democrats should not be afraid of the tax issue.

Euro,

Excellent question. People would look differently at tax cuts were they labeled as service cuts instead.

I had a client in Arizona who would not sign the W-9 in his closing package. This is the form which confirms your social security number and allows you to deduct your mortgage interest. This borrower wouldn't sign it because he didn't recognize the Federal Government's right to tax he or his wife.

After pointing out that he couldn't get his equity loan proceeds, he still refused. Finally my manager picked up the phone and asked him the following:

Q. "So you feel the government doesn't have the right to tax you, correct?"

A. "That's right and we've felt that way for years."

Q. "So you felt that way, but you had no problem seeking bankruptcy protection from the government so you wouldn't have to pay back your creditors 2 years ago right?"

About 15 minutes later, the forms got faxed to me...

The campaign went with an ad that flat out lied, it's the campaign's job to make sure the facts are correct. So much for that buck stop here attitude the straight talk campaign keeps trying to sell us on.

Looks like karma to me. Obama used material from a descredited Washington Post story against Clinton during the primary.
.
But the story about Raines had not been retracted. So was he lying to the reporter in April or is he lying now?

Believe In Sexual Eruption

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT2GhPvEdQA

I thought McCain was Hoover. Get your manipulations straight.

Will Bush become the new Hoover?

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13632.html

That would SUCK

If the Democrats lose, it will not be Hillary Clinton's fault

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2008/9/19/164021/710

Fry your 3:57 post

Johnson left with a retirement of 110,000 per month...
quite sure he is going to be for the poor-middle class.

julie

Must be nice!

I recall being summons for jury duty both here in WA and OK, and most recently when I called to inquiry with the Court Clerk, she casually mention that I could be arrested for non-compliance.
Now i read where Mr first dunce, T Palin, gets a State Congressional summons/supoena and he basically tells them to put it where the sun don't shine.

I'd have a SWAT team outside surrounding my house if that were me.

Special people. Reminds me a lot of Bush /Cheney.

Here's an interesting take about the bailouts...

http://redtape.msnbc.com/2008/09/in-exchange-for.html

"Remember, this is the same industry that would show no mercy to a depositor who dipped 78 cents into the red when buying a hamburger with a debit card. The same banks that routinely charge $35 in fees to lend the shopper that 78 cents. I assure you, we will not get the same kind of return on our largesse."

Hey FryDaddy. . Hillary's looking for a few good men. LMAO

Hillary Sent Me is a grass-roots efforts through HillPac that will focus on Obama and critical congressional and senate races in the battleground states between now and Election day. From link posted by KGC.

http://hillpac.com/

Here are two more links...

One funny...

http://www.break.com/index/fan-at-ballgame-parties-too-hard.html

Ok right wingers, I am still trying to get an answer on what taxes you want eliminated...

One even funnier...

Seems that McCain's academic prowess put him behind our sitting President...

http://caffertyfile.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/19/how-does-the-wsj-article-affect-mccain/

When you graduate 894th out of a class of 899, eventually it will show up.

And John McCain’s mediocre performance at the Naval Academy is showing up big time this week in his total lack of understanding of the nation’s financial crisis.

How Bry Bry of you.

Your high horse is in a trough.

If McCain doesn't understand the economy, he's not the only one. The economic system, much like the legal system and the tax code, is deliberately convoluted for a reason.

"All the perplexities, confusion and distress in America arise, not from defects in their Constitution or Confederation, not from want of honor or virtue, so much as from the downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit and circulation."

-John Adams

Palin Can Launch Us Back in Time

(A rather provocative article)

Her personal comparisons to Hillary Clinton are insulting to Clinton. Senator Clinton did not stoop to use of her sexuality as a means of attracting votes or attention. She is articulate and stays on message, whether in the primaries or campaigning for Obama. Hillary's supporters, men and women, accepted her for her experience, her credentials and her qualifications, deservedly so, unlike Palin who is trying to steal mileage on the shirttails of Hillary.

http://www.truthout.org/article/palin-can-launch-us-back-time

"I assure you, we will not get the same kind of return on our largesse."

Bear, Ain't that the truth.

Bry Bry

Your ignorance is showing.

FD

If you hold 95% of the nation's wealth, but pay only 70% of the nation's taxes and complain that the holder's of 5% of the nation's wealth who pay 30% of the nation's taxes aren't paying their fair share, doesn't that make you a deadbeat?

Call me Pollyanna, and I won't know for sure until November, but I think there may be a closet anti-racism in many of the red and pink states.

We know that the younger the cohort, the less likely they are to be strongly racist (they have simply had too much exposure to other races in music, movies, school et.)

There has been a massive effort to get everyone over 18 registered. Now I know their record of going to the polls is checkered to say the least, but I think this year may be exciting enough to make them make the effort.

Could they be telling pollsters, parents, acquaintances one thing while believing something else and when they actually cast that vote, they'll vote for the black guy because they don't really care that he is black?

Ergo: Landslide

You seem to be making the assumption that all young people will vote Democratic. A false assumption from my observation.

Champ

There are young Republicans, but the registrations for the Democratic party are overwhelmingly higher. I would think new voters would register with the party they intend to support at least the first time around.

Stewart A. Alexander
Nominee for U.S. Vice President of the Socialist Party USA,
and candidate for nomination by the Peace and Freedom Party

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2007/11/369231.shtml

Last December Mr. Alexander made suggestions for looming financial crisis. We are all socialists now.

Jamie, a large part of those registrations are made at rock concerts and festivals. You can be the judge on how valuable they are.

Interesting to see what Spain is doing to combat their immigrant problem...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26792948/

Err Champ

That was the point of my post. Read part about usual turnout of this age cohort. I believe that this year they may feel that they have a vested interest in this race.

After all, they are the ones likely to get stuck with the bill for all these bailouts and no one is rushing to take their college loans off their hands.

They may want to be in a position to say, "As long as you are throwing around money that isn't really there, how about sending some of it my way or to make my world a better place?

I just think your argument is based on a false pretense, but maybe; who knows? Time will tell.

...'premise', excuse me.

Oh well, pardon me for not replying to every asinine post you make, your highness. Phil Gramm's a tool, to answer your question. You happy now?

Jamie; 9:39 pm previous thread...................... Jamie, I've already said I won't vote republican, but even if I wanted to, who can tell me on all HONESTY that this congress is any better than before 2006 - they just have more seats-with the exception of a few: Whitehouse, Conyers, Maxine Waters, Feinstein, Boxer, Sheila Jackson Lee, Clinton, Webb, Tasker, Patty Murray and a few others, the rest are as cynical, as corrupt(Dodd) as the repugs. I am not defending the republicans, I AM saying they are 2 sides of the same coin........ And in the interest of civil discussion, I would like to ask about your 9:47 post stating that, "people are incredibly stupid". Why do you assume that it's because he's a stranger of another race that I, and people like me oppose him. "If you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas," so because of his (maybe)past WHITE associations, I believe he would rob me as fast as the repugs and possibly with less conscience because he had to buck so many odds to get there. Oh, and one other thing, I have never been racist in all my 62 years, but this election is making me rethink a lot of things, especially along the lines of "extortion".....................................................

