Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

many thanks to Lardass Liberal for an excellent presentation of guidelines for civil debate. could not have said it better myself:

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/whos-on-first.html#comment-48612

Thanks Craig,

For making your wishes known too. Lardass is good for an even voice.

Hey! I'll be back to comment, but I have to start much needed housework.

From Warrens link
http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/whos-on-first.html#comment-48710
"An Iowa Republican congressman said Friday that terrorists would be "dancing in the streets" if Democratic candidate Barack Obama were to win the presidency."

Agree with you Warren
But this seems to be the Republican talking points, I've seen it from several Repubs, almost the same wording like they are reading from a paper.

Obama does need to address this sooner rather than later.
He does have some strong foreign policy statements out there but has been keeping them quiet for political reasons.
Pointing those positions out will be a bit of a political risk for him with the passivist left but they are in his column and won't support HRC

Jack

Well I for one think this whole discussion has been VERY helpful... !!!

Off for a couple hour nap... Craig good to see you are around!

Sheila I'd like to know what you did at ABC...

Tom

I just hate it when I'm in the middle of a post and by the time it gets posted...I'm just under the NEW THREAD

sigh

wasn't important anyway.

KUDOS to whiskyjack for mastering the comment link maneuver -- our preferred method for referencing past comments (instead of copying and pasting entire comments) -- HERE'S HOW: click the date/time link to the right of the commentor's screen name, copy the url address that appears in your browser and paste that into your new comment -- it will automatically create the link once you've published your new comment. And THANKS for playing Trail Mix!

wendy, when that happens just post the link to your recent comment with a teaser (instructions above). here's yours from the last post:

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/whos-on-first.html#comment-48721

I hope you guys are serious about what you've posted this morning! However, I'll believe in your intent to be civil with one another when I see it. I've only been here since last April...arrived during the Imus debacle...but could easily see the strength of some of the friendships among list members. I'll be surprised if some of those friendships can be repaired after the foul things that have passed between some people here. If I were the target of some of it, I can guarantee you that I might TRY to forgive, but I sure as hell wouldn't forget what the other guy was capable of throwing at me when we disagreed.

Words, once spoken, cannot be unspoken.

Everyone makes their own choices and if you can't forgive someone on an Internet Blog, then how the heck do you think there can ever be peace in the world.

Let's try to get some perspective here..... please : )

Hopefully this will not cause a raucous, but I believe there are legitimate questions to be answered.

[From Obama about attacking the other person after the Power comment] “My preference going forward is that we have to be careful not to slip into playing the game as it customarily is played.” (Which is one very good reason I like him)

“But with the stakes of the nominating battle high, some of Mr. Obama’s supporters worry that his campaign has not found a way to deal strongly with criticism from Mrs. Clinton. On Thursday, her senior advisers accused Mr. Obama of acting like the former prosecutor Kenneth W. Starr for raising questions about releasing papers from her time in the White House.”

People, explain to me what is wrong with asking for papers to be released to show Clinton’s qualifications (or lack there of) and why they are not releasing their tax returns. As citizens of the US, aren’t you even interested in why they are doing this? The library situation is even more intriguing. What is in there that BJC is hiding until 2012, when (if she wins two terms) would be the end of her terms. They are hiding something and that is for sure or it would all be out there if they are so proud of their two terms. Why no curiosity from the Clinton side?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23529515/page/2/

I DON'T expect there to ever be peace in the world, march8. Too many people who think too differently from one another. I thought there was a chance when I was younger, but experience teaches me otherwise.

Also, if your post was in response to my comment above, please go back and reread it...I did say I might try to forgive, but wouldn't forget....

Concern for California voters having election fatigue.
Too many candidates and maybe not enough voters for the June primary.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/08/MN4BVG0DD.DTL&tsp=1

two issue:

Taxes : I honestly do not care about their taxes, they make a lot more money they I do, and I doubt it very much that they are breaking any laws. I didn't care about BHO taxes either, what did he release tax year 2005? I know our taxes are not completed yet.

The Library : The Clinton Library is the eleventh Presidential Library administered by the National Archives and Records Administration. This is run by the government, it is a dot "gov "

Harbor - like I said you have every right to do whatever you want...Yes I saw your post

Gees, all that writing and it finished out your last post.

Protectionism and US military capabilites.....Oh well, I guess I've said those things before..LOL

On the lighter side, perhaps you all will like this

http://www.memritv.org/clip_transcript/en/1703.htm

As a little girl I used to tell my family that the only way we could have peace in the world was for people all over the world to be interracially mixed. Then we would all be the same. People, especially at that time, believed that an abhorrence, but today in many areas it is happening. I’ve worked in such divergent companies as intellectual property, R&D, internet technology, etc., and even within these company environments there seems to be a divergence. The higher tech companies seem to have more racially mixed marriages and families, while the more traditional companies are the hard-nosed somewhat bigoted kinds of people.

Maybe I am still that naïve little girl, but I like to see all people as the same and I am proud to still believe that, even though many in my family don’t agree with me. Christianity, IMO, has caused many of these problems, and religions throughout the world continue to do the same. What has most, if not all, the wars been about? In fact, for some this election is about ethnicity and sexism.

I don't think there is anything wrong with asking for the tax returns and the schedule...that's how politics go...just as there is nothing wrong with pressing Obama on Rezko, Goolsbee and even some new questions coming up because of Power (not the monster comment) but other things that have come to light since she got put into the spotlight. His real stance on Israel and where he's really at on the war in Iraq.

So...to me...it's all fair

"Why no curiosity from the Clinton side?"

Couldn't care less. I'm only posting recipes from now on, no matter who flings what.

Maybe Karol, because its apples and oranges

Obama doesn't have the 20 years of filing scrutiny the Clintons do and releasing the archives? I'm all for Bush reading them fast so that can be done. They may very well show Hillary's role in Kosovo, Desert Fox and her problems with NAFTA. Again, apples and oranges if you compare them to Obama's problems.

And be careful of what you wish for.

March8,

just one comment.

On Presidential Libraries.

The federal Government only sees over the security of documents when they are transfered from the national Archives.

The Domuments and Media are considered as always, the property of a former president.

The documents are poured over and divided into the categories by the national archives. Public Information, Private Information, Classified information, and Personal Information.

Pulbic is accessible by the public. Private and Personal are weeded through By Clinton Foundation Archivists, to see what the former president wants to do with. Trash, save, be made public and so on. The Classified is kept separate until deemed declassified.

The Clinton Library does indeed have all of the documents, not the US government.

The National Archives moves all documents to the Libraries as they are finished and opened for the public.

Okay, that makes sense to me. Thanks for the info. So I imagine that Bill Clinton will do have the right to makes those decisions, if he hasn't already. Just like any other former President.

Most of the other presidential candidates did not release their tax returns, probably because they remember Al Gore unfairly being labeled scrooge.

John Edwards said he would not release his returns either nor did most of the the others.

If I were to guess I would say not releasing tax info may have something to do with donations and maybe even a Rezko in there. Just a guess, though, and the reason to hold out.

Well, I am going to start my taxes today. Spreadsheets all done and ready to go! Besides, can't go anyplace in this snow.

absolutely.

The Clinton libraries await the Clinton's go ahead to release the information.

And march, As far as the tax returns. NO primary candidate is forced to reveal their tax returns.

Until the candidate becomes the NOM. However, ALL of the Primary Candidates but one have revealed theirs.

GWB's parent must be so proud...

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hNORmRm4JahUoi8tBwl8CvvliqygD8V954481

POW, ZING, BAM,

Holy Cow Batman, this is a rough place!

"Next week -- Batman jousts with The Joker again!"

I think Obama and Hillary need to start building the case against the GOP.

America stood behind them at the LA Debate when they worked together to point out the flaws of continuing Bush's agenda and articulating their vision for the future. Even in their disagreements on healthcare and Iraq - they made the debate articulate and nuanced and focused on the important issues that need to be considered going forward.

Both candidates need to throw out the kitchen sink method. Many people have argued on this board - that the problem is that Obama and Clinton are making the same attacks that the GOP will make in the general. True - but what is even worse - is that McCain gets to sit back and see what works and what doesn't.

His staffers will also be able to cherry pick from all the dirt each campaign gathers on the other. If we keep this up - we make their job easier. We also risk - as evidenced on this board - that a bitter campaign can also turn the other side's supporters against one another.

Anyways - I am up for a good contest to PA. I think Obama has time to get his message out - and if he wins PA - he will have earned the nomination and proven he is ready for the general. I think most Clinton supporters will agree. If she wins PA - she continues on making her case that she should be the next President of the United States.

I have no problem fighting till PA (or even Puerto Rico on June 7) - because I have always thought Obama has the better case for this election.

This should be about message - not attacks. Obama and Clinton should be making the case against the GOP - not each other.

All this talk about one of the candidates scoring a "knock out blow" is nonsense. In an election year when people want change and are sick of the politics of fear, distraction and personal destruction that typified the Bush years - neither Obama or Clinton can win by "taking down" a historical nominee. Neither can McCain - so let's not do his dirty work for him.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-48738

Seeing if it _really_ works.

IN addition,

Its public information that the Clintons have had joint returns for years. just not anyone's business exactly what is on there.

I am sure the tax return shown to the public will be the 2007 and they will have filed married separate.

I can't think of any other reason not to show off the last couple of years.

ABC News: '08 Candidates Keeping Tax Info SecretMay 11, 2007 ... Candidates, including 2004 Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry in ... Presidential Candidates Defy Tradition, Refuse to Release Taxes ...
abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=3165953 - Similar pages

It seems like much to do about something that really isn't that important.

The fact that Hillary had 5 mil to loan herself, tells me they are way out of my league, and I am sure their taxes are very complicated with the foundation, the speaking engagements, investments, contributions, depreciations, equity trades and ebay profits....maybe they are on-line gamblers?

Good morning...I wanted to share this video from Faux news about the dems and repugs and the election in general. It is a long video about 9 minutes, but it is Karl Rove on O'Reilly. It give a bit of a perspective of what the repugs think of the dems. Wear your nose mittens and listen...it ends with a radio commercial BHO is running in Mississippi...

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/player06.html?030708/030708_oreilly_rove&OReilly_Factor&Tight%20Race&Tight%20Race&O%27Reilly%20Factor&-1&Shows&516&&&exp

My hubby taught me to listen to the other side...it is tough for both of us, but we really need to know what the repugs will be focusing on throughout the next few months. Like it or not, Rove is a politically active and thinking animal.

Warren...I agree with your post and I hope you can watch the video.

"Max, it's been years since we had a military that could simultaneously fight 1-1/2 major wars. At best, now, we could fight one war of the scale of Iraq and mount a limited holding action in a single other area of the world until our allies saw fit to help us out.

IMO, we haven't had a strong military since the middle to late 80s.

Despite the back slapping and amazing technical competence of elements of our armed forces, our actual capability, indexed for the threat environment, is perhaps 20-pct of what it was through much of the Cold War era. And, that's something that's not gone unnoticed by Russia and China.

IMO, we are little more than an empty shell.

Flatus"

1. We have more than 1.2 million in our armed services so 180,000 in Iraq and Afghanistan is NOT breaking our "empty shell".

2. Fire power and technology does make up for much of the troop level declines which is one reason the DoD is against more troops. Peace-keeping and nation building as I pointed out uses up troops that would otherwise be fighting 3G warfare. It is the nature of counter-insurgency and minimizing civlian casualties that have taxed US troops in Iraq. This is the fault of phase 4 planning and the lack of allied support. And as many Democrats and Republicans said back in 2004-2205, THIS WAS NOT INEVITABLE, but rather a consequence of poor planning coupled with poor allied support. This was Biden's view, McCain's view, Zinni's view and Kerry's view. Obama does not make the case that his prediction was the only path and one can only wonder if Powers felt that Saddam had conducted genocide against the Kurds and was worthy of the removal she demands of all genocidal maniacs, be they in the Sudan, Iran, Iraq or Rwanda.

