Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

Well, here's what I know -- none of the Latinos I know are now planning to vote.

Aside from that...and since I seem to always bring up feminst issues...here's what I wish would have happened when Obama's campaign used "I Got 99 Problems and a Bitch Aint one"

I wish the ghost of Janis Joplin would have elbowed her way on stage and said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sW-TjMLsDe0

WASHINGTON (AFP) - Democrat Barack Obama has a dominant lead over Republican John McCain among Hispanic voters, despite his struggle to woo the key bloc during his presidential primary campaign, a poll found Wednesday.

A Gallup survey put Obama up 59 percent to 29 percent over his rival among registered Hispanic voters across the United States. The community will likely play a pivotal role in general election swing states like Colorado, New Mexico and Florida.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080702/ts_alt_afp/usvoteobamahispanics_080702151635

Brian....here's the sorry truth...no matter hiw much you suck up to Obama....you'll never be his bitch.. I know that's a tough reality.

McCain will be quite well with the Hispanic vote. He could get over 50%. I know that sounds crazy, but you never know.

VJ Machiavelli
http://www.vjmachiavelli.blogspot.com
ps McCain is the Teddy Roosevelt of the 21st century, while Obama is the Neville Chamberlain. Obama wants us to keep taking off our shoes. I am tried of taking of my shoes. I want to put them back on and never take them off again.

brian, i already linked that Gallup story in the post above

Patsi that's a disgraceful thing to say. Sorry Craig didn't notice.

Viva Obama?

that was kinda disgraceful, patsi. geez, i get tired of reading these insults

i meant i get tired of the insults on both sides, by the way.

but on a positive note, the weekend stroll through our nation's founding was a fun read. thanks to you guys for playing along

Oh Puh-leeze -- Brian has insulted me in so many worse ways I could puke. So let's not be coy.

And here's my Janis salute to the Republicans:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-g7Q7hXn7o&feature=related

Thought I would check in but it looks like the same old nonsense.

I'll tell you a story. In 2004 , GWB visited Holland. He stopped at an ice cream place called "Captain Sundae". They have a bunch of pictures that were taken of GWB with their employees on that day. They posted this pictures along the side of the building. I was there a few days ago. Everyone that looked at those pictures of GWB remarked about "What an evil man he is!" I'm not just talking about adults, kids were saying that too! Considering how Republican-leaning this area is, I would take that as a bad sign for McCain.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/courting-the-latino-vote.html#comment-111278

you get no argument from me about that, patsi. just saying i find it all so tiresome. but have at it.

well i'm off to finish the last half hour of Coppolla's 3 1/2 hour Apocalypse Now redux -- patsi and brian give new meaning to Brando's words:

THE HORROR!!!!!!

One more time....Brian is allowed to insult anyone and it is all just fine. I am continually stunned at how this works. No one better kick his butt.

Oh patsi i haven't insulted you in ages, get over it. Nobody cares but you. Good night.

Craig -- you are right...we'd probably kill each other! ha!

The Hispanic vote will come down to the same thing most people will be voting on, the economy. Gas is going to hit 5 bucks a gallon by summer's end and that is end of any hope at winning for McCain.

Guys, I'm telling you. Forget the past four elections. This is going to be a landslide win, up and down the ticket. My friends and I used to joke that the country would need to be run into the ground by someone black would be elected president. Well, guess what has happened. Here's a little snapshot of what's going to go on:

The Republicans will remind everyone that not only is Barack black, but he's REALLY black. That will get them the overt and nascent racist vote. But hell, Obama wasn't getting that vote anyway.

Barack has a very competent staff who has out organized this motley GOP crew on the ground and like a boxer with power and speed, will grind McCain in states they thought were red, but will shade purple. See: NC, GA, Montana, etc.

This election will not be close. AND I think Hillary will be a Supreme Court Justice, which personally, I think she'll thrive. She's smarter than Scalia and on our side.

LANDSLIDE!

Oops, I must be tired. I meant that the country would have to be run into the ground BEFORE someone black would be elected president.

Well, we agree on one thing, D. The GOP has already conceded by nominating McCain, which begs the question, why?

Any idiot can figure out why McCain got the nomination, they needed someone who would go through the paces and lose gracefully. McCain is the Repugs Adlai, so to speak. Not that I ever would insult Adlai to John McCain. But Adlai knew he was going to lose but did his bit for the party and went though the paces.

This immigration problem is like the Iraq problem in this: our leaders and candidates all have different ways to attack it.
It's confusing for the average person to fully understand it.
Joe Biden has what I consider t be the most complicated solution for Iraq, and I bet less than one per cent of the voting populace of the US can describe Biden's plan. Some of us who follow the happenings in Iraq daily have to really think before we speak so we don't "pull a McCain" and get all mumble-mouthed and get Sunni and Shia all mixed up.
And I would love to see a street poll asking just two questions: who is al-Maliki ? Who is Moqtada al-Sadr? I bet only one in a hundred could tell the interviewer the answers.
And on immigration, we need to know answers. How much a threat to legal citizen's jobs and safety are the illegal aliens?
Some say "The Fence" is a joke...then we turn on the TV and see border guards say how well it is working,. where it is already built and staffed.
How far will the candidates go in pledging total closure by fence of the southern border?
I was in a room the other day and The Glen Beck Show was on , and the topic was how LA is a terror-zone now because illegal aliens roam the city and attack innocent Americans at will...and LA County Jail is half-full of illegals...we need to know if this is a lie or the truth, although I think I know the answer...

Corey, interesting and I think that's true all over the country NOW. I just wish all those folks were paying attention YEARS ago.