Rita

""If you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas," so because of his (maybe)past WHITE associations, I believe he would rob me as fast as the repugs and possibly with less conscience because he had to buck so many odds to get there. Oh, and one other thing, I have never been racist in all my 62 years, but this election is making me rethink a lot of things, especially along the lines of "extortion"

Judging by these comments, Bob Barr may just suit you.

You might also take a look at Chuck Baldwin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Baldwin_presidential_campaign,_2008

America is broke.

A side-note, the staunch republicans I know get really testy when their dear old money is at risk.....I think you may see some of them voting for Obama but not dare telling their friends. This group is generally quite sure that Democrats as a whole are stupid....and they would never, ever want to be caught voting for a Democrat for POTUS.

At first glance I thought today's post was about famous political ads being recycled.

I found this site: http://www.livingroomcandidate.org/
It is an online resource of political ads. (Paid for by Verizon - just be warned they probably keep a record of your visits.)

Nice week folks

It took John McCain about 60 days and tens of millions of advertising dollars to whittle Obama's lead down from roughly 5 points at its peak in early June, to the 1-point lead that Obama held heading into the conventions. Obama has swing the numbers that much in barely a week.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/

They need to get th hell out of IRAQ, another big screw up.....

BUSH should put a sign up that say's " GONE FISHING with the word fishing crossed off and replaced with PRISON."

Erin Burnett...I love her......she will be worth listening to....on Hardball

" Privatized wealth and socialize debt "

" literally a melt down....."

~ Chris Dodd

Can't help but wonder what Bill Maher will do with this mess tonight.

Yeah, I suspect Maher will have one heck of a comment...

Bush is still out to lunch, he is no leader....he's been out to lunch since the day he was born.....

Privatized wealth and socialize debt "

Yeah that's the GOP way alright. Take the profits for themselves individually and leave us, thetaxpayers with the losses.

Hey it's Friday . .
I hear the bells and whistles of the casino beckoning lol

later all

The Beatles - Revolution

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87yq372R4Ts

lucky.....

Good luck Rez!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_h7SZTU2Q54

that was a weird clip.... not the one I thought it was....lol

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148103

UB That was a clip from "Across the Universe" which is a wonderful if terribly quirky movie whose whole soundtrack is beatles songs.

I really liked it, but as you can see from the reviews, it was one of those love/hate movies

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/across_the_universe/

Hi Rita,
Agree with your 6:28 post.
There are statements we are making here other than who we're going to vote, And we all come to this decision on our own terms and for any reason we choose.

Murdoch: Obama's economic policies are 'naive'

"I like Sen. Obama very much. I have met him. "He is a very intelligent man. But his policy of anti-globalization, protectionism, is going to be -- and card checks -- are going to do two or three things. It's going to give us a lot of inflation. They're going to ruin our relationships with the rest of the world. And they are going to slow down the rest of the world, too. And they're going to make people frightened to add to employment. You are going to find companies leaving this country if it's -- if you put a protectionist wall around it. You're going to get -- his policy is really very, very naive, old-fashioned, 1960s."
http://www.thrfeed.com/2008/09/murdoch-obamas.html

Murdoch also said the financial crisis was good for big companies.

If Obama is on the side of the middle class - rather than Murdoch's - I think he is fighting the good fight.

Murdoch will be fine - it is the middle class who needs a President.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-147752
"Americans have reason to be concerned how he would react under the very real pressures of the presidential office. What tough decisions has he made that illustrate the judgment to lead that he’s been claiming for the past 19 months?"

Julie, Exactly! How can we possibly know how he will respond.

Obama Is Stoking Racial Antagonism
"Mr. Obama's campaign is now trafficking in prejudice of its own making. And in doing so, it is playing with political dynamite. What kind of potential president would let his campaign knowingly extract two incomplete, out-of-context lines from two radio parodies and build a framework of hate around them in order to exploit racial tensions? The segregationists of the 1950s and 1960s were famous for such vile fear-mongering."
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122178554189155003.html

Bear, Flatus,

A little gallows humor, about the 2 day market rally I know you 2 will understand it.

http://bigpicture.typepad.com/comments/2008/09/industrials-big.html#more

Jack

Yeah Warren.
What would Murdoch know about Economic policies.

Plus - Bush has ruined our relationships around the world - and Obama would represent a clean break and a real opportunity to strengthen them.

Those 200,000 people cheering in Germany were a good thing - despite what the GOP slant machine said.

chloe - being a cut-throat businessman who knows how to make his own companies successful - does not translate into knowing what will be good for the economy as a whole.

Running an economy is not the same a running a business - just ask Carly Fiorina...

Just linking one persons opinion Warren. He's got an opinion just like you and me. Don't have to agree with him, but don't see any harm in listening to lots of different takes. Who knows, maybe he has a point.

Question -- Maybe someone has already asked this -- but if McCain has served on the Commerce Committee for decades -- including serving as Chairman of the Commerce Committee -- then why did he say that he didn't really know that much aobu the economy? The Commerce Committee is all about the economy!

He might chloe - but he was calling my man naive so I had to strike back.

I also think our friend Murdoch might have his own self-interest in mind - rather than the good of the American people...

Jamie,
I think I vaguely remember you mentioning that movie in the past. I think I will watch it.

The older I get the more I like the Beatles.

In New York, I often visit Strawberry Fields, and time after time it's the emotions of the visitors that keep John's ideas of love and peace alive. Here is a photo of my first visit, not until today did I notice and recognize the meaning of the Green Apple. ( I guess I wasn't paying attention.)

http://i35.tinypic.com/fbl2c3.jpg

"Murdoch might have his own self-interest in mind - rather than the good of the American people"

Or he may see it in his best interest if the American people do well too Warren. But I understand you have to strike back at anyone who may disagree with 'your man'. Not looking for an argument here. I respect your opinion too. Your's and Ruperts.

I hear ya chloe - but it just strikes me that a couple of Obama's policies - such as taxing the rich and trying to discourage sending jobs overseas - benefit the middle class at the expense of rich and powerful businessmen.

Now I don't see that as class warfare. I see it as helping those who need it most. The Murdochs of the world are going to be just fine. (Even if they have to scale back the number of trips on their private plane due to rising oil prices...)

The motto of the rich is " every man for himself "

I would loved to be proven wrong on this one.