3. The point is that Obama is wrong on his take in Afghanistan. The serious problem is the role most of our aliies are taking, the real point our adversaries see. Why should we move resources from Iraq onto "the battlefields of Afghanistan and Pakistan" as Obama suggests without addressing the underlying problem? Maybe we need them for more important eventualities. Perhaps our national security is better served by a different tact, or should we single-handedly cross the border into Pakistan? Perhaps we need to help Lebanon, Somalia or even Kenya.

4. It was Powers that suggested the US should invade Israel, Gaza and the West Bank, cut military funding and spend many billions creating a Palestianian State while policing the conflict. I did leave that link for Gordo from the Israeli press interview of Powers. Kosovo, Eastern Europe, Afghanistan and even Iraq all fall under the Senate Sub Committee Obama should have been heading and it is ironic he misses these points in his stumping while advisors have altogether different ideas even regarding exemptions for the Telecoms.

5. Although we have pulled back from some early 90's levels after the first gulf war, the gist of my post was that we are not an empty shell and have sufficient resources (even without moving troops from many foreign bases) to deal with hotspots and even preventing Iran from getting the bomb. Several Democrats have even proposed a draft, yet I cannot imagine Obama ever choosing between preventing Iran from getting a bomb and bringing back a draft to bolster possible confrontations. It seems most of those supporting him would prefer ANYTHING to EVER having major military conflicts -a position refuted by our long standing bipartisan NSS and ALL Democratic Presidents (and Republicans) from WW2 o the present.

Again, a serious divide here between Hillary and Obama. Something the Reagan Democrats will consider if forced to decide between McCain and Obama.

Right on Wino Right ON.

And speaking with a strategists tin foil hat on,

The Obama team have something that needs a validation back up with tax returns and the Clinton team is dancing for time.

A new tax return will give them a chance for Nya Nya Campaign style.

Obama is not going to hang with theory against Clinton.

March,
The trump is Tax returns are private until the general and NO ONE is allowed to see all of it unless its sapena'd

Yep, tax returns equals Powers, NAFTA, Malley, Rezko, Auchi. Zbig, Huntington, Rice, Race cards, caucuses, Florida, Public financing, "present" voting, Amnesty bill offered .........

I would love to see the scale you're using.

Is that the best you've got?

There is no requirement to release tax forms in the general. It is entirely voluntary.

Here is the Bloomberg take on releasing tax forms (not to be confused with financial disclosure)

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/2007-08-24-2000993193_x.htm

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-48736

If the Craig method doesn't work for some, there is another method: Right Click on date, left click on Copy Shortcut, right click on Paste in the new message.

Max

What are you talking about? I was just defending your candidate......http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-48776

Not sure if you read my posts right or is it not me?

You must be talking about something or somebody elses post.

Interesting in Wyoming that in 2 counties there are some "uncommitted" - one county in particular is 17% uncommitted.

So then, if she get the nomination, the returns are made public. I guess, she is just following the normal procedure. If she doesn't win the nomination, then she will have preserved her right to privacy. Seems fair and prudent to me.

She is a smart woman. I wouldn't give out my tax returns until they were what I wanted the press to see.

Just like this NAFTA Spoof and the rezko thing, Clintons are using them to imply....nothing really. I beleive Obama is just playing the same game or they have a theory that needs validating.

Some behind the public's back politics that ALL play.

Hillary just added two county wins to her total but he's winning his counties by bigger margins so overall total not favorable to Hillary.

They also split two counties

He's won 4

so far.

Maxtrue:

I think I agree in part. There is nothing wrong with our military. We overthrew Saddam and Iraq's "army" in short order.

As you correctly point out - the problem is with Washington. The lack of long-term planning and the failure to get assistance from our allies in the nation-building phase of Iraq has caused the strain on our military (and our own economy as we borrow billions of dollars to pour into Iraq instead of the US).

I think Obama's Foreign Policy stances are the best way forward. He can make a clear statement that the Bush era is over. And he is also willing to aggressively lead the world in the war on terror. He - like Clinton - will be able to re-engage our allies to decrease the strain on our military.

And there will not be peace in the Middle East until we deal with the Israel-Palestine conflict. The peace will not result from military action that "defeats" countries hostile to Israel - because any such action would only lead to more hostility in the region.

Karolenna,

A lot of us have had that hope for a long, long time. In James Michener's "Hawaii", published in 1959, the last chapter is called "The Golden Men".

'...in Hawaii, a new type of man was being developed. He was a man influenced by both the West and the East, a man at home in either the business councils of New York or the philosophical retreats of Kyoto, a man wholly modern and American yet in tune with the ancient and the Oriental. "

In this chapter, he weaves together all the people of the islands: Chinese, Japanese, Haole, Portuguese, and all the soldiers and sailors of WWII who came and mixed with the Islanders. Michener pays tribute to the results of and inherent difficulties sometimes experienced by the GOLDEN MEN and looks to a future where race won't matter.

For those who want Wyoming results...

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/state/#val=WY

(CNN still has the best graphics)

Blondie:

I can't open the video.

Looking good for Obama in Wyoming.

On the CNN site, if you place your mouse over the county map, it will give you percentages...

THanks Wino,

very Very helpfull!

Afternoon all,
The more I think about this whole thing, I do not see any good ending. Of course I am not a politician but there does not seem to be an answer. I am wondering if Bill's comment on the dream team is his way of trying to unify the democrats. Interesting I have not heard Obama trying to do the same.
If he gets the nob, I predict that MCCain will win. The women of the country will be pis------.
I know I will,

Obama just outright lied (well put the best possible spin on a previous statement) about his position on Iraq withdrawal.

The biggest problem these two candidates have is that their actual positions on virtually every single issue is identical with only minor shadings around the edges, but they have to keep putting the worst possible spin on anything the other says.

Wendy...Sweetwater county just came in for Clinton...changed the percentages.

OK - so Hillary's experience working with salmon means she should answer the phone at 3:00 a.m.

I think Obama has shown the type on long-term planning that demonstrates he will be thinking about the issue on the other end of the 3:00 a.m. phone call long before he receives it.

That was a neat story Sen Clinton just told about sliming fish in Alaska. That must have been a great trip for a young person ... working your way across the U.S. Canada and Alaska

Hye Wino:

I saw

problem is...she's winning by smaller margins in counties where nobody is voting

The one very populous county he won (Albany)...he won by a big margin...that's why the % are the way they are.

I mean in one county 20 people voted...they split 10/10

it is nice to see some light blue on the map...even if it is deceiving...LOL

I'll be interested to see when Laramie comes in.

ummm "Hey Wino" I meant

LOL

"Video: Power on Iraq
Samantha Power, in this video (below) that Clinton is pushing, says Obama's commitment to withdraw from Iraq is subject to what's happening on the ground and advice from military commanders and advisors in 2009.

We thought that was Clinton's position as well as Obama's. Isn't that what presidents are supposed to do? Well, the Clinton campaign says it's waffling and, apparently, they're onto something politically, because the Obama campaign is insisting that -- notwithstanding the words of his ex-foreign-policy-advisor -- his commitment to withdrawal is "rock solid."

A capper to a fine week for Obama:"

http://weblogs.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/politics/blog/2008/03/video_power_on_iraq.html

She should have stuck to the monster mash.

Hey Warren:

I can't disagree with you on Obama's long term planning skills...every time he gets elected to an office...he seeks out the people he will need to push him forward to the next highest office...very good planning.

Jamie,

Not saying you are wrong, just pointing out that links are great for statements like that.....

Also, if you are not willing to dig, you will never know the truth. And if you want to believe what you WANT to beleive, well you have a right.

Hope in the Time of NAFTA
By David Sirota
In These Times

Friday 07 March 2008

http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/030708LB.shtml
Reading articles about Hillary Clinton attacking NAFTA can lead you to believe The Onion has taken over America's news bureaus.

Clinton spent the last 10 years repeatedly praising the trade deal in speeches, most recently calling the job-killing accord "good for New York and America." Yet, journalists barely mention that record as they transcribe her assertions that, "I have been a critic of NAFTA from the very beginning."

This week, such media negligence went from pathetic to absurd, as a CNN headline blared, "Clinton hammers Obama on NAFTA." Political scribes breathlessly recounted how the New York senator criticized her opponent - a longtime NAFTA critic - over a thinly sourced television report claiming his adviser, economist Austan Goolsbee, told Canadian officials to not take the campaign's anti-NAFTA platform seriously. Clinton said the uncorroborated allegations, seeded by Canada's right-wing government, showed "the difference between talk and action." Most journalists regurgitated her charges without noting the difference between Clinton's new fair-trade talk and her decade-long pro-NAFTA actions (nor did they note that the same report said Clinton advisers also did what Goolsbee was accused of).

Of course, Bill Clinton signed NAFTA after pledging to oppose expanded cross-border trade until Mexican wages rose. So Hillary Clinton's dishonesty, which sealed her Ohio primary win, is nothing new in politics

Hillary is arguing that MI and FL should be seated as is or be re-done - because it is unthinkable to disenfranchise voters in those states.

Why did she sign a pledge saying that those votes would not be counted?

It did not seem unthinkable when she thought she would have this thing wrapped up by Feb. 5. She should have known from the start that MI - which she has ties to - and FL - with plenty of older voters - would have been strong for her. Poor judgment based on arrogance...sound familiar?

I note the Republican Caucus was closed while the Democratic one is open. Does this mean that anyone can caucus in Wyoming?

Just looked at the wyoming caucus numbers.
lol
I could go out in my neighborhood and throw a rock and would hit more Democrats than are in Wyoming.

Jack

I think this is the true reason Samantha Powers resigned was this appearance and what sh said on Hardtalk.

Yeah! Big win for Hill in Converse County

Boo! Nobody lives there

LOL

"OK - so Hillary's experience working with salmon means she should answer the phone at 3:00 a.m."

No Warren. It means that even as a young woman she was adventurous, goal oriented, and capable of problem solving without shoving necessary work on to others. Basic character seldom changes and this woman has a lot of strength, dedication and character.

I agree Wendy. I think that long-term planning is an important skill for a President. Sometimes that can get lost if you are too busy fighting.

Wendy...if anything in Wyoming is not very populated! I have traveled quite a bit in the area...a lot of interesting history. Lusk, Wyoming (eastern part of the state near South Dakota) actually used to be called Lust, Wyoming. In pioneer times it is where all of the women working the 'world's oldest profession' used to live. The name was changed to Lusk for 'moral' reasons. I have been in the Big Horn Mountains doing field work. The Tetons are beautiful and Jackson Hole is fun, but for the rich and famous. I spent time at the University of Wyoming in Laramie. I had relatives in Cheyenne. Really an unusual place...and the wind blows in the eastern part of the state worse than New Mexico. Many a settler woman would kill her family during the wind storms while the husband was out hunting. Just one of those rugged places. No wonder Cheney calls it home.

I'd like to see that Pledge the candidates "signed" re: Mi and Fla. I thought it was only about campaigning.

dave Sirota is an Obama supporter who has previously been fired from campaigns for political dirty tricks...not the most reliable source

I floated back to campus and the excitement lingered–until the next morning, when I picked up the Inquirer and saw a photograph of a dejected Dwight Evans filling three-quarters of the front page. "Rep. Evans Shakes Up Staff Over Web Site Dirty Trick," read the headline. Someone had created a fake Web page for another Democratic candidate, John White Jr., posting damaging racial comments White was said to have offered in a Latino newspaper. And that someone, the story revealed, turned out to be a friend of David Sirota. Evans had immediately fired Sirota, and plans for the Web site, the story said, were on hold.
Well, I thought glumly, there goes my "Student Center."

http://www.upenn.edu/gazette/0999/kaniss2.html

Here is the Anneberg fact check a different view
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/the_facts_about_nafta-gate.html

Jamie

If they didn't have it open there would be nobody there.
You need somebody to show up and claim to be a democrat. ;-0

Jack

Wyoming is the redest of red states...James Watt was actually born in Lusk, Wyoming.