As for the Latino thang, I stopped by Half Price Books today and picked up Spanish CDs inasmuch as it's the national language of Texas. I'd much rather put the time into more French though.

I had to take a taxi to DFW and the African driver got a call. He was speaking a kind of French. French enough so that I could understand it anyhow. I liked that. So much Spanish flies around me here, and I only know a few words. I actually know more German than Spanish even though I never studied either.

The driver was from the Ivory Coast.

As it is, whenever I try to recall and say anything in Spanish, it come up French and takes too long to retrieve the Spanish. I'll probably wind up speaking FreSpanglish or some such.

tt

Dex, babe, there ya are!

*waving*

tt

My point is we need to know EXACTLY how Obama and McCain stand on immigration . There is no way of knowing what they actually will do when elected...
nash , of TrailMix here, was the first I can recall to write here that whatever Democrat ran would win easily.
That is not true.
Bush had a terrible first term and the evil magic of the repuggs worked...they made it sound like Bush's first made us safer and all that goddam bullshit.
Bush has low ratings now, true, but many repuggs who now see what a screw-up Bush is also realize Bush himself is not running, but they DO NOT want a Dem in office...and McCain is "different enough" for them , compared to Bush, that they will vote for him.
Obama is not helping the cause, either. The talkies on Sunday focussed on how Obama is hedging on his promise to end the Iraq war by April , 2010...I am not saying this, I agree with Kerry, this is just more repugg evil magic...but it's out there, all over the teevees of America, many owned by repuggs, itching to cast anti-Obama votes.

HELLO TIPTOE!
Hey, I bought you a new mop bucket, but I will have to sweep the floor first...lots of bull shit to clean up here at TrailMix Central!

TIPTOE GIVE ORDERS AND THE PLACE GETS CLEANED UP!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxieLcA5PLQ

..and the TrailMixers dig for facts!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZC541psEO8A&NR=1

Lucky for McCain he's got a rich wife, he won't have to sell erectile dysfunction meds to earn a living after he loses in November.

any Biblical scholars in here, amateur or otherwise?

nvm- found what i was looking for. peace out.

I thought about posting this on the last post, but was afraid it would be missed by too many.

Ahem.

Who the hell is Strug?

Very bluntly, I have enjoyed this blog, but won't be around much longer if the current bar fight keeps up. In my opinion and I have a right to that opinion and to voice it here, about three or four of the people here have taken to barking out their beliefs and analyses and interpretations at the rest of us. To my ninth-graders, I would have said
"Grow up."

I get carried away and voice my thoughts in some pretty long posts, but I don't think I have ever commented on anyone else's intelligence, motives, pasttimes, behaviour, moral or physical status, religion, family, friends - oh, so many things. Now I will.

Frankly, you guys are being inconsiderate and over-bearing, in my opinion. I do NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT
want to be lectured by you or be educated by you.

Further, I do NOT NOT NOT NOT want to read your insults about each other.

If you want to agree and ponder whence your disagreements come, do so by all means. If you want to explain how everyone else is in intellectual prison and you'd love to set us free, drop dead.

If I'm the only one who feels this way. post it and I'll get lost, with a big smile on my face.

In case anyone is wondering, "What brought THAT on?"
I had just spent quite a few minutes catching up on the July 4th blog and then this one, and it took a while. By the end, I was so disgusted I was asking myself if I should say something different from my usual comments- I don't like to impose my views on others.

Obviously, I decided to at least set my views out there. I'm not the only one who has said such things. Craig has tried to settle things down, and for a while it was getting pleasant and INTERESTING. But If you look back at the last two days, you'll see several people trying to lighten it up and lot of people becoming
silent. You are not INTERESTING when you bully people.

So this time I do want to impose my views on others. I want to blog where people are interesting and interested in other people's thoughts and insights.

Oh, yeah, I also don't like it when bullies try cheap attacks on people I've enjoyed talking with.

sorry, craig, if I'm out of line. but I meant it.

So Where’s Murphy?

"McCain is frustrated. He thinks he can beat Obama (politicians are pretty confident in their own abilities). But he isn’t convinced his campaign can beat Obama’s campaign. He knows that his three-month general election head start was largely frittered away. He understands that his campaign has failed to develop an overarching message. Above all, McCain is painfully aware that he is being diminishe(d by his own campaign."

Murphy)"....his great skill has always been an ability to find a clear theme for his candidates, as he did for McCain in 2000."
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/07/opinion/07kristol.html?_r=1&ref=opinion&oref=slogin

bethyboo,
You're right. All of it.

But hope you don't leave. Think of it as your contribution to the rest of us, to stick around and help keep us going.

Just read who you want to read and skip those who deserve to be skipped, because they seldom say anything worth while or kind to say. Take your pick.

We need your ideas and take on things. Like so many others that are important here too. Variety is good. Don't give up on everyone, because of a few. You can do it.

nite

If my posts bother you, beth, just ignore them. I certainly don't want to chase anyone off the blog. I come and go capriciously; I won't be around for long.

The internet being what it is, I'm sure there will be another jerk to come along and replace me, so maybe this isn't the best place for you. You'll find the same phenomenon on any forum that allows participants to post anonymously. If perusing posts here upsets you, it isn't worth the toll on your emotions.

There are plenty of moderated forums where such inanity is filtered. Maybe some of your friends here could suggest a few. I can think of a few reasons why Craig doesn't moderate this forum, the foremost being that with a career and a family, he probably has better things to do.