Alicia, you have to give McCain a break, he's a POW from the last century, and he has been in Washington for at least 21 years....he can't be held accountable.

~~~~What in the world are you thinking ?~~~

Time to hit the Scotch so I can really get fired up!!

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148124

Alicia,

Because the truth is that McCain doesn't know a whole lot about anything. His work in the Senate has been done in whole or in part by others and he has a reputation for being lazy, frequently missing votes and absent for extensive periods.

He was very low in his graduating class at Annapolis. That he made it at all, indicates brains, he just doesn't give them a whole lot of exercise, preferring cliche's and platitudes to any actual research or gathering of information.

Warren, I have no doubt that you know a lot more about the economy (and Obama) than I do. I didn't put too much stock into what Murdoch said. It was more of a human interest story to me than anything else. I wasn't endorsing it.

But I do hope that Obama listens to opinions outside his immediate circle. Opposing opinions.

For any Obama supporter out there ( i believe there may be a few) , this is kind of fun.....ring tones for your cells......all free.

http://www.barackobama.com/mobilev2/

http://thepage.time.com/the-page-scorecard-sept-10-17/

The State of the Race
"I've broken the national polling into two sorting categories. First, we sort by pollster. We group the Gallup polls together, then the Rasmussen polls, then the remaining polls.

Second, we sort by date. We group the polls for June, then for July, then for August prior to the conventions, then for today."

Here are the results.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/horseraceblog/2008/09/the_state_of_the_race.html

Jamie,
I was really disturbed to learn about McCain 's record at Annapolis.......most people that go there, and their parents, are absolutely drenched in pride. McCain's behavior would be a complete embarrassment and not excusable under any circumstances --- unless maybe if you were a legacy.

There is also the long-standing - and growing - perception that the economy is the most important issue for the next President.

UB

You can get the apple on a T Shirt

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.garmentdistrict.com/store/rocktshirts/beatles/beatles-apple-z.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.garmentdistrict.com/store/rocktshirts/beatles/index_beatles.htm&h=300&w=250&sz=26&hl=en&start=1&sig2=AxyMqf-zEcDFK-FrgYybIA&usg=__0aPZ7p6SRLwj3GQ6AYScFLLVl3o=&tbnid=0XyMc_NSkBc_SM:&tbnh=116&tbnw=97&ei=bFHUSJnsPJTysAOXj9nHDw&prev=/images%3Fq%3DApple%2BBeatles%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4GGIH_enUS211US212

Perception is Reality,
You're right, perception is all that matters.

That scoreboard was interesting. And looked accurate. But the Democrats seem to consistently come out on top regarding the Economy. And the last couple of days, I've seen many opinions that believe this election will turn on the Economy. (?)

Didn't see your post Warren. You were way ahead of me.

cute....but you know what, with the bail-out, I can't afford to wear food I have to start growing it....lol

If Politico says so, it must be true.:)

Wall Street woes benefit Obama candidacy
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13649.html

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148142

So depending on the poll it is

Tied
+5 Obama
+2 Obama

After today, it is going to go even more up for Obama

sometimes the smallest things in life can make you laugh....so sitting at my desk....all of a sudden I hear

" Hi, this is Barack Obama , asking you to answer the call -- to change America." ( with a little tune in the background ) lololol it's fun but in reality, it's my son asking " can you pick me up?"

Rachel's show is good tonight.

In this economic climate, it might be a good idea if Congress read the definition of "Commonwealth"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commonwealth#U.S._states

Kentucky, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, and Virginia have designated themselves as "commonwealths" rather than as States.

For the knee jerkers in the crowd, this is not communism, but rather using the public purse for the public benefits: Roads, bridges, schools, parks, libraries ... all the things that miake life better for ALL of the citizens and assists them in improving their own lives.

Maybe if every law was required to carry an opening paragraph that said: Who Benefits? we might get some decent laws out of the dome.

LOLOL......you got the easy ones......come on, I'd wear the hat, but I don't wear hats, I'd wear a pin, but it just isn't my style, and I'd date Black Men for 8 years, but my husband would get a bit upset.......so you see I have very few options.... : )

: )

I wouldn't hold him to it as an iron clad promise, but I would dearly love to hear from Obama who he is considering for his cabinet. I know he can't make promises at this stage, but it would be nice to know who is in the conversation.

Turn to CNN

They are really hammering out the economic package now on its way to Congress

Checked C-SPAN they aren't in session. Will there be a Saturday session?

perfect, they'll invite you back.

gosh I was just going to ask who this guy was on the comedy channel...he's so funny.

It's funny that McCain was in the middle of the S & L debacle decades ago and now he is in the middle of the mortgage mess.

The discussion is saying there will be bad inflation. Gold anyone and Euros anyone?

Stories from the trenches.
An interesting post by an Obama canvaser and undecided voters, read the comments too.

http://blog.showmeprogress.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=1611

Jack

HUGE inflation.....my girl, Erin Burnett ,and Kramer confirmed it, better then a complete meltdown.....the price to pay.

So if you are a small consumer it won't hurt that much, but if you have a lot of costs(expenses)....it's going to be a b*tch.

I think I am in the middle of the spectrum.

End the Fed.

Yeah it's tough going door to door, but I also beleive that people are cut out for different types of support and campaigning.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148168

We should be in good shape as most of our expenses are fixed other than gas and food. I've already covered food by stealing from Peter to give Paul an extra $100. That gives us a 20% hike. Hope it's enough to keep Paul happy because Peter is really squeekying.

Musician Will. I . Am and Naomi Klein

Not sure who is on the panel

http://www.billmaher.com/

I love these pundits. They are all being sooooooooooooo very careful. They are afraid to say what I genuinely believe is happening. The Tsunami is gathering the waters and McCain is about to get swept away.

If I'm wrong, everyone can gang up on me and call me an idiot, but I think the election night map is going to look like the Pacific ocean.

Jamie; 6:42 pm ............ "judging by these comments", that's what Obama and company do best isn't it, JUDGE, to bad there's no judgement involved in the judging, I mean, Bob Barr, isn't he supposed to be the one filtering votes from MCain? You really do believe we're all stupid, don't you?...........................................

Rita

Beat 360 for tonight:

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/19/beat-360%c2%b0-91908/#comment-330410

I suggested:

Little Rabbit Foo Foo hopping through the forest ...

You don't need CNN, Jamie; I told you the 'election' was over yesterday.

I live in FL and it is going to be a tough state for Obama - but if Obama does win FL - he wins the election.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148179

You said you weren't voting for McCain, so I suggested Libertarian or Constitution party since they seemed to fit your comments.

Florida,
Considering that they have been experiencing a huge real-estate melt down -prior to the news of this week, add in when we head into high inflation and tourists based income and employment will evaporate......plus, there is a huge retirement population with funds that are solely dependent on the trends of the market.

I would hope it would go Obama.....sitting out is no longer an option. (imo)

Not sure about registration - but there are plenty of rednecks down here.

Some of them have no problem telling you they won't vote for Obama because he is black.

But I agree the economy can be the key with some of the conservative voters that voted for Bush in 2000 and 2004.