Jack thats funny,

Even with 60% of the vote counted, I'm sure we're talking 3 out of 5 DEMS in the state. ;0)

Yep - I agree Warren - but I'd rather someone be long term planning about the things that make a difference to American's and their lives ratther than just long term planning that fulfills one's own political ambitions.

Hillary's detailed plans on many issues shows that she has been thinking about the issues that really matter to people -

I also welcome some of you to watch the videos by the every day people on this site (not her friends and family) but the people that encountered Hillary on issues of health care and after 911 to see what she actually did to help people personally.

http://thehillaryiknow.com/

Is she ambitious...yes...but...she's proven that she takes a very personal interest in her constituents lives.

That's the kind of commitment and long term planning I trust...

Truthout has had frequent problems with its accuracy. It is always a good idea to double check anything there through a couple of other sources.

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/02/20/jason-leopold-out-at-truthout/

59,000 registered Democrats in Wy and it is closed caucus. It looks like every Democrat turned out.

OK Wendy - are saying Mrs. Clinton is not politically calculating. This has been one of the most serious charges against her and Bill their whole political career.

The problem is - she has gotten it wrong. She mis-read the Iraq vote and she mis-read America in this election.

Max, here are the latest annual strength figures:
http://siadapp.dmdc.osd.mil/personnel/MILITARY/history/hst0709.pdf

In gross numbers they are well under 1/2 what we had 40-years ago--and the current numbers include 100s of thousands members of the reserve forces.

And, in managing to maintain the large number of combatants in SW Asia, DoD has forced improvements in the tip-to-tail ratio at the expense of training and respite from in-theater stresses.

And, there are many anecdotal reports of real problems in reliability of deployed materiel and of depletion of war reserves.

I do agree that our NATO allies, after their initial burst of support in 2001, have not, with some notable exceptions, continued the level of support required by their treaty obligations to defend us by completely destroying the Taliban and al-Qa'ida.

I think we let them off the hook by our own muddying of the waters in moving over to Iraq, a country for whom it was a real stretch to extend their treaty obligation.

I have recollections of Gen Jones' exit briefings upon his departure as SACEUR where he discussed our place within NATO and the shared responsibilities of all our partners. Well worth the effort if you can dig them up.

I simply don't have the level of confidence in our ability to provide for our own defense or of meeting our treaty obligations as I had even ten years ago.

Actually,

I don't go completely by a blog. Would rather wait until all the facts are out,

but wanted to point out that just plain callin a man a liar without facts to help the reader is just not right.

As far as NAFTA? I suspect that their is some hanky panky with the Clintons, but again.

Politics is politics. This year is becoming no better than the last 250 years.

NAFTA has a lot of holes. The Clintons have some investment in NAFTA and former Clinton Aides have benefited. So there are some questions and valid ones at that.

I linked a Canadian article. I'll try to find it again. be back soon.

Shelia, I've been away from the computer. My remarks were general over the tax issue. To prevent this from happening again, I will address comments by name. Sorry.

Now let me check what people have said......

The candidates pledged not to campaign in Michigan and Florida. It was the party that issued the order that the delegates would not be seated. That part had nothing to do with the candidates

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/02/us/politics/02dems.html

Thanks so much MaxTrue,

I was a little confused. I have the same problem and need to be more specific sometimes. ;0)

Jamie...here is the info about the ad that "leaked" into Florida

http://adage.com/campaigntrail/post?article_id=123242

Carl Bernstein hardly a fan of Senator Clinton says her NAFTA position is consistent

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/01/31/carl-bernstein-says-hillary-clinton-fought-against-nafta-when-bill-implemented-it/

And to everyone who thinks Samantha Power resigned over what she said about Iraq - you are barking up the wrong tree.

What Ms. Power said on Iraq is spot-on. It is also the best way to take on the GOP in the general.

Hillary Clinton always says she does not engage in hypotheticals. But her whole Iraq Policy is based on a hypothetical "day one." She claims she will call in the Joint Chiefs and "tell" them to get the troops out in 60 days. We don't know what will be happening in Iraq in Jan. 09 - and we should stop having our Foreign Policy dicated by campaign slogans.

I agree with Obama on this issue. We need a President to make a clear statement that this war is over. And to work together with our military, and our wisest politicians from both sides of the aisle - to design the best way forward.

The point about change is moving away from ideaology and moving towards intelligent policy-making. This is what Ms. Power was expressing. And I am sorry to she had to resign. (Is she single?)

Hey Warren:

I think all politicians are calculating. That includes Clinton - that includes Obama.

Did she get it wrong on Iraq...no doubt. But I've stated my position on the vote and believe based on Obama's patterns, who he associated with when he got to the US Senate and his subsequent voting record...he would have voted the same...so giving a speech at an anti-war rally doesn't make me believe him.

More evidence of his "wishy washyness" has come out as recently as last week - Power interview re: Iraq. His position on Israel and NAFTA. He goes where he needs to go based on what office he is currently trying to get.

A good point brought up today at a political round table. obama has run for office 6 times in the past 12 years. He's been campaigning half the time he's held offices. If you ask me...that shows an ambition that is less concerned about what he can do for people than what he can do for himself.

If you look at the popular vote (all of it) Hillary is ahead of Obama. This does not show a mis-read of American's in this election...well that's if you're a glass is half full person. If you're a glass is half empty person...it shows that both she and Obama have mis-read about half of American Democrats.

Is it possible that with what was presented and distributed to our voting Senators regarding Iraq, that HRC vote was actually a correct vote ?

Samatha Powers stated the Clinton position on Iraq good of you to recognize it as good policy.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-48797

Warren

On Iraq when pushed outside of their "talking points" both candidates have said EXACTLY the same thing. The GOAL is to get everyone out and to start that withdrawal within a few days of moving into the White House BUT it all hinges on the conditions on the ground and there is no way of knowing what those conditions truly are until Georgie is thrown out on his never to be missed ass.

Everything else is just bells, whistles, and shiny things to entertain the crowds.

march8,

In all truth, real truth, we can't know that as the public, because all of the evidence is not declassified yet.

So, the press is really reading in and around the subject.

I still say the congress has got a huge reason why they haven't acted more swiftly to date. The Adminstration has got some hush power in there.

There is no doubt NOW. based on intelligence from other countries and the power of the public record, that there was hanky panky on the part of the administration.

But...nothing to do with whether her vote was wrong or right. The POLITICS of this is someone admitting when in hindsight they were wrong or the policy was wrong.

Like NAFTA. great on paper, WRONG in real life.

Perhaps I am a little hungover but isn't CNN spelling Obama's name wrong if you look at the map of election results?

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-48797

Warren, your point here dovetails with one of the links Mr. Crawford provided. It seems that the Maverick McCain is directly responsible for Boeing losing the contract to Airbus last week. All his talk about killing a $6 Billion pork project was actually worth a lot more to the 40 states that lost jobs because of his actions.

I think if the two remaining Democrats wanted to promote healing, they would do the following:

* Decide to campaign against McCain only for the rest of this month.

* Agree to spend against each other, what they would have received if they accepted Federal matching funds. Use the rest to campaign against McCain.

* Act like adults. That includes telling their campaign staffs to stop acting like idiots and in Clinton's case, if she is paying them the millions we've heard, tell them to act as such.

If they do this, they can win in November. If they don't, not good...

"if you look at the popular vote (all of it) Hillary is ahead of Obama. This does not show a mis-read of American's in this election...well that's if you're a glass is half full person. If you're a glass is half empty person...it shows that both she and Obama have mis-read about half of American Democrats."

Nice sophistry. The fact remains that at the start of this election - Clinton had a huge lead over Obama. Obama's message and his campaign have won over new voters and he has shrank Clinton's base. That fact does not go away simply because the media has "reset" the election.

Obama is not going to win over the most loyal Clinton supporters - and vice-versa. So I do not think anyone will deliver a knock-out blow. But Obama will continue to win.

On the taxes issue, and sorry I've been napping, but I think Hillary should just release them... What's the problem here? And like someone's post here earlier, I don't care at all about what her tax forms say, but this hyper-secrecy just creates an unnecessary distraction and issue.

Jamie:

I agree. But the fact that Obama did not vote for the Iraq War allows him to make the anti-war case stronger against McCain.

If Hillary was the nominee - McCain would beat her over the head with the Iraq vote - and also by saying her positions are driven by polls instead of conviction. He would also argue she was wrong on the surge - while he showed great political courage in supporting it. This is precisely the campaign he used against Romney. Who like Clinton - was articulate and well-versed on the economy.

An acoustic tribute to John McInsane McCain, touting his blowup on "Straight Talk Jet-'spress" y-day...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF3RpDBCKlo

March:

"Is it possible that with what was presented and distributed to our voting Senators regarding Iraq, that HRC vote was actually a correct vote ?"

Many Senators voted against the Iraq authorization. And despite what Clinton supporters say about Obama's comments in 2004 - he still said that in his eyes the case was not made.

It was also clear to me - and many Americans - that Bush would use the authorization to start a war - not diplomacy. So Clinton's "excuse" is weak and reprehensible. Plus, don't forget the story that she did not read the NIE before her vote. The GOP would have a field day with that.

What is it with the taxes. You all just can't wait to pour over the details? She has said they will be released on April 15 or shortly after. That means they will be out before Pennsylvania.

Most people in their income bracket simply do not file until the last second simply to hang on to interest money for as long as possible until Uncle Sam gets his share.

Patience please.

On Sunday's "Meet the Press" interrogation, host Tim Russert quizzed the Illinois senator closely on a number of apparent inconsistencies between his actions and stated positions -- taking state lobbyists' contributions while criticizing federal lobbyists' contributions to his opponents, and not releasing documents, schedules, memos, etc., from his days as an Illinois state senator while criticizing Hillary Clinton for not releasing papers from her White House years.

Russert also inquired about inconsistent quotes by Obama about the Iraq war, leading to this exchange
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2007/11/obama-speak.html

Warren

And those who DID read the NIE and are supporting Obama also voted to authorize to give Bush the powers just like Sen Clinton. Apparently reading the NIE made no difference whatsoever.

Warren

Obama has had quite a bit of trouble fending off attacks in the past week...do you think Iraq is going to be the only issue?

Iraq is important in certain areas of the country...but not others...

This campaign will be about national security and the economy.

Obama is weak on both as proven this week.

Hillary is stronger on the economy than McCain. It will be a battle over national security - no doubt McCain will have some chops there so it will come down to a battle of get them out or leave them in Iraq.

Hillary has a plan to get them out of Iraq that she will have to fight for but her plan is the same as Obama's so you can put your weak candidate with one speech up against McCain or someone that has proven she can fight for and win on the issue of national security against McCain.

And it's been said before...Hillary has pulled her punches...the Republicans won't - if he can't take a little love tap from Hillary...what's going to happen when the Republicans hit him for real?

Warren...BHO wasn't in the senate for the vote to invade Iraq, plain and simple -- so how you realistically say he didn't vote for the war? He just didn't vote on this.

before I'm attacked I have to qualify something I said.

Hillary has proven that she can fight and win an argument on national security (3 a.m. ad - no matter how you feel about it...it was effective - yes - she'll have to come up with something else against McCain...but she will). And therefore...she is better to argue the issue with McCain

NOT

that she's proven she can beat McCain on national security.

God of The Spell Check...

Hmmm....Thoughtfull...Your wrote;

Warren, your point here dovetails with one of the links Mr. Crawford provided. It seems that the Maverick McCain is directly responsible for Boeing losing the contract to Airbus last week. All his talk about killing a $6 Billion pork project was actually worth a lot more to the 40 states that lost jobs because of his actions

have to look this up!