I can appreciate how personal attacks are rarely, if ever, justified. It also speaks to the compassion of your character that suck attacks upset you. The fact that such transgressions are leveled without actual personal familiarity (as opposed to an online persona) mitigates the vitriol, at least for me. No one here knows me personally or has ever spent time in the same room with me, so there is nothing they can say that would affect me emotionally.

All that said, and with all due respect, it isn't fair that you request participants debate within your parameters. Politics is a blood-sport, and the administration of human lives is an even messier business. The discussion of such topics is bound to be equally vicious. If expression were to be curtailed in the interest of civility, I'm afraid important ideas could be lost due to controversial subject matter or fear of offending fragile sensibilities. I personally don't feel that is anyone's best interest. I could be wrong.

In that spirit, I won't let the fact that you called for my death get to me. With all sincerity, I hope you feel better.

The first thing for me to say is that I wasn't talking about you.

Next, I'm also sure you realize that my uttereance of the childhood phrase to drop dead meant nothing of the sort.

I appreciate the way you always respond to my posts nicely.

There are plenty of blogs but I like this one cuz there aren't that many where people are civil. There are also thousands of them where people who want to push others around have lots of company.

"All that said, and with all due respect, it isn't fair that you request participants debate within your parameters. "

I see what you are saying and I respectfully disagree with you. All I said was if that was going to be the norm, it wasn't for me. I wouldn't dream of requiring others to do as I like - I have always liked it here and see a sudden change in attitude which is interested ONLY in a fight and name-calling, not in exchanging ideas. I just wanted to voice my irritation, and that's all I did. I know politics is a blood sport, but that doesn't mean one has to use insults to voice his or her opinion. I want to hear disagreement, but the insults, whether
meant or not, are extremely unpleasant for by-standers.

So, no, I didn't mean you. I do not think you are a jerk and I appreciate your comments

I'm 65 and however much longer ( how's that for cobbling a sentence together?) I live, I will not have it filled with bullies and thugs, and I've been reading some of that lately. That's all. Oh, yes, I feel fine. I'm not angry or upset - I just hit the brick wall. I just don't want to read all that garbage, or to even have to skip it.

Thanks for the thought, but I am a jerk. Of the highest order. My personal life is in turmoil right now, and participating here is a welcome, yet counter-productive distraction for me. My circumstances foster the negativity expressed here, and I apologize to any victims of it. Whether perceived by you or not, I am aware of it and my contributions to the climate you have lamented.

Once again, not trying to chase you away, but logging off is probably best for the both of us. Life is too short. Unfortunately for me, and most likely very evident to most of you, will-power has never been my strong suit.

I would suggest you keep in touch with your friends via Craig's facebook, and maybe one of you could start an exclusive blog where you could share your ideas without fear of incursion from trolls such as myself or the others with whom we are all 'virtually' familiar.

Anyway, here's to many more in peace and prosperity.

Good Morning all.....
I have to say...I am in awe of what I saw this weekend. I was at both the finals of Wimbledon. Venus saved the day for the USA once again....
Yesterday was a little down for me, seen as I am a Federer man....
Anyway, the Williams sisters produced some awesome tennis, and I wish that the WTA would do something about the statement made by Elena Dementieva who implied that these matches are fixed. BULL#$%&

Anyway,
back to politics.. I was in London and people were asking all kinds of questions about BO, someone had the nerve of telling me: "It is amazing how you guys vote off the best candidate and put in soemone half roast." Then she said: "Just like we do here in the UK after Margaret Thatcher". We laughed and walked off.

Courting the latino vote will be easy for BO.
The thing that he needs to watch: is his brain. He needs to stick with his speeches and stop talking without a transcript. It will keep him in line. Or else I project more flip flops, struggles, or call whatever you want it....

Good to see HRC stepped out yet again.

Patis, please stop taking on Brian. After a while people stop, when you purposely ignore....

Bethyboo, thanks for your early morning posts. I agree with what you have said. It's your absolute right to depart at any time you wish, but I, for one, will miss your thoughtful comments.

Jason, your remark asking Patsi to stop taking on Brian irked me. I think that Brian will let things cruise along for a while then he starts tossing hand grenades. And when somebody starts reacting with the same type of negativity that he exhibits, he cries foul and gets Craig to side with him. I think that's BS of the highest order.

My own (gratuitous) comment is that Brian is an obviously intelligent and highly nuanced individual. That he often uses his intelligence to bait and insult and humiliate his victim du jour, is beyond regrettable. I, for one, hope that he takes those kinds of comments to his own blog.

BB, I hope none of what I've written is at the ninth grade level. :)

The following article is above the fold on page one of this morning's Journal:
Obama Faces 'Hillraiser' Backlash
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121539354782631403.html?mod=hpp_us_pageone

Flatus
Oh ya."He starts tossing hand grenades".That about sums it up!! Thanks

Re my comment about Hillraiser Backlash. Didn't realize that the link would be truncated as subscriber only. You can read more of it here:
http://www.newseum.org/todaysfrontpages/hr.asp?fpVname=WSJ&ref_pge=gal&b_pge=2

Flatus, agree with your comment....

Anywho,
Do you think the backlash will be negative for the future of HRC.... ??????? I think so. I think people who cannot be for BO should just move to the background and let this thing play out, let the man run his show.... I was mad as hell in the begining but have now taken a back seat... I will not ever vote for BO, even if she becomes the VP runningmate, but to be brutal towards him out in public is not the way to help her...
I sit , discuss and shut up... LOL

He will bruise (is allready bruising) himself..
If tjhese pople, the hillraisers continue to speak out frankly against him, we can only pray that BO wins, because if he doesn´t, the media and the rest of the BO machine will fire their ammunition at HRC...