I also think when it comes to the debate on Foreign Policy - Obama needs to get the focus back on the decison to go in rather than the surge. And hammer home the point how much that war has cost.

"Stupid is, as stupid does," that's what Forrest Gump's mother said.

http://www.diageohotlinepoll.com/

Look at how the graph of "who can best handle the economy "went day to day. McCain plunged fro 40 to 36 monday to tues. but by the end of the week had made it up. where as Obama went down as the week progressed and the gap between the 2 closed a bit.

This is a new poll sponsered by an alcohol seller so caveat your ass.

Jack

I have two military comments.

Some of you may remember when my friends brother was killed. As I remember it was February- I just got word that his mother, just yesterday, received the last care package she sent to him that was never opened. She is absolutely beside herself , also just now, they returned his truck, she sits in the passenger's seat and bawls. So sad.

Second, now there is word that the USA is claiming certain soldiers were hit by friendly fire instead of opposition fire to keep the casualties numbers down.

Jamie

Beans and rice,
chicken necks for sunday dinner.

Jack

food is over-rated

In 5 years 1/2 of American banks will not exist.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/52822.html

In 5 years 1/2 of American banks will not exist.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/52822.html

what are the necessities? my view:
1. insurance (health and vehicle)
2. water
3. food
4. shelter
5. ???????

any changes are okay but what is #5 ?

money sitting idle = money at risk....that was never true before.

BAIL ME OUT ! ...........that's the bumper sticker for the middle class.

Julie

And Bank of America will have bought them all. It is the way they expand.

One of these days they will go down and take the FDIC with them. That will put the hurt on the little banks that play by the rules.

I doubt if smaller regional banks will be as badly burned by everything, as the big boys who were playing fast and loose.Those where the housing bubble expanded and then totally collapsed will.
But the rest of the country they should weather it OK.

That was just BOA blowing smoke imo.

Jack

Jack

Half seems like a whole whale of a lot of banks.

Julie

Chloe,

Are you still around? Just wondered how things are going down where you are? Do you have electicity or are you using the generator still? Supplies?

Julie

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148191

Jack, I cook from scratch which means that I can put a meal on the table much cheaper than someone who is looking to get it ther 30 minutes faster.

I probably should teach a course in hurry up food for a fast food nation. In the time you can go through a line at McDonalds, buty fodd for four people and drive home, I can give you a well balanced meal for half the price.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148195

Transport

Unless you are in a job that allows for telecommuniting, you need to drive to and from, use mass transit, car pool ... whatever.

9 million.... go Babs!

Champ:
You don't need CNN, Jamie; I told you the 'election' was over yesterday.

Posted by: champ | September 19, 2008 10:41 PM
Why do you think it was over yesterday?
So who wins in your opinion?

Julie

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148194

Julie,

That is what Senator Bernie Sanders was talking about today.

If something is too big to fail, then law should say that it is too big to exist.

Some of these economic monsters need to be broken up into smaller entitie.

Of course, that was at the heart of the old Taft-Hartley Act. There is such a thing as too big too be good for the world.

I teleport, ....I forgot about the others' commute, you are right on.....

my office is 2 mile from home....sometimes I walk, ride, or bike.

"Half seems like a whole whale of a lot of banks."

Julie

That is why I say he is blowing smoke.

I talked to an old high school friend, a small banker in southern MO., several months ago when the first round of credit crunchs were going on. He said they were doing fine because of the down payment requirements and their diversity.
He did do a bit of pass through loans to some of the big boys ( wells fargo as I recall) They were loaning up to 120% of the property value.
He told me about a deal he did where they did this on a doublewide trailerhouse where they did such a loan. But he did take on the risk he just passed it through. He is much more careful with his money.

Jack

Wahooooo

Andrew Sullivan: Those first Americans would have said to Al Qaida, "Come and get us. We will never throw away our freedomes for a phony security."

Bush is a lily livered coward, and he has killed thousands because he is a wimp.

Jack...

You charts really make me wish I had a machine that could time the markets perfectly...

As for your mortgage buddy...many smaller banks that do lending just within their communities will portfolio their loans...meaning they keep them in house and so they are more willing to assume risk for a neighbor. They know the area better and do a good job figuring out the risk as well.

This is pretty funny from Bill Maher...

http://therealbillmaher.blogspot.com/2008/09/republicans-stop-calling-obama-elitist.html

I have been meaning to say that seems like Obamas # 1 girl- Claire Mccaskill cannot even bring her own state to blue. Missouri is red for McCain..

People on this blog seem to put down - no quarter usa site - but.... they had the frog article of our host, Craig Crawford on a day or so ago.. So it can't be all bad.
I like to look at it just to see what is going on there.

julie

I think the banks across the board have been bullshitting loans.........I say this on good information.......I have heard about normally solid banks, increases incomes without the borrowers permission.

And as a result, if I know this, I can't even imagine what those directly connected to the industry know.

Julie,

No quarter was a go to site of GORDO when he was pushing the birth certificate story. That association was enough to discredit it in my eyes.

I have been curious to note the polling data coming from Missouri. It's all over the place but none of the results should give the Dems warm fuzzy's right now.

From what I remember in 2004, that was a late deciding state. I wonder what happens in polling immediately after next Friday's debate...

Bear

On election night if Kansas and Missouri go Obama, you have a tidal wave.

Bear,
But Gordo had as much right to post here as anyone else does, whether people liked it or not..

Yes, I am looking forward to the debates and polls afterwards.. might prove to be interesting. Missouri has a lot of rednecks and the race issue may very well play in their voting.

julie

Julie

The problem with Gordo is that he was probably a paid troll ... someone who was paid to push certain websites and increase trafic. He almost never responded to any attempts at interaction, just kept up with the cut and paste.

He has now disappeared which means that his probable paid gig has come to an end.

Julie,

I agree. After a while it became the same unsubstantiated crap and once you get to the level of top 40 radio where you hear the same song every 50 minutes...you just tune it out.

I love a free exchange of ideas, especially from people with a completely different perspective than me. So long as it's thought provoking and served up with some civility, I don't care what's being said if it makes me think...

What has me wondering about the Midwest, especially states with large farming populations, is how much the fact that Obama voted for the Farm Bill and McCain voted against it, will sway voters. I think that will help him win Iowa and at the end of the day help in WI and IN...whether it's enough to win, we will see...

Bear

And they are heavily regulated. I did realize how much until I first moved up here in the Eighties I got a little contracting business going and had a couple of government contracts. I need equipment so I went to my banker in the country. I assumed I could put up some of the cattle I still had at the time for collateral. He didn't want to as that would be a farm loan. He would take the equipment as colateral for a business loan.
I couldn't get $500 for a farm loan but ended up getting over $5000 on a business loan.
I ask him why.
He told me that the regulator told him he had change his banks portfolio and reduce the number of farm loans.

Jack