A WAKE UP CALL FOR HILLARY CLINTON
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_allen_l__080308_a_wake_up_call_for_h.htm

well I was hoping she'd pull out a narrow win in Larame county---no such luck

I'm still interested to see the number of uncommitted voters. I mean...why go caucus if you don't have a dog in the fight?...especially since it won't net you any delegates...I guess there is a group out there that wanted to make some kind of statement...but they're pretty spread out.

In addition..

I think if the two remaining Democrats wanted to promote healing, they would do the following:
* Decide to campaign against McCain only for the rest of this month.
* Agree to spend against each other, what they would have received if they accepted Federal matching funds. Use the rest to campaign against McCain.
* Act like adults. That includes telling their campaign staffs to stop acting like idiots and in Clinton's case, if she is paying them the millions we've heard, tell them to act as such.
If they do this, they can win in November. If they don't, not good...
Posted by: God of the Spell Check | March 8, 2008 2:49 PM

Well said,
Please come back "GOD" and post more often.

Clinton has the same foreign experience as Laura Bush. Going to 80 countries? Give me a break. She was there receiving greetings and going to teas. Why doesn't she release her White House papers to let us in on all of this "experience" she brought to the White House? Give me a break.

Jamie she hasn't released any of her past tax returns, not just 2007. WHAT ARE THEY HIDING?

Flatus,
You were generally correct the first time -about a 20% reduction from the mid eighties when we were prepared to defeat a MAJOR force on one side of the world and hold against another Major player on the other. Then ADD the significant increase in fire power of predators, stealth, precision weapons and the advent of 4G fighting. How you get to fighting insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan as our limit is beyond me. I have discussed this at many military blogs and Iran's conventional forces would last about 72 hours our being in Iraq or not. Our Navy has not really been tasked, our air force sufferes mostly from F-15 problems and the push for unmanned weapons has been huge as well as the push fro missile defense that has scored many successes as of late. That is why the Chinese and Russians are worried.

To claim that we cannot thwart Iran, bolster Columbia if need be, intervene in Somalia, Lebanon or Darfur is not borne out by facts, -not that I am suggesting that all. It is just untrue that we are an empty shell. And it took Reagan how lonmg to turn around Carter's dismal failure while touting his "Carter Doctrine"?

Now I agree with you that Bush's phase four planning has been terrible and the cost in troops and damaged hardware has been great. FIASCO is a case study, but read the last chapter. Obama's idea of greater forces in Afghanistan from the start is dubious as Frank's 4G approach is the way to go. THe Northern Alliance sees NATO at work and is pulling back to defend themselves. Much going on is perception which is why the signals from Obama are dangerous. Within the military there is talk of coalitions with India, Pakistan and others to field an international 4G support-force in places like Africa, Asia and the Middle East to work with locals so we don't end up fighting insurgents and getting pnned down.

I also agree completely that Europe has let us down and doesn't really have the stomach for force. Demographics, Russia and extremists will change that however. They are showing signs of waking up in the face of Putin and Islamists and even China's new defense spending. From what I have learned from one commander in Iraq is that we are very capable, can thwart the problems I mentioned above without increassing the size of the DoD, but need to repair broken materials, shift around troops that are not needed elsewhere and demand a bigger role by NATO. Can you imagine if the UN or NATO had forces in Iraq now? And the fact that China and Russia not only avoid their peace-keeping roles but actually add to the West's problems is absurd.

Warren,

I cannot agree with you. The signal Obama would send based on his present stance would encourage our adversaries. No wonder FARC was hoping Obama will win as does Chavez. Putin prays McCain loses as does China. Why is it that most extremists favor Obama? And I hardly think it is fair to ever call Barak an idiot dove. Our allies seem to favor Clinton. Most experts feel Clinton would not support Odum's Iranian Grand Bargin which Obama proably will. Barak can't even support sanctions. Another thing is Obama's intended use of special ops. We don't have a lot of them and as they are a huge national asset. Sending them up the Kyber Pass is a huge mistake. These are the guys that would have to capture Pakistan's nukes or thwart terror operations.

I can't imagine why you think a candidate that has built a foreign policy around what he thinks is the opposite of Bush has done is a bright move. Ask him a foreign policy question and he rants about Bush. I point out the support of the military that Hillary has more of, the clear plan Hillary laid out on the floor of the Senate before the resolution to authorize force was approved and the bipartisan attempt by Bill to conduct foreign policy . Yes,there were mistakes like the failed moves in Iran -screwed up in the Gore agreement with Russia. Still, Hillary leaned towards agreements with NK that kept them from using their plutonium, force in Serbia, support of the Israeli proposal to Arafat and supporting Desert Fox. Obama has no such record and advocates wishful thinking and dubious theories such as that our troops quickly leaving Iraq will encourage peace. That is another lie Democrats don't really believe, but it sounds good. At least Jon Stewart was honest and admitted it would then get worse, but why care? Maybe Powers should care and given Obama's possible re-entry back into Iraq should it fall apart, he should care too. Words do matter.

Actually, Alpha1906

CNN did a fact check on HRC' claims and found out they were true...she has done more than Laura Bush. I will try to look for a link.

Wyoming continues Obama's march to the nomination, despite Hillary setting the goal posts where she wants. BTW, did any of you notice that Obama won the most delegates from Texas? Hillary can't win even when she "wins".

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/feb/19/clintons-35-year-claim/

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/feb/19/clintons-35-year-claim/

Okay, Barbara Bush. Nancy Reagan. Mamie Eisenhower.

BHO wins in Cheyenne...Laramie County.

Clinton won the delegate count in Texas
(she lost the caucuses but still got the most delegates)

Alpha - tea is an Obama talking point.

CNN finds that her foreign policy experience checks out pretty good

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/06/clinton.foreign.fact/

has she answered the phone at "3 a.m." probably not...but I'd say it's a darn good bet she was in the room during a crisis and her opinion sought.

Also...let's not forget Susan Rice was pretty emphatic when she said Obama was not ready to answer the phone...so CNN says Hillary checks out...Rice says Obama is not ready.

I love it when a caucus in Wyoming is a sign the Messiah has returned.

Penn is worh how many Wyomings and it is a Blue State with lots of Democratic voters. Try winning the WH without Penn and Ohio or even Florida. Nyet

Thank you, Wendy...it took me a bit longer to find it

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/06/clinton.foreign.fact/index.html

Alpha...re comparing Hillary to Laura Bush as far as experience level. There's no comparison. Both Hillary's supporters and her enemies will remember that she was heavily involved in running the West Wing, particularly in the early years of the Clinton presidency. And we're talking quite literally -- not just bedtime pillow talk with her hubby the prez. She had a West Wing office for awhile, and threw her weight around directly with Clinton's White House staff.

It's why a lot of people ended up hating her -- particularly on the health care initiative. So I think it's unfair not to give her her due for seasoning and experience now when she was right there in the crucible when all the Bunsen burners were turned up on high.

Don't you remember how Al Gore used to joke about being "number three" at the White House?

Obama's being a bit disingenuous when he ignores the fact that she was, in a sense, a co-president for eight years. It's a whole lot different even than being one of 100 senators.

Doesn't it disturb any Clinton supporters, and I'm serious about this, that your candidate has decided to hell with the Democratic Party and will bring it down in order to chase her own ambition. She is not going to have the most primary wins. She will not have the most delegates. She won't even have more total votes. She's lost 14 out of 16 contests and if her name was "Mick Romney" we'd call her a joke for staying in. And yet she's out there praising the ENEMY, someone the Democratic candidate will run against. Again, you watch the Clintons and you see why people hated them for so long. They will stoop to anything and are pure naked ambition. And they'll do anything, no matter how destructive, to win. I think I'll go to Barnes and Noble and check out some of those Clinton books I previously called hit jobs. Maybe they were on to something?

Yes, I would love to see the arguement between Rice and Obama...LOL Meanwhile, Hillary does have a case she is ready. I pointed out a few items above.

Lardass,

If she has that experience and wants to tout that experience, then she needs to release her papers to verify that experience. Until then, it's all anecdotal.

Warren,

Do you think that BHO's practice or continually pointing to the past, is going to fly with the American people? Most people, I know, want to fix problems that exist today. Also most people are in agreement that Americans were lied into WAR by this Bush White House.

When BHO keeps saying "I was against the war ", it doesn't really answer as to what he has to offer going forward. It doesn't help the mother who lost a son or daughter, it sounds a bit empty and almost " I told you so - ish." It doesn't help the military families that are experiencing their third tour of duty. It's as if he washes his hands of the current reality.

If BHO wants to be seen as a visionary, having superb judgment, he needs to speak to the future, and not blame others for the past. Acknowledge where we are, stand tall and make people believe he has concrete ideas and confidence needed to move forward.

.

Wendy,

Do you really want to go back over land deals? Is that a ghost you really want resurrected?

People in the states with up coming primaries are thrilled to have their votes counted.

Why do Obama supporters want to suppress their right to participate. This process has strengthened the already successful Dean fifty state strategy.

I find the Obama supporters attempts to shut down voting much more disturbing.

Alpha1906

"Doesn't it disturb any Clinton supporters, and I'm serious about this, that your candidate has decided to hell with the Democratic Party and will bring it down in order to chase her own ambition"

Please, the dem core is a bit taken aback by BHO always telling us how he does much better with repugs and indies...in all reality, that is so much BS that HRC is not a great dem.

I'd much rather allow them to revisit issues that were investigated for years and millions of dollars spent that came up empty than give them fresh dirt to dig in.

I think most American's will say...ya know...we've been over this and you spent all that money and found NOTHING.

So the simple answer is...YES!

Obama lost or threw away his papers.

As of the 4th, the delegate count for Texas is 92/92 for each. There are 193 delegates and so far 184 have been pledged.

Looks like the count will take more time to pledge? Strange Caucas/Primary Doots!

Wendy,

I read the CNN info. Isn't a bunch of Hillary's "experience" tangential? I've been married to my wife for sixteen years. As a result, she's accompanied me to tons of writers events. Just because she was there, doesn't make her a writer. Can make her a bit knowledgeable about writers, but doesn't make her a writer. Same with Hillary. Sitting in a meeting puts her there. Doesn't give her experience. I'm sure Bill's personal assistant was at all of those meetings. I wouldn't say he had "experience" either.

I have to run, but thanks again for some fun debate...and in looking over the next primary/caucus. We still have Indiana after Pennsylvania because this is going to convention!

"There are a few periods during her Arkansas years when she had less time for public service because she was busy with corporate law and her duties as a new mother. But an examination of her resume and interviews with her biographers show she had a wide range of political and public service roles over those 35 years."

from the alpha+ link...

:-D

Alpha...it's not anecdotal. It's pretty much an accepted fact that legions of people who were in Washington or watching the news during those years lived through in real time.

Your counter-punch is tendentious -- like saying we can't suppose that Dick Cheney wields any influence in the Bush White House until we see all his papers.

As far as Hillary's "private papers," I think that is a red herring. They should be treated no differently than any other private papers of chief executives and/or spouses have been treated over the years. I'm assuming they're released according to a certain schedule. Hell...I think Jackie Kennedy put a 50-years-after-I-die lid on some of their internal documents...documents that may have shed important light on presidential history.

Obama has lots of "office papers" too -- and since elected lawmakers are not subject to the Freedom of Information Act, he doesn't have to release them. That's the letter of the law. Has he thrown open all his file cabinets in his Senate office to public scrutiny? I don't know, but somehow I doubt it.

As far as Hillary's taxes, I agree she should release them as soon as possible.

Doesn't it distrub Obama supporters that your candidate played the race card, has gotten less votes by actual Democrats, wins in caucuses and mostly Red states and palys politics with policy position while getting unpaid for support from media for most of his rise to top dog?