Jason, your remark asking Patsi to stop taking on Brian irked me. I think that Brian will let things cruise along for a while then he starts tossing hand grenades. And when somebody starts reacting with the same type of negativity that he exhibits, he cries foul and gets Craig to side with him. I think that's BS of the highest order
Posted by: Flatus | July 7, 2008 7:35 AM

I know. I experienced the same with aforementioned. But I will not fall into the trap. After a while these people get tired of trying and they disappear with enoermous roar, because no one will react on his or her reply... Let it be buddy... :))

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67J_66hdN-I

..Analyst: Iraqis ‘Owe Us’ 100-Year Leases On Their Oil, ‘We Ought To Take It’
New York Times reported that four Western oil companies — Exxon Mobil, Shell, Total, and BP — are in the final stages of negotiating no-bid oil contracts “to service Iraq’s largest fields.”

After Denying Involvement In Iraqs NoBid Oil Contracts US Revealed To Be Integral To Deals
http://fav.or.it/post/171437

Friday, July 04, 2008
Secret report: biofuel caused food crisis
"..The figure emphatically contradicts the US government's claims that plant-derived fuels contribute less than 3% to food-price rises."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/jul/03/biofuels.renewableenergy

Just dealt with a customer service rep who was a wwwwaaaayyyy bigger jerk than me. Here's to relativity.

" I think people who cannot be for BO should just move to the background and let this thing play out,"

You're right Jason -- if not, HRC will be blamed if he flames out, no matter what the truth of the matter is....

thanks pat

Animal lovers will find this followup to the Michael Vick dogfighting scandal hopeful:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/07/06/AR2008070602351.html?hpid=artslot

"Just dealt with a customer service rep who was a wwwwaaaayyyy bigger jerk than me...Posted by: champ |

Champ,
You're NOT a jerk.

Christmas in July? The surrogates are descending upon the media like a bunch of seasonal Santa Clauses (I hope this is the plural of a singular Santa) defending and defining their guy. Maybe this will be a landslide election, maybe not. It is already gone to boring since the gal is gone. And everything repug is naughty and everything dem is nice.

Champ - once again I have to disagree. You're no jerk. A lot of your turmoil comes thru in your comments, and it is the product of a disruption in your life. We all have those and they always show up in our words and behaviour. I'm not talking about someone who is on edge. Whatever you do, don't drop out on us.

I'm talking about someone who is being nasty for nastiness' sake - or actually, someone who is irresistibly compelled to denigrate the knowledge and intelligence of others, using barbed personal darts.

A pedant - that's what I mean. You are not pedantic, champ - you are searching. Most of us are looking or wondering or searching, but our pedant doesn't need to. Our pedant.........well, our pedant may be right about some things, but our pedant....okay, this time I am going to refrain from name-calling, but , who knows. I'm disgusted enough with his/her game-playing, I just might succumb (except I think you all just might like him/her and I don't want to upset you. no, it's not you, patsi.)

I think I couched all this in the wrong language and I'm gonna have trouble digging myself out.. But I stand by my original statement: there is a bully here and he/she/it is anti-thetical to healthy growth.

um, if anyone still cares about the subject of latino voters, my take is that by 2012 or 2016, "the latino vote" will be refined further into "the mexican-american vote," "the cuban-american vote," the "central-american-american vote," etc. i think there are something like 18 million registered latino voters, and even from my limited interaction with them, it is obvious they are not a homogeneous bloc.

i'm going to shamelessly promote myself and ask you to visit my site:
http://www.marykittneel.com
if you get a moment. thanks.

This is an article from 2004 about the hispanic vote in the presidential elections of 2000 and 2004.
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/nadler200412080811.asp

bethyboo
I think you expressed yourself very well. If anyone gives you trouble, just say so....no one beats up on Sonomans and gets away with it.....:)
Hi from Guerneville!

Mary Kitt-Neel

Enjoyed the bull...nice site.

bethyboo, I prefer pedants to pendants (new usage alert, to wit: One who hangs around contributing little but bling bling.).

A great quote from Mary Kitt-Neel's blog:

" Iran, it appears, is debating instituting the death penalty for bloggers. Bloggers, Iran charges, disturb the "mental security in society."

Well, that's what good writing does: it disturbs the status quo and makes people use their brains. As far as I'm concerned, if we don't do that, we might as well start living in caves again. And I have to admit to feeling slightly heady and badass knowing that the Iranian government would want to kill me."

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/courting-the-latino-vote.html#comment-111309

Champ, if your meaning in this comment is to tell those who don't like you to go somewhere else (and i certainly hope it isn't), that is not how things work around here. I don't throw anybody out, and visitors don't either.

And, Patsi, besides killing you, it will make every young (in mind) Iranian absolutely crazy. Me thinks, if we would butt out, Iranians would solve the problem of a berserk theocracy all on their own.

Bethyboo,
I understand exactly what you're saying.
I just happen to be here for a few minutes when Champ wrote that this morning, and at the time you weren't here to respond immediately, . I wanted so badly to tell Champ you didn't mean him. I wanted to tell him that you actually like him. I know this because I can tell by the way you two interact. But I didn't, because I felt it was none of my business.

I also know you're talking about the general situation and not about how someone's treating you personally. You can handle yourself with no problem. It's admirable that you want this to be a better place.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/courting-the-latino-vote.html#comment-111309

There was just one missing element.

"needed the flaming tilda of sarcasm"

KGC...thanks for the article. In southern New Mexico during the 2004 election, GWB's campaign effectively used 'Viva Bush' in marketing to the Hispanic population. And they marketed to the poorest of Hispanics in this area. And they did it with food....they fed hundreds at the political rallies. And we were all amazed at how well it worked at getting out the vote for Bush. Yep, there are still a bunch of bumper stickers in the area with Viva Bush.