Kansas Senator Roberts had a 25 point lead last time I looked, Kansas will not go for Obama I can say in good conscience. That is why my vote would not count even If I voted for Hillary.. And I absolutely will not vote Obama.. And, I do think Sebelius will have a hard time getting re elected in 2010.. Many people here have said they do not like her now and wish they had not voted for her.

BTW,

After seeing McCain was ranked 845/849, that puts him in the same company as Ralph Nader. My godfather went to Harvard Law with Ralph and he always laughed that the guy who graduated at the bottom of the class would become it's most famous graduate.

Julie

Vote your conscience. I strongly suspect that Kansas will do the same, and you wouldn't want to feel left out.

It's hard to pick on an old man.....it seems a bit disrespectful.....but I think MCain has made his own bed.....

side note : 62 years old...go Dolly

Jamie

Obama would have had to live in Kansas to win it. They only vote for Democrats that they trust. And some times not even then. Sebilius is caught in a big regional fight over a power plant in western Kansas. that is opposed by the Johnson county/Wyndotte county city people. A lot of global warming stuff involved vrs rural development. Probably didn't help that she was standing along side a bunch of liberal Dems on the national stage.

Jack

UB

I'm 64. I have friends in their 80s and friends in their 40s. My children are in their 40s and I have grandchildren ranging from 29 to 12.

Today I was rocking out with my 12 yo grandson to 60s music teaching him to dance while watching all the political shows

I plan to die swinging from the chandeliers in the old folks home while celebrating my 100th birthday. There are people in their 30s older than I am.

McCain is a lot, lot older.

Jamie

I think Obama could have won Missouri, but he has never tried. IMO.

He is running a very bad ad campaign from what I've seen. People really need to be given a reason to vote for a big city urban liberal. It doesn't come natural to them. So they see him as no better than McCain and from Obama's ads they know McCain is trash.

Jack

the sun is going to sneak up on me too fast.......have a wonderful night....no one else owns it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAOclgppEXc

Jack

That is why I thing the "Hillary Sent Me" campaign will have an effect.

Jamie

Julie

As you know it will depend on which part of the Republican party is in charge. If the religious right get their candidate in then it is no problem for her. If they run a Johnson county moderate then she will be in for a fight. Doesn't Brownback come up for reelection in 2010? That might be a good alternative. I think she could take him.

Jack

no one would know your age Jamie , if you didn't tell.

: )

Julie

I for one definitely don't minimize the abuse of the Clinton voters in the caucuses. I lived through it in Washington. That is why it took me so long to say I would vote for Obama.

I still don't approve of what the DNC and the Obama campaign did. I don't trust them and I have to grit my teeth everytime I say that is the way my vote will go.

Still, HIllary is a Democat. I am a Democrat. Come November, we have a choice between what we know has raped this country and Obama.

I'm going to swallow hard and vote for Barack and hope he has the good sense to use Hillary where she will do him the most good.

Jamie

Julie vote doesn't count toward the presidential election. But she could do a lot of good on some of the local down ticket races.

Jack

UB

I know. If it weren't for pictures and in person appearances, I would be 36

That is the anniversary I celebrate and the age I decided I liked and have decided to stick at.

It really is a choice as I learned from my 90 year old aunt who really loved casinos and dancing. :-).

Yes and I will vote democrat on the down ticket .

Julie

Jamie

For many years I never celebrated my birthday. The last time I did was when I was twentyfive.

So I told people that they were getting old because they celebrated thir birthday, where as I was just a little past 25.

Then I met my wife and she celebrates birthdays so now I'm the same age as everybody else, just old.
eh what did you say?

Jack

Oh and by the way, not a one of you noticed that I now have a key. I wanted to say I was ???- but I forgot the words the children always said to their dad in " O Brother"...

Julie

Julie has a key.

Julie is a REAL person.

A commentaror extraoriniaire

WELCOME

The fifth necessity is love....

evening all. anyone spare a dime. . :-)

Jack

I don't have birthdays. I have anniversaries of my 36th birthday.

Pick a year that you really, really liked and be that age forever.

honey do, be right back..

Pick a year that you really, really liked and be that age forever.

Posted by: Jamie Author Profile Page | September 20, 2008 1:01 AM

Well, I picked 5, but then you castigate me for being immature. Not fair.

Rez

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZHEkU__Ijw&feature=related

They're just trying to be nice.

Anyone else see this story? It seems that many of the loopholes that John McCain wanted closed after McCain/Feingold, are now being exploited to raise funds for the stretch run...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26799209

First he says he would vote against the Immigration bill he wrote, now he's acting against the spirit of the finance law he wrote. Aren't those me first moves and not country first moves?

Rez

I've enjoyed playing poker with friends for years, so when the boats came to Kansas City and play a little poker or blackjack. Told myself I was just having a little fun. One night I left and I was down $100 dollars. As i drove home I got to thinking about it. I ask myself did I have a hundred dollars woth of fun? I got to thinking $100 buys a lot of whiskey good food. So, I guess I didn't have $100 worth of fun. I'm kind of a tight bastard so I have never been back.

Jack

Goodnight, old timer!

Did W abdicate yet?
Hows President Paulsen doing?

Rez

Don't get my hopes up

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26799578/

I guess this beats my paying $3 for a Brooks Brothers blazer last month...

Jack,

We broke even tonite so I feel okay. DW got to have a few as I was the DD. We win a little, we lose a litle. it's really all entertainment.since we have friends we bump into out there. and we're not big players. i learned a few lessons over the years and i like to keep my cash close too.

i actually feel sorry for both of the candidates being mauled by the media for answers that don't have becauseBush has ducked out the bacxk dioor.and unavailable.

Julie; 12:57 am ................................ "O Brother", Julie the words were - bona fides .......................................

Rita

Rita,

Thanks, I is now Bonafide. ha ha

Julie

Greta Van Susteran will have Bill Clinton interview on Tuesday night 10 Eastern time.. on Fox..

You really should start your own blog Fry...I'm curious to see what you'd do with it...

Posted by: Bear | September 19, 2008 3:52 PM

It would just be right wing pontifications without an original thought added.

Who want to read what a bigot writes

Julie

The problem with Gordo is that he was probably a paid troll ... someone who was paid to push certain websites and increase trafic. He almost never responded to any attempts at interaction, just kept up with the cut and paste.

He has now disappeared which means that his probable paid gig has come to an end.

Posted by: Jamie | September 20, 2008 12:10 AM

OH! Jamie that's a brilliant thought! I never even considered THAT option. I am a bit tired of the Hillary "posers"... the ones who claim they were always for Hillary but trash anything and everything the Dems stand for. I believe there is a specific agenda here in trying to appear like all the Hillary supporters have swung over to McInsane, more of the same. The American economy is facing a total financial meltdown and the Repug nominee says to stop bailouts and let the markets do their work. If he wins and the economy turns South, I hope his voters are the first to lose everything, and I do mean EVERYTHING.

Who want to read what a bigot writes

Posted by: Rezdog | September 20, 2008 2:08 AM

Good point...

The thing is, all Fry Daddy does is regurgitate the Repug talking points. When challenged to provide specifics, he and the rest of the right wing cauldron, cannot provide answers. He hates taxation. I have asked for specifics of what taxes should be cut and thus, what services... Furthermore, any historian will tell you that the New Deal was a program created to save the United States from total anarchy and challenges to the capitalist system.