Now that should shake the core of most Democrats and this Obama campaign will be his undoing should he face McCain. It is that simple Alpha and I take personallt the personal attacks and race card Obama played when he was down and out. He started the mud first questioning Hillary's credentials, truthfulness and called her a Republican Lite. Who was Obama's mentor? Lieberman. Did Obama ever say he would nuke Iran or that he would do eveything to prevent Iran from getting a bomb? He didn't even show for the Quds vote and his toughest words are not for AQ, but for Bush.

McCain is not the enemy of the the US. Iran, Hamas, Hizb'Allah, Ahmadinejad, Assad and others are the real enemies. How do you "work" with the Republicans while calling McCain no less the enemy? Your statement just shows how little you mean by bipartisan, civility, a fresh, start, turning the page, hope, change. McCain sacrifed for years in a POW camp. He is a hero you want to call the enemy. How bright. Now I see how easy it was for Powers to call Hillary, not Saddam a monster. Her expertise is genocide and she calls HIllary a monster. Rice calls the next President the Janitor of the OWrld clean up every global problem which Bush created. Fine spin. It is this old school partisanship, this vilification, this immature name calling and polarization I hope the Democrats reject. It seems what was good for Rove is great for Obama.

Learn, please learn. And that is just my opinion as I certanly am no Messiah.

Alpha +

I thought you said your name was "Civility Patrol" This morning? ;0)

Wendy,

I'm America paid attention to the details of things, none of you would try to tie Rezco to Obama during a trial that has nothing to do with Obama.

Nope, it doesn't matter if it's old news. That bad taste in Democratic mouths is about Clinton and their "secrecy". Beware of what you wish for.

Alpha...Hillary ran lots of meetings, didn't just sit in them. And on lots of stuff, Bill deferred to her before he gave his staff orders.

That was part of the "Clinton Dysfunction" that drove everyone crazy.

:)

The faster I try to respond, the worse my typos as I cannot type (but I can play the keyboard...LOL) Sorry again for the terrible typos.

That wasn't me. Someone is trying to use a name similar to mine. I don't know what they said. LOL

Cool, but then release the papers so we can see what's true and what's anecdotal. Don't just tell me, show me. That way I can see what she can take credit for and what she needs to take responsibilty for. Did she support NAFTA? Did she have a hand in NAFTA? Can't know if we don't see her papers.

We all know their can only be one Alpha!!

Matxtrue:

"The signal Obama would send based on his present stance would encourage our adversaries. No wonder FARC was hoping Obama will win as does Chavez. Putin prays McCain loses as does China."

I think Obama will allow Chavez, Russia and China to become less our adversaries - and more our partners in fighting terrorism, genocide and global warming.

"Barak can't even support sanctions."

As I have said before - sanctions must be measured. Sanctions are designed to deal with our "adversaries." However, we usually have an issue with the leader - not the country. Economic sanctions hurt "people" and make them more extreme and more likely support the leader we are trying to depose - and in the end - the US is the scapegoat through propoganda.

Sanctions and refusing to meat with our so-called enemies are often counter-productive methods. They are hallmarks of Bush's foreign policy. These tactics increase tension. The one good thing is that lifting economic sanctions can be one of the carrots Obama can use to gain international cooperation in the Middle East and elsewhere.

And all you Clinton supporters can keep pointing to all the generals that support Hillary. Well that is a natural by product of spending time in Washington. Many generals stood behind and continue to stand behind Bush - that does not mean his judgment is correct.

LOL

Or God of Spellcheck
or UN Peacemaker

March:

"If BHO wants to be seen as a visionary, having superb judgment, he needs to speak to the future, and not blame others for the past. Acknowledge where we are, stand tall and make people believe he has concrete ideas and confidence needed to move forward."

That is exactly what he was doing before he had to start responding to Clinton's attacks.

Max,

Doesn't it distrub Obama supporters that your candidate played the race card, has gotten less votes by actual Democrats, wins in caucuses and mostly Red states and palys politics with policy position while getting unpaid for support from media for most of his rise to top dog?

So petty....you actually refuse to stop believe this garbage? Then you are one of a few.......

The race card played by our candidate was proved wrong long ago.

No one in their right minds would turn away voters because they have not registered DEM for a period of time....

Winning Caucus' in mostly RED States is so divisive buddy.....wow.......The facts are he's winning in those states.

And last but NOT LEAST its your candidates turn to get unpaid media advertsiment for president....

Clean up your arguement. Its old very old.... ;0)

Back on the winning track.

They won't call it until the polls close. 80% in with 20% lead.

WY goes big time for the O man! Looks like the Cowboys and Indians (Fremont Co.) went with him.

How bout them Red State dems. Those Red State dels sure add up!.

Almost forgot - I completely agree Maxtrue:

"Words do matter."

Alpha , again you are wrong. Why did Rezko give money to Obama's friend Khadili in 2002? Why did Auchi loan 3.5 million to Rezko who was broke and then Rezko helped Obama buy his house with Auchi's money? Does that make sense? And why won't Obama open up his books and show what money Rezko gave and when to see if there was ANY quid pro quo? And Obama didn't know what Rezko was up to? Bone-headed might be a word Obama hopes to keep rather than worse terms. Rezko is totally relevant. If you add up all the close associations you find quite a questionable group of people. And you can't cut Auchi out of it. Did Obama ever meet Auchi? And how could Obama not know all the things going on that Rezko was doing when he described Rezko as a good friend? He didn't remember at first even seeing his house with Rezko. One thinks Obama is well aware of the trouble with that association and it has not ended no matter how you would like it to end.

Bill wasn't with her when she went to Macedonia to discuss refugee issues with the President and Prime Minister of Macedonia...perhaps they did have tea during the discussion...but she was discussing real issues of concern with these people

Mitchell said Hillary brought women to the table during the Northern Ireland deal and it was helpful in getting that deal done.

The fact is...she's not just in the room passing around a platter of cookies...she was involved in or initiating the conversations.

This work has continued in the Senate. She's the only Senator to be asked to serve on the Transformation Advisory Group to the Joint Forces Command...in this role, she has visited troops in both Iraq and Afghanistan.

The fact is...she has LOTS of experience. I know that some Obama supporters don't want her to...but the resume is there and every time a fact check is done on it...it checks out.

As I said earlier...Obama's experience is thin - especially with regards to foreign policy...much of this thin experience is due to the fact that he's campaigning more than he's actually trying to do anything he was elected to do.

Alpha1906,

;0) Someone was trying to thwart the conversation this morning as Civility Patrol. The same writing was in Alpha +

I was just calling this spammer out. ;0) In no way did that moniker write like you

Sheila

Before you dismiss the race charge out of hand, I suggested you read this article.

http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=aa0cd21b-0ff2-4329-88a1-69c6c268b304

Alpha wrote: "Beware of what you wish for."

I'm more than happy to take my chances on this one.

:-D

And until we can see Obama's schedule and State Senate papers his denials about Rezko are just ancedotal.

Kate,

Does nothing exacept bring home what both candidates have recited, "Campaign Silly Season has begun"

Thanks for your support!

Alpha +

You are difinitely not those other two....good try.

I suggest you read the New Republic Article and not dismiss as campaign silly season. It is worth the time.

I noted it because Lardass Liberal commented on it and said it was worth printing out.

Kate, you don't make arguments, you're just silly.

Katie,

I wouldn't have commented if I didn't read it. I did and I stand by my statement.

I am not going to drag up more trash on Clinton to prove me point though...

We've been talking about this all morning and afternoon.

I have just come to a conclusion that both camps are guilty

Shelia,

If Obama can quote FDR, I guess old arguements are not dead. Winning in a State that will be Red come November has little bearing on reality. You can go champion ALL who voted in Wyoming (how many and who?) and I'll praise those in Penn, Ohio and Florida who will likely decide the next election. Your spin is funny. You 1. think this means Wyoming will go Blue? 2. You think this means MORE Democrats favor Obama? 3. You think this means the reasons why Obama lost on March 4th are gone?

I support the majority of Democratic voters, Republicans or Independents voting for Obama do not mean they will do so come November. Democrats voting for Obama or Hillary now DO mean they will vote for them in November. Think it out and eventually I think you'll get my valid point.

If Hillary wins the nomination, where do Obama votes go? To McCain? LOL But if Obama wins and calls McCain the enemy and uses the tactics he has on Hillary, don't count on Ohio, Florida, Penn or even California going Blue. Reality check please. McCain is not a monster or the enemy of our country. I have a lot of respect for him, though I am a social liberal. If I see the tactics used on McCain and Obama supporters call him an old white man kissing Bush's ass, Obama will not get my vote. Period. And remember Obama has cast Bill beside Nixon and Hillary beside McCain while suggesting similarities in himself to Malcom X, JFK, Lincoln, MLK, FDR, Reagan and of course Duval Patrick.

I suggest that Malcom X line Obama uses as his own Shelia, "don't be bamboozled, hoodwinked"...you know what I mean

"And why won't Obama open up his books and show what money Rezko gave and when to see if there was ANY quid pro quo? "

Max ,

This is the game you play all the time, never hold HRC to the same standard. Never point out her position on issues, only attack question what you speculate are his.

The 150k Rezko contribution (that was dumped) is peanuts compared to the 32 million contribution in 2006 to Clinton Foundation from Frank Guistra , Canadian billionaire, friend of Ian Brodie of NAFTA fame. There are others too probably if we ever see records. Maybe QPQ too. Why aren't you calling for her tax records?

I'm off to watch a movie or something.

Congrats Obama on Wyoming...

This is lardass liberals comment on the New Republic Story.

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/whos-on-first.html#comment-48461

I don't think it has anything to do with Clinton "trash" do mean like when she killed Vubce Foster her lesbian lover.

Max, My Dear,

Your arguments, not mine and just way off base from the average American.

I say that most Americans will turn right around and vote for the candidate of their choice.

Does not matter what either of us want or think more ligical.

However, I have faith in the voting public. The majority will NOT be voting for McCain and thats OK with me in the long run.

Kate,

Now why would you bring up such gutter talk....

The Clintons have twenty years of financial disclosure. If the Republicans couldn't nail them, you think Obama will? And compre your concerns (unsupproted) with Rezko, Auchi and the assciations I have linked? You think there is no connection between Obama. Rezko Auchi and Khadili? We are talking foreign policy mixing with indicted fund raiser/slumlord involving the governmor of Illinois (I was born in Chicago and frequent their papers). Brodie accused Hillary of saying the same thing as Obama to the Canadian government, but Harper has denied that story.

I wouldn't bet Obama's house on Hillary's tax filing. And what horrible things does the CLinton Foundation do that you compare it to money for Obama? And how do we know how much Rezko and friends gave Obama? And what friends?

Doesn't fly the same Rez as apples ani't oranges and I think your pulling a banana.

Wendy:

The general election "will be about national security and the economy."

Agreed.

"Obama is weak on both as proven this week."

Nonsense. In every head-to-head debate the candidates had - objectively - Obama stood toe-to-toe with Clinton on national security. I think he bested her on Foreign Policy - but I realze that is subject to debate - but it is BS to say Obama is weak.

What really annoys me is that you say Hillary has proven this because of the 3 a.m. add. Yet when asked the direct question why she is a better commander-in-chief before OH - she tried to turn the debate back to healthcare. She had her chance to take Obama head on - and she chose instead to attack him with a commerical. I think that is weak.

I think both Clinton and Obama will beat McCain on the economy. McCain will try to argue Dems will raise taxes - and go big government with healthcare and education. But I think Obama's stance on taxing the super rich will not lose any blue collar voters. And Obama does well with the elites in both parties. McCain also will not be able to use government mandates on healthcare as a wedge issue to deflect attention from his weakness on the economy.