"I don't throw anybody out, and visitors don't either."

Yeah, Craig, but that doesn't keep us from complaining. And we complain, you tell us it's a bore.

bethyboo..... if you leave, I will miss you.... as I've already said.... I LOVE to read your posts.....

champ... I don't think you're a jerk..... I enjoy the fact that you bring the libertarian perspective here....

Craig.... when you side with the source of the problem..... you become just one more enabler.....

Bonde wino.... nice to see you here again....
and I'm with you..... this election has become a real snoozer for me.....

I should have specified that both paragraphs I quoted are from Mary -- don't want to take any credit for her great post! :)

Might be upthread, but here's link to the WSJ story on some Hillraisers not supporting Obama that Flatus mentioned.

Talking Points Memo put the link up; otherwise it is subscriber only.

http://online.wsj.com/article_print/SB121539354782631403.html

RR

Been working too much for much less these days....I feel like the female Rip Van Winkle...I don't recognize my country like I used to...things seems rather dismal. I am assuming it is just depression. Or maybe just a personal recession. ; ) I am waiting for one of the Santa Claus surrogates to brighten my future.

And I have to admit to feeling slightly heady and badass knowing that the Iranian government would want to kill me."
Posted by: Patsi Author Profile Page | July 7, 2008 9:41 AM

Patsi,
LOL
I often open my mouth without thinking. If you only knew how many times I've known beyond any doubt that someone wants to kill me.

Ouch. When your friends turn on you, it's not pleasant
Frank Rich Editorial

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/04/opinion/04fri1.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/courting-the-latino-vote.html#comment-111339

rebellious -- i was trying to head off another round of patsi-brian wars at the top of this thread. that's it. not taking sides. can't even tell what the sides are half the time.

Renee: Craig's not necessarily siding with the source of the problem. That is your tunnel vision at work.

Craig...perhaps it is impossible to stop a war.

hope everyone had a great weekend....
I ate too much..... especially watermelon..... had a great time with friends and family.....

but I made sure I had time to read..... during the summer, I forgo reading political books unless they're fictional.... I read Geraldine Brooks' fictional account of the father in Little Women and the Civil War entitled "March"....

it was a great read..... Ms Brooks obviously did a lot of research not only on the Civil War, but also on Concord Massachusetts and the transcendentalist movement..... I highly recommend it....

as for Hispanics and the election..... I couldn't help but think when the speaker said that Hispanics might be the group to decide this upcoming election, .... that that is what so many other groups think about themselves too.... no matter our technological achievements..... we're all basically still tribal....

RR...is the watermelon the aphrodisiac as the media now claims!?? : )

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/the-declaration-of-independenc.html#comment-111210

Patsi,
Before I go, just want to tell you I loved your 9:12 post last night.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/courting-the-latino-vote.html#comment-111339

rebellious -- i was trying to head off another round of patsi-brian wars at the top of this thread. that's it. not taking sides. can't even tell what the sides are half the time.

Posted by: Craig Crawford | July 7, 2008 10:04 AM

Renee: Craig's not necessarily siding with the source of the problem. That is your tunnel vision at work.

Posted by: dog's eye view | July 7, 2008 10:04 AM

The source of the Problem is not one person.

The is the zeal that just a few take in revisiting and slight over and over and over and.....we can go on.

So instead of fighting the fight add naseum and making the atmosphere continue to be so poisonous it is hard to take for most of you,

A a group police this place. It could be that the poster in question doesn't understand what slight took place.

this you neighborhood and not mine anymore. show and instruct others on the type of atmosphere that as a group, you want. Eventually you will get your wish.

But one person and even the Blog Master Craig, can't go this alone. He has obviously shown what he wants, but its up to you grownups to carry out the plan.

Kicking someone off is not the plan.

. we're all basically still tribal....Posted by: RebelliousRenee | July 7, 2008 10:08 AM

Renee,
At least that's the way the politicians see us.

Later.

RR...is the watermelon the aphrodisiac as the media now claims!?? : )Posted by: Blonde wino July 7, 2008 10:10 AM

Oh, and Blonde.
I guess if the media says so, it must be true.
(did you notice all this watermelon information came out right before the 4th of July weekend)

Chloe....tomatoes getting dissed and watermelon getting elevated. So, the fruit wars continue, but vegies may have been the actual cause of the poor tomato fruit's downfall.

Pew also has figures on the Hispanic vote from 2006
http://pewhispanic.org/factsheets/factsheet.php?FactsheetID=26

Blonde Wino
And don't forget in 2004 Shrub had George P stumping for him.

Patsi: was this part of your 9:12 post directed at me?

"I find people -- women, for God's sake -- who demand proof that anything like sexism ever existed."

Because if it is, you are sadly mistaken that I believe that, or ever believed that.

Mary

Tried to leave a comment on your site, but your visual verification picture isn't working so it would accept the message.

After reading several posts, I guess what is missing is the suspense in the election process. We no longer elect presidents...we market them...Obama is a brand. A vote is no longer a vote.

Maybe we shouldn't shop for a POTUS in the Senate.

Craig,

That wasn't my intent at all. To be terse, I was just trying to cheer someone up. I think in the context of the conversation, my meaning was clear, but I may not be as articulate as I'd like to believe. I understand your contention, on more than one level, but I assure you, my aim is never to stifle dissent or exclude anybody. That you would glean that from my comments is a little disheartening, but whatever. No skin off my teeth. Have a good one.