Every social program ever created has been done with one main focus... do what is necessary to stabilize and maintain the social/economic system. It isn't because we are so generous. It is because if we don't have a modicum of social/financial support, social order and safety will be the victims (and thus the sanctity of one's own homes and neighbourhoods). It's bad now; imagine if the programs were further diminished.

I just don't get why the right wing doesn't get this.

They all talk about individual accountability. What a joke!

To them thats putting some poor urban kid in prison for possessing a dime bag of dope while looking the other way as their friends fleece the tax payers out of trillions.

Jamie..I smypathize with you about being forced to vote for Obama.

I have contempt for the morons who supported this lightweight hack.

Although the chances are slim, I hope this lightweight will be exposed and replaced before the election.

Don't hold your breath

See, I don't mind sending people to jail for crime. I am a believer that you do the crime, you do the time. The problem is, the rich who rob and cheat people, get off "scott free".

The thing about a bit of dope I pretty much agree. Just decriminalize it and tax it to hell and back. Talk about a budget balancer! LOL...

Get some sleep Rez.... I am off to work...

1) "The problem with Gordo is that he was probably a paid troll ... someone who was paid to push certain websites and increase trafic."

2) "He has now disappeared which means that his probable paid gig has come to an end."
-----------------------------------------------------------
1) Wrong

2) Lurking

OD,

I know I'm probably one of your knotheads, but seriously, I'm curious, academically thinking: how would this scenario play out in your mind? I mean given the convention is over and there are about 45 days until the election, short of something catastrophic, how is there another Democrat candidate?
I know anything is possible, but hell guy, your wishful thinking is beyond anything imaginable to me. Maybe i'm not as faithful as you but I'd be real curious as to how anyone else (especially Hillary) could be consider our party's candidate November 4th.

Hey G Man, how's it hanging?

Lurk Ness Monster....................

(Yust kiddink, G.......)

Lester "Roadhog" Moran and the Caddilac Cowboys with Ralph Emery:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkytM2Kj_Ao

Hey Gordo

You old paid Republican hack. How ya doin'.

Man, you make me all nostalgic for the good ole days

Jack

Candidates clash over the economy
John McCain outlines his proposal to create a new federal regulator. Barack Obama endorses Bush's rescue package and calls for bipartisanship. And the insults fly.
http://www.latimes.com/news/la-na-campaign20-2008sep20,0,4335517.story?track=rss

Meanwhile, the Other No. 2 Keeps On Punching

"As the economy reels, Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. — the Other Running Mate — has been absolutely butchering"
Senator John McCain across the Rust Belt this week. It is not clear who has noticed."
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/20/us/politics/20biden.html?partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss

he's baaaack! the ghost of yet to come ".... for in the very air through which this Spirit moved it seemed to scatter gloom and mystery..."

i'm with jack, good to hear from you GORDO.

Oregon,
I saw earlier that you were trying to figure out how to copy and paste a link. A while back, Bethy was able to figure it out with this site I'm linking. It describes in detail how to do it.

http://radio.weblogs.com/0107019/stories/2002/04/12/copyAndPasteUrls.html

I missed Gordo too.

Old is old, you're not fooling anyone! On the other hand people are always shocked when I say I'm 50, most people guess 35!

I guessed 12

"He has now disappeared which means that his probable paid gig has come to an end."

Gordo, Hope you don't listen to that stuff.
If you disagree with one or two, they use that to try to get rid of you.
Don't just lurk. Talk.

now, if we could only lure patsi back. maybe this will help.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iX0zfv8Ov5I

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148200

Hi Julie, Just read further up thread and saw your post. We may get power back today. Until then, we got a room and still go back and forth. But many things are getting back to normal (somewhat). If anything, this whole mess will end up actually helping the economy here, but that's not much consolation.

Thanks for asking Julie. Hope you're doing well.

Yea, Julie
Now Julie is like Anna
She is not some nasty troll.
She has a key.
She is bonifide.

Anna says, you go girl.

Tony,
If you're around today, may I ask if you ever heard back from Patsi?. Everyone sure misses her, including me. It's not the same without her. I told her she's irreplaceable and she is.

"She has a key.
She is bonifide"

I think EVERYONE here is as 'bonifide' as the next. If they choose not to have a key, that's their business. It sure doesn't make them a troll Anna. And that's not a nice thing to call people just because they don't meet your standards 'Anna'.

Wheeeeeeeee

Your socky baby is here

Wheeeeeeeee

Key? Key?
We don't need no stinkin' key

no key, no key, no key, no key, no key

Wheeeeeeeeeee

Shock Forced Paulson's Hand
A Black Wednesday on Credit Markets; 'Heaven Help Us All'
"When government officials surveyed the flailing American financial system this week, they didn't see only a collapsed investment bank or the surrender of a giant insurance firm. They saw the circulatory system of the U.S. economy -- credit markets -- starting to fail."
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122186563104158747.html

Good morning Chloe.

I exchanged a couple of emails with Patsi last week. She is lurking some but from what she said she is posting at another blog too. Don't know what one , Ididn't ask. None of my business.
Also, I suspect Anna's post may be a joke. Or it could be real, hard to tell around here.

Jack

Jack

Sturge
Look at these youngsters
The Statler Brothers: Flowers on The Wall

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1s8nRL2bPCU

Thanks Jack.
Glad to hear Patsi's doing well.

I reacted a little adversely to Anna Moose because I've seen her make similar comments a while back (several times). It didn't sound like a joke back then, so I 'assumed' it wasn't this time. Just sounds to me that a lot of comments, at times, are designed to silence others ideas. Maybe I'm wrong.

Have a good day!

A Feminist Face-Off for the Future
"The National Organization for Women endorses the Obama-Biden ticket. NOW ought to change its name to WOW. Such stunning independence. A working woman with five children, the governor of a sovereign state, isn't a sufficient accomplishment. Who knew?"

"Actually, Sarah Palin is a triumph for the "third stage" of feminism. The first stage of the modern woman's movement saw the destruction of the "feminine mystique...Hillary Clinton was famously caught in the crossfire of the second stage of the war between the sexes..Sarah Palin presents a different psychological portrait. We can put aside the pit bull and the lipstick. She's comfortable balancing femininity and toughness...."

"Welcome, NOW, to the third stage of feminism,"
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/09/a_faceoff_for_the_future.html

Brand New (wait for it) Key

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p02DgHeGdyI

Sturge, I love that video. It's so cute, and it's been so long since I've heard that song. Thanks! I'm going to bookmark it.

I like the country version of that one

The Wurzels - Combine Harvester
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btEpF334Rtc

Jack

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJiSKu29yPk&feature=related

the Voitzels......lol

Chloe

Interesting piece

The thing about Palin is she does appear to have it all

Family, very successful career, mocho he man husband, who is sensitive and willing to share household chores.

As Obama claimed to be post racial, Palin is very much post feminist. She is able to take the gains that women in the 60's and 70's worked for and got and incorporate them into her life and values.

Jack

Well I got stuff to do. House cleaning #1 issue. The wife is on the road, my old bachelor habits are starting to show. Better clean things up a little before she gets home Tuesday.

Jack

sturfucius say........better woman on the road than woman in the street........

Come Monday ~ Jimmy Buffett

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0---Q97pG4

Sturge