McCain claims he is a maverick and will fight the special interests. But Obama is better positioned than Hillary (HRC took the most lobbyist money in 2007) to argue this point. It also doesn't hurt that he has run a grass roots campaign with small donors. Not like Clinton whose major support has come from the Dem fat cats and her own wallet. Kinda like Romney...he didn't do too well against McCain.

"And it's been said before...[Obama] has pulled her punches...the Republicans won't."

The GOP media will be brutal. They will tear her "experience" argument to shreds. I can just imagine the talking points about the 35 years of "experience" of the junior Senator from NY and former first lady. We will also have to relive the scandals of the ninties (and McCain will condemn the pundits and stay above the fray). It will make McCain seem like the change candidate.

Finally, even if Hillary wins the Democratic nomination on the "experience" argument - she will have to come up with a new one against McCain because he trumps her on this issue. Whereas Obama can run on the same arguments in the general that he has run on since the start of this campaign: change, vision and inspiration.

"Moreover, the Obama campaign would do well to not draw excessive attention to the Clinton Foundation, since it would only succeed in speeding the rehabilitation of Bill Clinton. His efforts currently provide HIV/AIDS medication to as many as 1.5 million poor people in Africa, the Caribbean and Asia who would otherwise be abandoned to die."

Yep...Clinton foundation is slimy alright - horrible - I hope they all go to prison.

;-)

Okay dear Shelia, the America people consider the vote today in Wyoming just like the vote in Ohio, same representation, same openness and significance and same portent. Okay, I'm just a bit feeble minded.

For arguement's sake. Let's say a Hillary nomination pisses off those in those Red States who voted for Obama and they vote for McCain. Will this really effect the results? Now imagine Obama's winning the nomination and tactics pissing off those in the big Blue States. Wll that effect the outcome? Probably.

Seems logical to me, but then I'm a bit stupid. That's why I visit here on occasion, to become enlightened. Wendy posted a good link to an article about playing the race card. I suggest that goes to character and tactics. But then I won't call Obama a monster for playing the cards he had. I'll leave that for Republicans.

Wendy

If the uncommitted are a large enough percentage, they can send a delegate to the State convention. They can band together there as a force that can sway the vote and the various proposals presented at the state level for changes to the state platform. These two and three stage caucuses can be very, very interesting when it comes to sending delegates to the National convention. Very odd stuff has been known to happen. Those uncommitted have been known to make it all the way to the National convention for you infants who have never seen a floor fight.

Warren:

I think the past week shows that Obama and his advisers crumble under pressure. Hillary does not.

http://time-blog.com/real_clear_politics/2008/03/obamas_week_in_review.html

Maxtrue Dear....lol

The name is spelled S H E I L A....thank you very much.

And what you and I just did was agree to disagree. A hallmark of this blog when it was formed. ;0)

You are focusing to narrowly for me. I am thinking too broadly for you.

Now, I am going to lay down and watch a movie. Have a nice afternoon!

Jamie:

Thanks for the insight - the uncommitted have been buggin' me all day. There is obviously a group in WY that wants to say something...what? Are they Edwards/Kucinich people? Very interesting.

Wendy:

The pressure is on the Clinton campaign and they are lashing out. Unfortunately - when one politician attacks - it makes the whole process ugly. Although Samantha Power's remark was stupid - it was not unwarranted. Monster is a pejorative term for fighter - and I don't think anyone is asking the editors of Time to resign.

Hillary needs to win on message - finger pointing is not going to work.

Mr Crawford, when are you going to be in the studio on Imus in the Morning? So far just phone in interviews? Imus is back in D.C. This is the latest from Imus Times. My Response to Matt Taibbi's article for RollingStone Mag., McCain Resurrected, where he pronounced McCain a warmonger and too old. yada yada yada.

http://imustimes.wordpress.com/2008/03/08/matt-taibbi-when-doves-cry/

Warren,

You've got to be kidding. I can see McCain running the clip of Obama responding to the question, "What would you do if an America city was attacked". Remember his answer? That led to Obama's August paper telegraphing more strikes by Predators on Pakistan which Musharraf was covering for. Even Biden questioned Obama's judgement, but he wanted to look tough on the trail....

And as Quds tries to topple Lebanon and start a war with Israel McCain will ask why Obama was missing in action. He will quote Obama's suggestion to nuke Iran and I have posted at length above about the matter of Afghanistan. His remarks about Pakistan, Hhs prediction the "moderate" take over will mean a tougher Pakistani war on AQ? LOL

McCain might even show Obama the letters from Reyes in which Americans tell Reyes Obama will cut military support to Columbia and make Like Carter. Even Hugo wants Obama to win.That's an openning to talk about Zbig and Malley.
McCain cannot do that damage to Hillary, unless Burger starts making news.

McCain can ask Obama why extremist favor Barak's election while Putin hates McCain. He'll ask why Hillary is tougher on genocide in Darfur while Obama's hand-picked genocide queen Powers was his top advisor. And then of course is his secret policy on Iraq Powers revealed. He'll ask Obama if Powers was lying, or does Obama just pander.

Note none of this is personal or monster-like. If you think national security is the big question, Obama is not your guy. He couldn't even show up for the full Foreign Relation Committee's meeting to discuss the important topic Obama's committee was tasked to debate but never met -NATO and Afghanistan. McCain was a POW not a MIA. That is a difference McCain will make clear and what do you think the American people will think should Obama tell McCain, "You sir voted for the resolution to use force and have no standing to question my policy on Iraq". Really now, Barak, that won't work.

"20 years of disclosures"

These guys were going broke in 2000..now she comes up with 5 mil to fund her campaign. Books deals, speaking tours ..loans, what ?? let's see the recent books. What's she hiding?

How about her WH days (experience) .I believe I read somewhere recently that all those trips to Kosovo, China etc. have been debunked, by those locals participating,as being nothing more that pleasantries ,teas..

Wendy- I'll find my bookmarks on the CF and it's donors and get back with you. There's more than just benevolence going on here. I don't think you're that naive.

Samantha Power made " boneheaded "decisions, both in the newspaper interview ( monster and the f-bomb) and on the show HARDtalk, talking about what BHO is going to do vs. what he promises to do while campaigning.

“Is it possible that with what was presented and distributed to our voting Senators regarding Iraq, that HRC vote was actually a correct vote?”

How would we know? According to Clinton herself she did not read the entire resolution, something Obama did do even though he did not have a vote. Who would have read this and not think GWB would NOT go into Iraq? As God is my witness, five minutes after the courts gave Bush the presidency I told a Republican co-worker that we WILL go to Iraq. 9/11 had not even happened yet.

RESOLUTION FACT BOX:
• "The president is authorized to use the armed forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to (1) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq, and (2) enforce all relevant United Nation Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq."

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/10/11/iraq.us/

Now, is there one of you who thinks Bush would not have gone to war after you read that part of the resolution above?

Rez, read Bernstein's book. He talks about Hillary be luke warm on NAFT, strongly favoring bombing Serbia, cautious on NK (some of Clinton's advisors wanted to bomb NK), and pro-Israel on the peace offering from Barak. You can look, but that will only add to the facts supporting Hillary. She was there in support for those 3am calls.

Maybe you can find something on her being a Lesbian. or murdering her lover Foster.

And yes that evil Clinton Foundation is JUSt like Obama's political bank account. And those contributing are just like Auchi and Rezko.

"has she answered the phone at "3 a.m." probably not...but I'd say it's a darn good bet she was in the room during a crisis and her opinion sought."

Wendy, If Bill Clinton was like most husbands when the baby is crying or the phone is ringing or in this case when some marine is shaking them awake, then Mrs. Clinton was kicking him from the other side of bed saying, "Would you PLEASE wake up!!!" :-)

Hello

I am a strong supporter of Hillary and my enthusiasm for her has only grown, and if BHO was the nominee I could have excepted this with regret but still supported him for a "greater good". Yet the MSM treatment of Hillary and also reading this blog have made me realize that BHO is not JFK., or Bobby, but an incarnation of Neville Chamberlain and Jimmy Carter. My hero is and will always be Winston Churchill and I see little of the "bulldog, spine. grit, of that great man. I do however see a weak Jimmy Carter who also was an outsider with little experience, an quite "articulate" {am I allowed to say that?} who was a failed President. Barack J. Carter Obama's governing style would be to sign "present" and "hope the phone does not ring at 3.00 am.

Maxtrue and march8:

Samantha Power is more intelligent that the both of you combined.

But congratulations - you two and that attack dog Wolfson are better political operatives than she is.

You win and she is gone.

Well at least if he gets elected President there won't be another office to run for in a couple of years and he might actually have to do some real work.

:-D

I was watching MSNBC for a bit today, and saw Chris Matthews sputtering this in a promo blurb: "Tune in all day, where we'll be giving you SECOND by SECOND results from the Wyoming caucus!!!"

It was like he was covering the Hindenberg explosion or something. And it's just 12 delegates. Hell, Texas and Ohio cut farts with more than 12 delegates in them. But Matthews was treating this same degree of import and urgency. Talk about a guy who needs to get a life.

That's part of the problem: The cable media are so hungry to report on ANYTHING, they give EVERYTHING the same weight. And that's a disservice to everyone concerned. I guess it will be like this for the next six or seven weeks.

"And yes that evil Clinton Foundation is JUSt like Obama's political bank account. And those contributing are just like Auchi and Rezko."

Some agreement here. Politics is a dirty business. I happen to believe he comes in with cleaner hands and a lot more enthusiasm. At least I'm betting the electorate thinks so.

Samantha Power's singular ineptitude will be missed

"Doesn't it disturb any Clinton supporters, and I'm serious about this, that your candidate has decided to hell with the Democratic Party and will bring it down in order to chase her own ambition"

Well, here seems a way to settle who the voter wants. I’ve actually seen sites that if the HRC groupies steal the primaries there are some who are advocating Obama run as an independent. Wonder who would win in that scenario? Who has brought in more new voters, Independents, and Republicans? And, as has been addressed on here and other sites, Clinton is bringing down the Democratic Party’s positions against McCain with her attacks on Obama.

Do you really care what you are called if your points of fews are represented?

Warren, no need to insult me personally. I merely stated what she did was not in her best interest, or Senators Obama's best interest and that is why she is gone.

Maybe you should read Craig's request at the beginning of this thread.

Rezdog with regards to the Clinton Foundation:

"...the Clinton Foundation, since it would only succeed in speeding the rehabilitation of Bill Clinton. His efforts currently provide HIV/AIDS medication to as many as 1.5 million poor people in Africa, the Caribbean and Asia who would otherwise be abandoned to die."

Yep Clinton Foundation saving 1.5 million lives is dirty - real dirty.

Karol, read the speech Hillary Clinton gave on the Floor and tell me in what possible way it wasn't sound and correct. I would love everyone here to know,

And what about all the others who trusted the Intel to a sufficient degree and also heard the leader of the UN state that only thorugh credible deployment and resolve would Saddam blink? Do you remember that? Kofi was quite clear. Without this resolution, what would Saddam think? He told Piro under interrogation that he didn't think the US would attack. Not until the very end. This was a move based on the IC report and the belief that only when Saddam knew we were very serious would be blink. Powers believe the present IC report on Iran. And of course Powers MUST have favored removing a genocial "monster", yes? He gassed his own Kurdish population. Go rght ahead and make this the supreme article of faith by which all disbelievers are heretics to the Liberal Church. Vilify Lieberman, punish Kerry and Biden and even Rockerfeller who voted YES WE CAN. And what would you and Obama be saying if after greeting us as Liberators we and Iraqis secured the streets and Iraq came together with far less blood and costs? That is why for two years the primary attack on Bush was incompetence as even the NYT said to send more troops. Remember that? Incompetence is now spun as "it never would have work" even if it does...LOL

And seeing how Obama votes on sanctions, one thing is certain: if Saddam stayed, sanctions would be gone and both Iran and Iraq would be racing twoards WMD with French, Russians and Chinese on the ground in Iraq preventing any attempt to stop him. Great alternative Karol. What a fine mess we would be in now. What would the chances be for an even bigger explossion in the Gulf?