From the NPR story

"With a growing number of media outlets, even as Spanish political ads multiply, they are becoming less visible to English speakers. Especially this year, as political marketing migrates to cell phones.

"I'm looking at the data right now — and, of those who send or receive a text message on a daily basis, 73 percent of Hispanics do, while only 53 percent of whites do across the board," says Jed Alpert, CEO of Mobile Commons, a company that sets up text messaging systems for political campaigns.

Those numbers have been noticed by the campaigns. The McCain campaign is planning to reach out to Hispanics with text messages, but on this, the competition is out in front: If you text Obama the letters E-S-P, you are automatically signed up for campaign updates ... en Espanol."

The first election to use cell phones extensively in a campaign was in the Philippines. I find this so interesting.

Frankly, as far as immigration is concerned I believe Bill Maher probably has about as logical a solution as anyone. He says instead of the 700 mile fence just build a 700 mile Walmart and have the Mexicans come in the back door to work and the shoppers come in the front door. Every night the Mexicans can go home and the shoppers get what they want. May sound silly, but has anyone come up with a more reasonable plan. I frankly don’t give a damn about anyone coming over the border to earn a living earning low wages, but I don’t want a terrorist to come over who might want to do harm to this country. Lou Dobbs would be out of a job if the immigrants were kept out permanently. Would be a real blessing, IMO.

this deserves repeating with emphasis:
After a while these people get tired of trying and they disappear with enoermous roar, because no one will react on his or her reply... Let it be buddy... :))
Posted by: Jason

so once more with feeling
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67J_66hdN-I

We no longer elect presidents...we market them...Obama is a brand.

Posted by: Blonde wino | July 7, 2008 10:37 AM

WHEW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
On the money....And we have a winner....

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/07/courting-the-latino-vote.html#comment-111361

much obliged, champ

From the last thread:

“Critics say that Presidential candidate Barack Obama tries to “be all things to all people” and that he makes too many “pie-in-the-sky” promises.”

Doesn’t that description sound like a Hillary Clinton position? The Clintons have always run their races on being centralists. Yet, when Obama moves to the center he is demonized for it. It is interesting to me that it was AFTER Obama’s meeting with Bill Clinton via telephone that he came out with some of these centralist ideas. Possibly a strategy that may have been suggested by Clinton? I have not kept up with everything happening in the campaign because when I go on vacation I’m on vacation and don’t hear the news. Also, we had a non-Obama supporter with us who is mad as hell that Clinton did not win, so in the condo whenever we passed any news channel it did not stay on for more than a second to keep the peace. So forgive me if I am misstating something here.

Max keeps ranting through volumes and volumes of tiring diatribe about all of these moves to the center by Obama when, in fact, he was a Clinton supporter and she wore out the middle trying to appease everyone on both sides of the fence. Now, he hates Obama so much he cannot understand the tactical move to win this election. We CANNOT at any cost allow the conservatives to continue with their plans, or lack of, for our future. THIS COUNTRY cannot afford it and the WORLD is waiting and hoping for a brighter future for all…something that will NOT happen with a McBush as president.

Brian posted this on the previous thread and the issue deserves commentary on the link

"The Republican presidential nominee-in-waiting has proposed that everyone buying health insurance get a refundable tax credit, $2,500 for individuals and $5,000 for families. At the same time, he would treat employer contributions toward health insurance like income, meaning workers would have to pay income, but not payroll, taxes on it.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080706/ap_on_el_pr/mccain_health_care"

On so many levels this shows just how detached McCain is from the average wage earner. First for people who currently pay little or no income tax, another tax credit is no benefit at all. If you then say as an alternative that the insurance payments by employers need to be counted as income, then you run the risk of putting the employee in a higher taxable bracket (a $5,000) raise, then someone who previously didn't pay taxes would have to pay and thus end up with even less income than they had before as well as inadequate health care.

This is monumental stupidity as a suggested solution for the problem.

and I believe Obama is a better brand for our country then the McCain brand...

Before anyone chooses to insult me, that's my opinion.

Cada uno está hablando del voto hispánico

"If you look at it in detail, though, the Hispanic electorate mostly seems to vote the way Thomas Frank suggests everyone should in What's the Matter With Kansas -- poorer Hispanics vote Democratic, richer ones vote Republican, and social and cultural issues just don't seem to play very much. Because Hispanics are poorer-than-average this leads to a big pro-Democratic tilt. I think it's clear that Republicans can hurt themselves with the immigration issue by acting like racist demagogues but the GOP's primary problem with this voting group really is things like S-CHIP rather than a lack of sufficient immigration-related pandering. "
http://matthewyglesias.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/07/hispanics_and_pocketbooks.php

Karolena...Bill M stated that as a joke (a bit racist, too) not a solution. I live on the border and the problem has become a bit more complicated. The Mexican government has declared war on drug cartels and the border towns are now a war zone. Juarez has had over 200 murders this year and it is 'killing' the local border economy. When the border was fluid, many Americans traveled to Mexico for medical and dental care along with shopping for prescription drugs. Now, it is too dangerous to travel across the bridges....for both Americans and Mexicans.

Karolenna,
What part of ohio are you in? I am in the Northeast

Rabinowitz had a good oped in today''s Journal. Perhaps someone can find a link to it.

mary kitt-neel posted: "the latino vote" will be refined further into "the mexican-american vote," "the cuban-american vote," the "central-american-american vote," etc. i think there are something like 18 million registered latino voters, and even from my limited interaction with them, it is obvious they are not a homogeneous bloc.
respectfully inquiring of latinos/latinas doesn't the term "hispanic" more accurately apply to those who come from spain?