besides that a number of critters around here would be very unhappy if they didn't get their meals on time. Hate to say what they would be like if they had to live in a cardboard box.
We're all spoiled around here.

Jack

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/09/golden-oldie-states-get-the-ad.html#comment-148277

OD

He's starting to grow on me, and he certainly is better than the alternative. I give him A for intelligence and he does have a calm demeanor. Men have grown into the job before, so I hope he wins and I hope he does well. We need someone to do well right now.

the talk of bringing back slavery is not so far off...the new millenium slave pays for the honor to become a slave of the government. Once the majority of us are broke from paying the goverment to bailout the evil money changers, we will become indentured slaves of the system. Retirement? Health care? Depends if you are a favored slave or not.

I guess I should just head back to bed and pull the covers over my head until the election....but, no I do have to work today...must pay the bills of the reckless grasshopers of society.

I am one tired ant.

To BHO supporters.

Stuart Wilde wrote in his book, "Little Money Bible", the following.

"In order to make your feelings right, you've got to agree that abundance is natural. You can't look at abundance with anger or envy, and you can't become abundant if you exclude yourself. So if you see a person in a limousine who is wearing fine clothes, if you say consciously or subconsciously, "What a rat. That lifestyle is not for me; poverty is holy and good," you deny your potential.".

"To be abundant is simple, but first you have to be able to join in with your feelings. It's not vital that you can instantly visualize yourself in the presidential suite of a five-star hotel, providing you don't deny yourself from the possibility."

So keep that class envy thing going, and all you'll end up with is envy. Keep telling yourself you are poor and worthless, and you'll die poor and worthless. Keep telling yourself you can't make it without government handouts, and you'll end up a slave of the government. Keep depending on other to cloth and feed you, and you'll end up naked and starved.

"you'll end up a slave of the government"

frydaddy

We are already there and we also have a king president....voting dem is not a way out, but it is not voting for the same.

Dennis P. Lockhart
President and Chief Executive Officer
Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta

First question—how did it happen?
Let me begin by trying to place the subprime market in quantitative context. Although problems with the subprime market have caused widespread concern, the actual size of the subprime mortgage-backed securities market is relatively small. Based on our estimates, the size of the subprime market is more than $1 trillion, which was around 3 percent of the approximately $30 trillion of domestic nonfinancial debt last summer.

Since that time, this relatively small asset class has been the biggest factor—but by no means the only factor—contributing to unstable conditions in a broad array of credit (or debt) markets. There have been two phenomena at work, in my view. First, some markets—for example, the asset-backed commercial paper market—are closely linked to subprime. Other markets have been affected indirectly through a more general repricing of risk.

To understand how subprime mortgages could have triggered such major changes in financial markets, let's recall the credit environment of a few years ago. Credit losses had been unusually low in many U.S. markets for an extended period of time. With the strength and relative stability of the U.S. macroeconomy and the strong performance of housing in many geographic markets, lenders projected low losses even on the riskiest of loans.

The decline in credit quality first became apparent in the subprime market. In many cases aggressive mortgage originators were writing loans to borrowers with weak credit history, little or no equity invested in the house, and little or no verification of the borrower's ability to repay. Under the assumption of ever-increasing housing prices, mortgages written on these low standards were valued as though they were low risk. Once housing prices stopped rising and began declining in some markets, the potential for increases in subprime default rates and the increased riskiness of the mortgages became obvious to financial markets.

Subprime losses began to contaminate structured instruments in which they were held such as collateralized debt obligations, or CDOs, that were assets of structured investment vehicles, or SIVs. What followed was a dramatic decline in liquidity in many markets.

In response to this generalized illiquidity, particularly in the interbank market, the Fed in coordination with other central banks in December implemented a term auction facility.

I would argue that root causes of problems in the subprime market brought into question some fundamental practices, incentives, and even institutions of other markets
http://www.frbatlanta.org/invoke.cfm?objectid=65C8B587-5056-9F12-125B76D448344BEF&method=display

sock...one hell of a contagious virus in the money markets to grow from 3% to almost total contamination. Force feed liquids until the virus is contained, not cured?

I think the entire white house, congress and CEOs need to give some salary back...

Blonde Wino

It's like the person who thinks they are going to the doctor for a cold and it turns out they have gangrene and several limbs need to be amputated.

Here's an easy thing to do. It will force lenders to actually evaluate the credit worthiness of those they lend to:

Implement a national usury law. I would make it 12-percent across the board.

Now, we have large lenders being headquartered in places such as South Dakota where lenders can charge whatever they want and change rates on a whim. They charge rates so high that they'll loan something to virtually anyone.

Such a lending policy is absurd. It's bad for borrowers, shareholders, taxpayers, and our national image.

Cap interest rates on loans. Do it now!!

Good analogy, sock.

Anybody watching that huge explosion at the Marriott in Pakistan?

Yep, Jamie...18 killed, so far.

Looks like Pakistan is going to have to get serious about harboring terrorist in it northern areas. They either need to decided if they are part of Pakistan or in rebellion. The time where they can sit on the fence and pretend it is all our fault is over.

Jack

No matter what, we will throw more money at any problem that comes our way.

Flatus...I also would like to see some fines implemented and the fines go into a fund to help pay-off this mess. The reckless go un-punished? Perhaps, we also need to implement a presidential fine for Bush.

BTW

IMO using Anbar as a model for dealing with those areas is a good way for us. We need to focus in on what we really want as vitale to our national interest.

All we want from both Afganistan and the northern Pakistan is to run out the terrorist. Make it plain to them that is our only interest. Get rid of the foreigners and they can pound on each other any way they want.

Jack

Flatus

That would work if we kept inflation under control. Notice how everything is spiraling out of control.
I wish congress had put together a serious energy bill instead of that election year cya thing.

Maybe next year

Jack

Today's lecture on THE blistersyeahbutchannel

Elitism is the new socialism.
Or words have meaning.

BW

Instead they will set up a fee like they did with the S&L where the Ants pay for the grasshopper's mistakes. I wonder how many S&L folks just repeated their mistakes again.

I saw something where Jeb Bush is in the middle of it just like his brother Neal. It looks like his influence is costing Florida state retirement program big time.

Jack

Patsi...where are you? I miss you. I find great solace in your posts and need you now...everything is so messed-up (g-rated wording).

"Elitism is the new socialism.
Or words have meaning."

Or how about

" We're all socialist on this bus"

honk honk

Jack

Jack...the Bush family has been abusing the system for some time. When I lived in Colorado, Neil Bush was responsible for taking down the Silverado bank....and because daddy was prez, he just had to sign some paperwork stating he would stay out of commercial banking....voila, investment banking was born! And without regulation!

All this does is just make me curse like some radical with tourette syndrome. Barbara Bush blamed all of this on Neil's dyslexia!

I don't know if anyone has seen this, but it certainly doesn't make Obama's job any easier....