Biden told Meet the Press several months ago that when he cast his vote, most members felt that by 2008, Saddam would have a bomb. He said his vote was more preventitive as he would not send troops into greater dangers years out. Russia was planning to break the sanctions and as Saddam's own cabinet meeting tapes revealed, he was going to break sanctions, get WMD and begin to use the terror network as Syrian and Iran were doing. It is clear and on tape.

Wolf always sounds like he's about to duck under a desk , like he did in the first Gulf War, even when the new is about something good.

You know what will REALLY be cool?? If both Hillary and Obama decide they have to campaign hard in Puerto Rico for those delegates. Now THAT will be a story. I've covered a couple elections down there, and the campaign style is AWESOME. Huge caravans of cars that criss-cross the entire island, giant rallies to cap off the caravans...music blaring from sound trucks, etc., etc.,

It will be unlike anything we've EVER seen on the presidential campaign trail.

And the irony is -- we may never see it again, since Puerto Ricans on the island don't get to vote in presidential elections, even though they're U.S. citizens.

Yes, Warren, call Wendy and myself names. Since you seem to cast insults without much research, perhaps you should check out the links below. Then you can tell me how smart Powers is and how dumb we are. Read carefully because the names you see will come up again and again.

I respect Samantha Powers effort to take a stand on genocide. Most Americans do feel strongly about the topic. Her spin and solutions are not gospel, nor is her attack on Clinton very balanced as others have ponted out. Stupid, certainly she is not. But what a dumb move for several reasons.

1. As an "expert" in genocide, you use monster for people Stalin and Saddam.

2. You talk as a top advisor to a Presidential candidate, being very careful. You do not put him at risk and insult the people of Ohio who Obama might have lost.

3. You don't put your book tour over being a smart spokesperson and then issue a disengenuous apology.

4. To refute your claim Obama is tough on national security, read the links. I could have used other blogs and other sources, but the ones below are concise. Now just try and read through the gibberish, Powers gave to the Israeli Press. Amazing, just amazing.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/rosnerBlog.jhtml?itemNo=957778&contrassID=25&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=1&listSrc=Y&art=1

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2008/03/samantha_power_unplugged.html

Warren, the last link that didn't take

An over view of Obama's team

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/02/samantha_power_and_obamas_fore_1.html

Wendy-
i typed a nice long reply but lost it on an error submission, ain't redoing it now, headed out to dinner. I was using John Gotti as a not so good comparison with the CF: source vs good..you get the picture. Later

Obama Adviser Brzezinski: Power Shouldn't Have Resigned

"Former National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski seems to think that departed Obama foreign policy adviser Samantha Power got a raw deal.

In response to a request for reaction to her resignation earlier today, the office of Brzezinski—another of Obama's foreign policy advisers—relayed the following statement: "I think an expression of regret for using an inappropriate description of Senator Clinton should have sufficed. And I don't think she should have resigned."

"She submitted the resignation," said a source in the Obama campaign. "She made this decision on her own to submit her resignation and we accepted it. Obviously, there was a lot of pressure from outside sources. "

http://www.observer.com/2008/brzezinski-power-shouldnt-have-resigned

“Hillary's campaign song should be "The Long and Whinny Road"

Actually one of my favorites, although I’m not a big Beatles fan.

I wonder if HRC will go on the air to give a gracious thank you to Obama as he did last Tuesday from San Antonio when he gave a graceful congratulation to her. Actually, I don’t believe I”ve heard her give any kind of congratulation to him. Bill did once I believe.

Don't you think if Obama asked Samantha Powers to stay she would have?

Wendy

"Are they Edwards" They very well could be. He is still holding 26 delegates. If Florida gets counted without a revote that goes up to 61. That could very well be enough to sway the nomination if he decides to endorse and they follow his lead.

OBAMA & AUCHI

"The handshake heard round the world took place in April, 2004, at the Ritz-Carlton Hotel in Chicago between Barack Obama and a mysterious London billionaire named Nadhmi Auchi.

Until James Bone and Dominic Kennedy asserted the handshake took place in their February 25, 2008, Times Online article, "Barack Obama embarassed by billionaire link to home deal," the meeting between these two political actors was unconfirmed. However now that the report has been published in London, where the libel laws are draconian enough that the Mr. Auchi and his esteemed media lawyer Alisdair Pepper have the power and means to severely damage the Rupert Murdoch News Corp empire by going after the Times if this report is false, it is safe to assume that the handshake is useful fact. "

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=25193

Wonder if cuz Dick Cheney made his WY political machinery available for BO today?

As was previously mentioned on here, the Clintons need to be careful about bringing up land deals, IMO.

Gordo, as I said, Rezko, -the gift that keep s giving. Now watch the press take a look a Auchi. And Zbig defending Powers? I suppose Obama could make her Ambassador to Israel. So the hand shake, then the cash to Rezko who was broke and then used the loan to help Obama. Does that mean Auchi helped secure Obama his home? And did Auchi help Khadidli through Rezko back in 2002? See why Obama has far more books to open? Will the court ask to see them? If yes, then Obama is heading for trouble. Americans will wonder about that hand shake if there is a loan two years later. Didn't Obama deny meeting Auchi?

Yes, this is JUST like the Clinton Foundation's work. his is why Nader said Obama's friends do not point to a pro-Israel policy. LOL Now Zbig is trouble and he defends Powers. Powers, Zbig, Malley, Auchi...see the circle? Wait until the hand shake between Huntington and Obama. Makes me remember your Manchurian candidate article. A bit scary Gordo. So where does Zbig keep his lab?

Hey, no big deal. It's not like the biggest, most devastating decision a president could make is represented by the metaphor of "pushing the button."

"Sir, we have outbound ICBMs."

"Relax, President Obama just hit the wrong button
http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YWRkMGY5YTJkMzI4OTEwY2IxMmM4Zjc3MGYyZWYwOGI=

Power resigned as a public show to try and turn the spin in O's favor - I'll bet she's going to be just as involved in advising him as before - but with a lower profile.

Afternoon everyone. One quote for the day:

"All people are born alike- except Republicans and Democrats." - Groucho Marx

After Starr spent $55 million and found zero, I don't think the Clintons have to be worried. And their land deals didn't involve a Middle Easterm indicted patron who I believe is barred from entering the country. Is there a problem that Auchi's cash went towards helping a US Senator?

Human Events dot com = nice little objective news source.

Hey G man,

The time you were informing on BO meeting at a Chi-town hotel was with a fellow named Sinclair. what ever hole did he crawl back into lol.

Well I've read everything recently posted... I am going to bed. If it's any help, I am a Clinton supporter and I congratulate Obama on his win today.

Dirty politics in Chicago im shocked.

Rez, let's assume that there was a hand shake or meeting. Would you consider that trouble?
MUch on HUmanevents has been refuted, but still some things have proven to be true. Auchi did make the loan to Erzko that secured the Obama house deal, yes?

The intellect that won Ohio, at least Southern Ohio.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYspjJCjgX8

Max,
They a photo of Hill and him..No problem for me. let's se her calendar that week/month/year.

Guy (businessman) meets with Gov and state reps....donate some money to his campaign. Show me the QpQ. Sounds like Rezko was some help to buy land (reference-big deal), wrote a check or co-signed loan-bigger deal. what else we got?

My, my. All the "let's have a group hug" talk and accusations against Clinton supporters for being evil name callers. Just read through this thread and see who is name calling and talking ugly. Just what I thought....as has always been the case, "civility" translates to "listen to us call you and your candidate names and keep your mouths shut."

Nice.

Patsi...not sure what you mean. This thread seems as civil as a tea party. All day.
What are you talking about?

I agree. It's a TOTAL landslide. And 12 tiny pieces of gravel are rolling down the mountain, crushing everything in their path!

LOL.

Obama to Stiff Arm Michigan and Florida?

"Okay, so we know Obama doesn't care about Florida, because he knows he'll lose that state to McCain, and if there's a re-vote he'll also lose it to Clinton. That would mean yet another huge swing state in her corner, which Obama can't afford because it further makes the case that Clinton's path to the White House is much better than the crap shoot Obama offers. As for Michigan, there was a "firehouse primary" floated, but the Obama campaign has evidently nixed it.

The Ragin' Cagin completely unmasked the Obama campaign's actual plan to disenfranchise Floridians, which for some of us who remember 2000 all too well, sounds positively un-Democratic, capital "d." Carville puts Obama's man David Wilhelm back on his heels in this interview with Wolf Blitzer. Shorter review: don't send a boy to do a man's job. Wilhelm is totally outmatched in this one, with Carville creaming him on every angle.Carville offers solutions, Wilhelm offers pontificating and obfuscation. Sound familiar? "

http://taylormarsh.com/

http://sugarnspice.typepad.com/sugar_n_spicea_meeting_pl/2008/02/obama-and-clint.html

Max,

Only reason i bother to respond on this rezkop matter is mainly because, that's what the wingnuts do.. keep saying rezko over and over and implying crap. hoping it will stick
Later out to lunch ;)

I personally prefer the cucumber finger sandwiches.

.....I like Dip.....

off topic but...

He's My Man...

On Monday, Leonard Cohen:

The Lord Byron of Rock n Roll
The Bard of the Boudoir
The High Priest of Pathos
The Poet Laureate of Pessimism
The Grocer of Despair
The Godfather of Gloom
The Prince of Bummers
and my friend and former back-yard neighbour (he still owns the house but is rarely here)

will be formally inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. It's about time...

Leonard.. I love ya.

Okay. Crisis averted. Nobody took nobody's bait.

See how easy it can be?

Laree Lee,

I noticed that you asked when Craig Crawford would make an in-studio appearance with Imus. The show is on the air in DC, but originates from NYC, so it's not quite as simple as going to a DC studio.

I'm pretty sure that as of last Spring, Craig had never personally met Imus and his crew. I seem to recall Craig stating that here, or during a broadcast when he was stating his support for the Imus show.

You may have already received an answer from Mr. Crawford, but I didn't notice one as I scrolled down to answer your 4:33 post.

Hi Ty...

Congrats on your neighbor's good fortune!

Folks...

For anyone interested in what's being said in Florida media about the prospects of a revote, lots of stuff to pick and choose from here. This site is the best aggregator of political news in Florida. It'll be worth keeping bookmarked as the issue heats up.

http://www.sayfiereview.com/

Hiya Lali...

what i love about him is that he kept that house.. we don't live in the 'best part of town'.. it's a really nice neighbourhood, but hardly well-to-do.. but when the land was parcelled up years ago, it was in the days of large lots.. so we all have giant back yards.. I used to talk tomatoes with him across the fence.. we bought this place in the late 70s.. for a song... really lucked out..

how ya doing?

Doin' fine Ty. Enjoying life in sunny Florida (although today, it's incredibly windy).

Was out on my motorcycle all day, and the damn battery crapped out on me just as I was cranking it up to come home. It was "dead as Kelsey's nuts" as my sister would say. But almost magically, the thing finally turned over on, like, the 20th attempt...and I've gotten home, popped a beer and recharged the battery.

That's my day, besides having fun with the gang here.

I love the kind of backyard you describe...complete with the tomato patch.

Ty's next door neighbor and tomato-talk buddy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonard_cohen

"This thread seems as civil as a tea party. All day."

Lard --- only if at a tea party people trash the others' candidates mercilessly.

Comparing Hillary to Laura, "tea parties" calling Kate silly....Get out for the good of the party...I see a lot of good posts, but the underlying ugly is still there.

This was my first day back in a long time and I truely enjoyed everyone and every issue about it.

Thanks To Wendy!, GORDO, Maxtrue, LL, Carol, Karrolenna, Warren, Alpha, Jamie, Craig, and the rest for making this a "Tea Party"

Hi Patsi. I see where you're coming from now. But I disagree with your conclusions.