Yeah, but when Obama seems to be moving toward the middle, he claims that what he has said lately is being blown out of proportion. Many columnists don't like what Obama has said or done lately. He obviously doesn't have to worry about losing the Dem nomination now, but he is saying things he didn't say during the primaries. That's what people don't like. To me, it seems as though he's trying to look at some things more realistically.

This is Abu Gonzales' take on the hispanic vote from a recent opinon piece in the LATIMES. Really just for laughs

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-gonzales2-2008jul02,0,3439140.story?track=rss

Mornin' all.

I had a great politics free weekend. Not a single Sunday talk show, not a minute of MSNBC or Fox, and not one op-ed piece. Lots of Wimbledon, doing chores for Mrs. P, and just generally hanging on the 4th eating ribs and drinking wine (yeah, I know beer would be a better match for ribs and the 4th, but hey, I like wine) and dodging thunderbumpers while waiting for the fireworks, and generally enjoying life. Hope most of you did the same. I recommend breaks from politics and the personal nastiness we see here from time to time - it helps clear the mind to consider such things as the importance of the Hispanic vote in the upcoming election.

CQP' s polltracker, citing Pew, has a good take on the importance of the Hispanic vote, and where it may matter.

"Pew says that Hispanics "constitute a sizable share of the electorate in four of the six states that President Bush carried by margins of five percentage points or fewer in 2004." These states were New Mexico (where Hispanics make up 37 percent of state's eligible electorate); Florida (14 percent); Nevada (12 percent) and Colorado (12 percent)."

Those four states are all very close right now, and could be seen as the new (except FL) swing states in this election.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/polltracker/2008/07/where-obamas-edge-among-hispan.html

BTW, many thanks to Dexter for reminding me that the Tour de France began this weekend. Team Columbia (the US team) sounds pretty strong. For those so inclined, the best place to visit for ongoing coverage is http://www.versus.com/tdf

Pogo....I am so happy you prefer wine.

This article brings up Obama's move to the middle. It defends him, but also questions his moves lately.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/huffpost/20080707/cm_huffpost/111099;_ylt=Ai7KOzS0dU4PmjRDlZxFnves0NUE

Here is the Rabinowitz column

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121538889902431161.html?mod=opinion_main_commentaries

Good morning peeps,

Today's thread on the BackChannel Blog is:

Michelle Obama; A New Breed of First Lady, by ChefSheila

http://clistersbackchannel.wordpress.com/

Wow

The Dem convention venue for the final night is being changed to the football stadium in order to admit a crowd expected to be over 75,000 to see Obama accept the nomination.

He is rapidly becoming the political equivalent of a "Pet Rock" or "Mood Ring"

I think Obama has one primary goal in mind and that is winning the White House.

Remember that the information industry (all media) strives to make a story out of everything....find the angle no one else sees, make that statement the headline....etc...who has the best photo of the day...who tripped up today...take words and twist intended meaning...it's no wonder some are getting aggravated.
____

I have grown to really Like Michelle Obama....going to read Chef Shelia's post! Thanks for the heads up.

Unlikely_Burrito, I am in a NE Columbus suburb. If you know John Kasich's hometown, that is also mine. Many Repugs here but Obama seems to have a lot of support. I'm not going to put my signs in the yard yet, because my neighborhood is pretty much Republican; but, after the convention I expect to see the Obama signs and will put up mine.

I have many relatives here who are Obama supporters while the Clinton supporters in the family are in SE Ohio, a place Obama did not win. They are people who believe what is preached in the pulpits on Sunday and that is that Obama is a Muslim, if you can believe. The very wealthy Pastor (loosely) Rob Parsley with his mega-church here in Central Ohio has local commercials on during major network news shows indicating what his sermons will be on Sunday’s. They almost always have something to do with the coming Anti-Christ and with some slight reference to the current days in politics. IMO, he is trying to associate Obama with the Anti-Christ which is what is happening in SE Ohio, WV, and KY.

Brian...should read the new BRAND, not breed, of First Lady. Ahh...women the 'breeder' class of the human race.

More bullshit marketing!

I 'd like to see him accept the nomination, it is a historic event....good for him! I bet the other speeches will be fabulous as well, at least I hope!

Blonde, do you think the political marketing is new???? They have been using marketing for ever in politics. That's all they have they are selling themselves and ideas to the voting public.

There are going to need a lot of confetti for that night! Is the arena a covered one? If it is that is going to be one massive balloon drop!

"If Sen. Barack Obama moves his acceptance speech from the Pepsi Center to Invesco field, he'll need 76,000 people to fill the seats.

Only 50,000 are expected in town for the convention. Many in Denver will be doing their best to avoid downtown that week. I think they need a concert. Remember the 75,000 crowd in Portland, OR? They had Obama follow a free outdoor concert by the Decembrists which was planned in advance."

from a Denver resident,

here is another take on the fourth of july. It is called The Freedom Song and was written and preformed by a guy who lives in Lubbock, TX. His name is Andy Wilkinson and he is a proud Yellow Dog Democrat. Andy is a playwright also. One of the plays he wrote was a one man play about the last night that Charles Goodnight lived. Barry Corbin played Charles Goodnight. Goodnight was a legendary cowman and one of the first ranchers to move cows from Texas to Kansas City via trial drives. With his partner Oliver Loving , they founded the Goodnight-Loving trail out of Texas. Charles Goodnight's sister was a great grandmother to Andy. Andy is now the Artist-In-Residence at Texas Tech at the Southwest Collection.

http://www.westernfolklife.org/site1/images/stories/site/WFCPodcast_016_FreedomSong.mp3

¡yo soy Horsedooty!