http://news.yahoo.com/page/election-2008-political-pulse-obama-race

Lao Tzu believed that the way to direct events was to use methods which do not create resistance or elicit counter-reactions. In observing the laws of nature he realized that excessive force in a particular direction tends to trigger the growth of an opposing force, and that therefore the use of force cannot be the basis for establishing a strong and lasting social foundation.

---R.L. Wing

I think we're all bozos on this bus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rcHNZeoDCM

Some ancient history from 1991 about the "Keating Five" and the S & L scandal

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CEED61F30F93BA15751C0A967958260

What is even sadder is that Cranston was one of the movers and shakers from the early 80s working to get the usury limits raised.

And now history repeats itself. It will be interesting once it all shakes out to see if McCain was once more exercising "poor judgement".

"If you push something hard enough it will fall over."

Jack
Still channeling firesign theater

http://www.amazon.com/review/product/0915765896?showViewpoints=1

history does repeat itself....and it seems to have a name of bush.

unless the thing you're pushing on turns around and eats you.........

"All this does is just make me curse like some radical with tourette syndrome."

I'm more to the level
"Stuttering radical with tourette syndrome"

I need to curse but I to angry to get it out. So I just set here and go fu, fu fu fu fu fu fu fu fu..................

Jack

"In response to this generalized illiquidity."

One only has to look Miami and the number of condos that have been built that are current empty and will remain empty for many months if not years. Or look to Vegas, same problem, or Calif. same problem. But condos are one problem, look at all the money that went into buying unlivable, dilapidated homes in questionable area for inflated prices by uninformed speculators, then fixing them up, more money, and then trying to sell them, more money cost in carrying charges, and make a profit before you have to refinance this load, even more money, into a "normal" mortage. Then you either hang onto to it hoping it will sell within a few months, move into it yourself providing you don't own a home with a mortgage, rent it out to, more than likely this will not be enough to cover the mortgage, taxes, Insurance, or what will happen more times than not, this home is headed back to the bank. Now someone at some time will get a good buy on this home at a much reduced price, probably even cheaper than what the bank has in it, all the bank wants is to get off their books. This fund that is being suggested will create some fantastic buys providing you have the credit, and can show proof of income to buy such a home. So problems such as these are gems to those who have the capital, real job and the sufficient down payment, and credit. As in some parts of this country if you were considering on buying a $250K home, you now can buy a $500K home for the same price. Only one catch, this time you will have to show proof positive you can afford the payments, good credit, and you'll have to put 10 to 20% down. Think of it as a free giveaway program with a few minor stipulations

or worse, falls on you, not killing you, but keeping you down and stuck.

that name, bush, pops up in oh so many events from nov 63, to the obvious present........

Help!, We've fallen and we can't get up!

LOL, Jack.

Stutter cursing.

honk, honk

Jack,
That Wurzels version of Sturge's link is great. I'm going to bookmark it too. You guys have really entertained me already this morning.

I agree with you about Palin. You don't have to agree with her political views in order to respect her as a woman, mother and career woman. The quest for equality is moving right along.

Flatus...must head to work, but I did read that the housing boom was based on "false" demographics of the census. Builders claimed the households were increasing and needed to build for the NEW american phenom. Fudging numbers...it never changes. Could be some sort of national dsylexia. Hey, I thought the numbers were reversed!

President has sent $700 Billion package to Congress. Let the fun begin!

Sturge

They should have never let them cross the connecticut state line. They have spread the Bush infection everywhere. Bunch a yankee carpetbaggers anyway.

Jack

Have a lovely day all...enjoy your new status as owners of some pretty crappy companies!

Off to work for me...I've got a big bill to pay.

http://www.metermill.com/bushpics/bush-clown.jpg

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha have a good day

For those getting tired of the constant drip, drip, drip of "Muslims are terrorists" meme, you might want to pick up a copy of this book:

http://www.amazon.com/Lost-History-Enduring-Scientists-Thinkers/dp/1426202806/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1221926682&sr=1-1

News just mentioned that McCain graduated in 1958 which reminded me of the Statler Brothers:

Class of 57

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zonSL24AJ44

and

Do You Remember These?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YL1oGXi090w&feature=related

BW
Construction is alway cyclical , you get booms and busts. And like any market when in the boom period there are always builders who believe it will never end and stretch themselves to the limit. What is different this time is the large number of players who were involved in the money side. All these newbees had never experienced a bust before and didn't think about it happening so eagerly went along with the reckless builders and speculators. This in my opinion lead to a larger bubble than usual thus a greater fall when the bust part of the cycle kicked in.

Also because the bubble went on so long we have a large number of newbies that require education. That means a lot of people in pain.

Jack

Blonde wino,

"Off to work for me...I've got a big bill to pay."

On a Saturday? What a novel idea.

Been noticing your postings for sometime, and you my dear get it. Congratulations!

"Lao Tzu believed that the way to direct events was to use methods which do not create resistance or elicit counter-reactions. In observing the laws of nature he realized that excessive force in a particular direction tends to trigger the growth of an opposing force, and that therefore the use of force cannot be the basis for establishing a strong and lasting social foundation"
---R.L. Wing Posted by: sturgeone 11:40 AM

Maybe this is the basis for reverse psychology.

"Construction is always cyclical , you get booms and busts. And like any market when in the boom period there are always builders who believe it will never end and stretch themselves to the limit."

So right.
My hubby and I always call it "gotta make hay while the sun shines".

Good morning all,
Flatus, good to see you. You used to be here almost every morning. Now not so often.

Fox is having a show tonight on Joe Biden - and on tuesday night an interview with Bill Clinton.

Hi Chloe, glad all is starting to get back to normal in Texas. I see they are letting people go back to galveston today.

Thanks AnnaMoose

Must go company today,
Julie

Thanks Julie. Hope all is well with you too.

After a breathless week, I'm optimistic again
Fears of bank failures and financial panics should soon disappear as the US Treasury takes radical new steps.

"The violent zig-zags of the past two weeks - not just in financial markets, but also in government policies and economic expectations - have left everyone dizzy. Not least readers of these pages, many of whom have complained about the way I lurched from optimism to pessimism in analysing the past few week's events. To try to cut a path through all this confusion - and to explain another lurch in my views, back towards optimism - I will raise five questions and try to give fairly straightforward answers."
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/anatole_kaletsky/article4790920.ece

Jack,
I don't know a heck of a lot about the housing construction industry. But, here's what I've seen here--there've been, for the last half dozen years, lots of mom and pop contractors building three and four houses at a time, often using subs and with the principals both holding 'regular' jobs.

It struck that these contractors were able to let these houses sit vacant for months until they were able to get their price for them.

I suspect a lot of creative financing went into financing these ventures. Lots of liens involved and high risk for everybody concerned including the ultimate buyers.

NEW THREAD