Oh, are you near , is it easton? , anyway, I live near many MCcain supporters as well. They donate quite a bit, I found them on the published lists. Plus they already have stickers on cars.....I also have several Obam supporters....in the hood....I was a lone Hillary supporter before she lost....

UB

Gosh, I am stupid. I must have been asleep at the wheel for the other elections. Really, is the US a corporation or a government?

"And I have to admit to feeling slightly heady and badass knowing that the Iranian government would want to kill me."
Posted by: Patsi Author Profile Page | July 7, 2008 9:41 AMPatsi,
LOL

Chloe -- wish I could take the credit, but the words were Mary's...I just loved her whole post...check out her blog!

Obama’s own voice may haunt him

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0708/11542.html

in my experience, relatives in the political business, it was always about getting the message out, how ever you can...sign, speeches, buttons, bummper stickers...etc...that is all marketing, rallys....then we had to promote the rally , with radio spots and commercials....total marketing.....

Just as you do with a new product.

UB, I am just a few miles north of Wexner's Easton. Quite a place for visitors coming into this area, but The Limited, Victoria Secret, and many of their other stores are also suffering from this terrible economy. They've had many, many layoffs.

Jamie: Which would make Hillary, what, a chia pet? Or Ove-Glove, for those sexists out there? At any rate, a slightly less successful product launch?

Am loving how some commenters will not admit voters and caucus goers might have seriously considered their choices and decided Obama would make the better president.

Nah, he's a fad product, marketed to the gullible masses.

I would say he is a modern Democratic politician who can help build a bridge among Americans, who have been polarized too long, and help us move forward in confronting the terrible outcomes of the Bush-Cheney administration.

Note the "help". Americans themselves must do the heavy lifting.

UB

Unfortunately, when we are unhappy with our new product, we can't return it or even find an 800 number for customer service to register our complaint(s) about the product. Plus, I hate getting stuck with a product I didn't elect to buy, but still wound-up paying a big price.

"in my experience, relatives in the political business, it was always about getting the message out, how ever you can...sign, speeches, buttons, bummper stickers...etc...that is all marketing, rallys....then we had to promote the rally , with radio spots and commercials....total marketing....."

Ever try to talk with a Christian Fundamentalist?

Karolenna,

It's the same up here, many closed retails shops, and empty commercial real estate. Ohio was the last place to need this recession.

SE Ohio is scary, don't you think.....That's what gave the state to Bush last time. Wasn't it?

Blondie, it makes sense that you would approve my preference in alcohol. LOL

And jamie, LOL as well. I saw a mood ring a few months ago when they had one of the traveling flea markets specializing in junk smaller than a breadbox at the mall here.

Karolenna, I can, with great relief, report that I haven't seen any ads by Rod Parsley or any ads of that ilk here at all yet. I can only hope that holds for a while. Too many folks around here take that stuff in hook, line and sinker.

The public seems to disapprove of the unilateral actions taken by Pres. Bush. 79% want Congressional approval before any bombing takes place

http://www.gallup.com/poll/108658/Public-Wants-Congress-Approve-Military-Action-Bombings.aspx

"It is interesting to me that it was AFTER Obama’s meeting with Bill Clinton via telephone that he came out with some of these centralist ideas."

ROFL -- it's Bill Clinton's fault! I knew it!

I can not imagine......but my Republican Mother who loves FOX is quite impossible....politics are no longer allowed to be discussed at our Weekly Family dinner....we had to keep the peace.

The only reason I give a damn about Obama's center-move is that he's now saying things he tried to hang Hillary for....

Yes Blonde...look at BUSH not only can we not return him, but the damaged he cause will continue for a lifetime...

Hopefully we will not allow his party a third term.

Off to work for me....no matter what, I know George Bush will be out of office very soon.

"Many of Obama's rightward shifts represent breathtaking changes from what he has long stood for, raising troubling questions about his character and becoming a major GOP attack line in the campaign. "

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/DonaldLambro/2008/07/03/obamas_right_turn_leaves_left_in_the_lurch

dog

I agree that HIllary was a less successful marketing campaign.

If you look at the positions of Sen. Obama and Sen Clinton, they are virtually identical ... Tide and All

The public liked the box of Tide better.

It isn't an insult to say that the majority of the public swallows whole the advertising campaign from their favorite media source. Just because we are a bunch of political mavens untangling all the different strands and nuances doesn't mean this applies to the voting public at large.

All they know is that they are sick of Bush, want a change, and Obama seemed to be promising more change than Clinton. Bad sales job on her part, good sales job on his. Same product different boxes.

dog, for all our sake, I hope you're right about what Obama can accomplish on the domestic front. If he does that he will have proven many naysayers (myself included) wrong. As for me, I just hope he can help do something to reign in the economy, get us the hell out of the middle east, and appoint a couple or three justices who believe in the Bill of Rights to the Supreme Court. He does that and he'll get my vote in 2012 as well as this year.

Oh and technically, the public actually split almost evenly on which brand they wanted with 18 million each. The difference: He got the biggest media markets in the right age group that the buyers of commercials want to see

He got the 18 - 35 ratings and she got the 45+

Her program got cancelled and his got the cover of TV Guide.

Pogo,
Wouldn't that be great! I would love to see, our country back on the right track. One man can not do it by himself, but with a team of like-minded individuals, I believe there are plenty of reasons to be optimistic.

I hope Obama wins the White House - the alternative would be a disaster in my opinion.

Meet The Obamacons
They're a group of elite conservatives who have endorsed the presumptive Democratic nominee.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/07/06/MN3T11JI0P.DTL&tsp=1

Wi