Folks here need to retain the ability to advocate for their side -- even if it's interpreted by the other side as an "attack" or "trashing." That's all part of politics, and the game here.

But candidate advocacy has not been the core of the recent problem with this blog. The problem has been when talking about candidates and issues morphs into pulling out the handguns and blowing each other away personally, like it's a streetfight.

And that absolutely hasn't happened today. So I beg to differ on your characterization of today's thread.

Or...to make it into an Ozark haiku:

Here's the key
Don't make it personal
Don't take it personal
And there's plenty of tea
For you
And me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6G7MkBMVxE

- it's been a good day for the most part....let's build on that.

Ah the good old days when, rock and roll was new : )

Craig, I have made a decision today. I guess too much snow and too much thinking.
I have always been an independent and had decided to be a democrat mostly because of Hillary. I have decided to be an Independent again.
I will support Hillary anyway I can. The democratic party is screwed up big time. How can intelligent people be so stupid. Is greed and control and ego so pronounced in these parties?
I cannot be republican because of do not believe in their platform, so I will remain independent as I have my entire life. I will vote for the candidate I feel is best for the position. I have also swore off CNN and MSNBC and Fox unless I know you will be on it. How do you handle the ignorance?

The discussion has definitely been worthwhile today.

There are whispers that BO will be getting a major endorsement after the Mississippi primary which should allow him to close the deal in Pennsylvania.
HRC will be very disappointed in losing this coveted endorsement.

Hope College Men and Women are kicking butt tonight in the basketball tournaments! Men winning 69-55. Women leading 57-31.

Ah, Hillary open to this "dream ticket". She's the one dreaming.

edwards?

March8:

Read or listen to some of what Samantha Powers has to say - and maybe you will not be so offended by my comments.

She was voted one as on of the 100 most intelligent people. She's no joke.

Maxtrue:

I will deal with you later...

I am off to dinner peeps - have fun!

I've decided that I don't want any of the three candidates.

I want a Harrison Ford/Jimmie Smits......or maybe Jimmie Smits/Gena Davis ticket....

Warren, I know she is an awesome person. I never doubted that, just on this playing field she screwed up.

Vivian,

Inquiring minds want to know, where do you come up with this stuff and if you know who it might be, Spill. ;0)

Warren...

The phrases "voted on as one of..." and "intelligent" don't always belong in the same sentence.

Paging Simon Cowell? Please pick up the nearest white courtesy phone.

Maybe Vivian can't say unless we guess......

I am guessing that someone Vivian knows , quite well, is in on almost the inner circles of a campaign, and she gets updates via text messages. That is my guess. Technology is great for this kind of stuff. 1 to 10 how close am I ?10 being the closest Vivian?

March8...either that, or Vivian is like me. I have a cookie jar that looks like an anthropomorphic pig. Sometimes I hear it whispering political rumors to me.

I've never admitted that before. I feel so unburdened now.

that's funny

LOL Snot!

Yeah. Funny is my business, March8.

But just remember it the next time someone starts quoting "whispers" to you. You might as well go out and interview the birds in your front yard. You'll get especially good quotes from the mockingbirds, if you're fortunate enough to have any.

If I had an inside track, I'd spill the beans for you guys.....except if I signed a non-disclosure. Then you would have to guess it out of me. My life is not quite that exciting atm (at the moment), and my cookie jar isn't talking......someone got to him.

btw I once rescued some baby mockingbirds....only to find out that I was breaking the law....happy ending they reunited with their mommy hummingbird. and I stayed out of jail. that's what I call a win-win

okay i was kidding, is everyone using the key system now???

Philly-based Atrios, who puts it this way: "I highly doubt Obama ever imagined his courtesy endorsement of Chaka Fattah in the mayoral race would end up being such an important misstep."
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/obama_rueing_day_he_got_involv.php

maybe Rick Santorum is endorsing Obama

Rick Santorum Endorsing Obama? Well....Hillary got Coultergeist...only fair.

Maybe it's Richrdson, who cares, we'll find out in time, if Viv doesn't want to share.

Lardass:

How bout winning a Pulitzer Prize - she did that too.

Warren...

How do you know I haven't won a Pulitzer Prize?

Point being...

March8....

Now THAT'S funny! We need to have a drink sometime!

actually...I get kicked out of typekey all the time and have to resign in...especially if I have posted for a few...there must be some sort of timeout policy in place.

they were never going to endorse at this meeting
they want to interview both candidates for an hour each and stretch this out as long as possible
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/08/philly-leaders-play-in-the-spotlight/

The question of character will be decided when we know which cheese steak house they pick and what they order it is...

I recommend Steve's and with provolone not wit wiz

Nope....has to be Cheese Wiz.....yum.

The only endorsement that is worth anything...especially in PA... would be Edwards...Richardson has no credibility.

Warren...

To be less indirect, winning a Pulitzer means nothing. It's like winning a hard-on contest in a Bangkok strip bar, when you're the only round-eyed devil in the joint and they need somebody to entertain the crowd. And they'll take...ANYBODY. Just to keep the crowd entertained.

Take it from someone whose spent a lifetime in journalism, watching losers win and winners lose.

That said, I know nothing of the work that won her a Pulitzer. But now, my interest is piqued to the point that I might actually check it out.

So thanks for that.

you probably go to Geno's too

Okay, but there is sort of history surrounding the city meeting, he had to show there. He most likely would do better in the suburbs, he is inspiring in person.....but someone had to go to this meeting. Maybe they should have sent Chelsea???

or Tubbs-Jones...she never shuts up..

can't remember the name, but its a couple of blocks from the center of town.

So you are an expert? Miss SF? ;0)

Easy way to hang on to your identity permanently is to click on comment anonymously, type in your name and your email address. Click on "Remember info".

From then on just click on Comment anonymously each time you come in and it should put all your info in for you each time.

“The candidates, they’re going to be sitting on our steps, in our offices, in our homes for six weeks,” Mr. Brady said. “After this weekend, they have no where else to go but the state of Pennsylvania.”
He said the ward leaders would invite Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Obama to “a nice hotel room” and interview each of them for an hour or so, some day soon, and then decide whether to endorse one of them.
“They kinda want to do this because they’re looking for some meaningful things to do, and this would be pretty meaningful and it would bring all you guys and gals out to see them,” Mr. Brady told reporters with a grin. He said that as long as he has been chairman, the ward leaders “have never been in the hunt before” in a presidential primary.

They are going to stretch out their fifteen minutes of fame.

Lardass? May I ask a question.... how long have you been "Lardass" there is no way in Hell you are a woman, because women can't even say that word out loud.

March8
Nope. I'm definitely not a woman.

You don't get a key that links to a profile if you use the anonymous method, but you don't have to renew every two weeks either.

If you have a blog that isn't on the blog roll, let Craig know and he can add it to the blog roll on the left.

And their state is going to pull in some dough/cabbage/cash in the process. Good for them.

I spend a18 months in Philadelphia working on a campaign. I know from cheesesteaks, hoagies, and mummers.

The mayor of Harrisburg endorsed Senator Clinton

Hope women won 68-48
Hope men won 92-72

LL

http://www.typekey.com

Log In with your email and password

You should be able to edit your profile unless typekey refuses to talk to you the way it does for Sheila and me.

If anything given the makeup of the City Committee it should have been a get for Obama.

I saw that about the child actor, just Hillary's luck. They said she was only 17, so she must be up for a birthday soon. She also wanted to make a play for some ad campaign with BHO. Like he needs anymore - people wanting to do his commercials.

What is a Mummer? I really dont know.

23 points.
And 12 more tiny stones, barely perceptible.
Roll off the Rocky Mountains.
Of Wyoming.

As they say in obama land it's all about the delegates

he got seven and she got five.

Jamie,

Owen Died? I'm watch Torchwood for the first time this winter.

Jamie...thanks. I've tried all that, but it doesn't work. I'll keep trying.

The Hillary 3 AM ad contains file footage. The young girl in the ad is a NW kid, and this will be her first election that she's old enough to vote. She supports Obama, but makes it clear that she's a Democrat and will vote for whomever is the party nominee.

I think I'll go with the cq reporting that she got five

http://www.cqpolitics.com/wmspage.cfm?parm1=5&docID=news-000002684378

David Horsey in Living Color

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/horsey/viewbydate.asp?id=1723

BTW my daughter said, that there is one human for every 4 square miles of land in WY......that's really out there

That's my hometown on CNN right now...Meridian, MS...waiting for Bill to show up, I think.

Sorry about the double post. I ignored all my own earlier instructions.

Lardass you are funny.

Warren, I never said Powers isnn't intelligent. Sometimes common sense and brilliance don't fill the same head. What she did was startingly dumb and her comments to the Israeli Press bordered on incoherent. That does not mean she's not a very smart person. Look at it this way, she is the honorary head of a group named after a Swede who opposed the State of Israel. Someone with common sense would understand that strikes to her credibility with Israelis, yes? Add Zbig and Malley you get a shakey claim to being a pro-Israeli team. So while I praise her dedication to stopping genocide, I wonder why Saddam wasn't on that list of monsters, or how our retreat from Vietnam didn't help Pol Pot. I wonder why she doesn't push Obama harder on Darfur or praise the role Hillary played in taking on Serbia. I see a selective intelligence and a lack of common sense, but that in no way slights her obvious mastery of subjects she focuses on, Again, kudos to her hatred of genocide.

Shelia, you're more than welcome. Anytime.

Rez, I am hardly a wingnut. I think my posts indicate a liberal centrist. I bring up Rezko for two major reasons: 1. It will continue to drag on Obama, certainly grounds for Republican wingnuts, if for nothing less than showing a conventional politician making bone-headed moves involving creeps 2. It involves Obama's long time buddy Khadili (a spokesperson for the PLO when they were considered terrorists), Auchi (whose money helped Obama's house purchaseat the minimum), Rezko and an indeterminant amount of money without any evidence one way or another about quid pro quo. With a trial going on, that cannot be good.

Regardless of how Republicans spin this (and it could hurt a lot -remember the trial could reveal new facts or hand shakes), it speaks to Obama's judgement, his conventionalism (principle), and the assciations he keeps (let's see about Auchi) vital to his campaign upward to national notice.

Obama wants Americans to consider him above the same old behavior, not associated to questionable people (or ever beholden to them), having great judgement and has not shown any Anti-Zionist inclinations. When you simply make a list of important people in Obama's circle Rezko, Auchi, Zbig, Malley, (he doesn't meet with him face to face), Powers (see Israeli positions), Obama's own pastor and even Rice and Lake to a degree, a picture forms. Maybe it is not the right picture that the American Thinker projects, but it is unclear and frankly distrubing.

The similarity to Carter in many repects is scary. As long as Obama claims some sacred connection to change, hope, the higher road, only the faithful will fail to examine. Bill Clinton didn't have a great childhood either. Many people have it rough. Hillary didn't have it great growing up. McCain survived a POW camp and has constantly fought his Party. Good intentions aren't enough. A hard road walked isn't enough. We need to know the truth, the associations, the policies, the advisors. Its nothing personal Rez. Facts are all we've got. I buy nothing based on ideology, cause words are cheap and some words really matter. That all depends on the context in which they are understood.

That's my rant for the night.

Have fun yall

I think Typekey is talking to me again, so I'm going to try to sign in that way. If I get locked out, it may be a while before I return.

It looks like it is working.

Jamie...

I'm envisioning you at this moment as Sigourney Weaver in Aliens3 (or whatever) trying to slay the TypeKey Monster. You go!

Well that's weird. It signed me in but didn't give me a key. Talk about red headed step child.

Okay now. Got the key and the updated profile.

I live in Ohio (currently) and actually, I was surprised that Hillary won. I do not watch TV -very much, and really did not see that many ads, there was one junk mail piece- that went directly into recycling. I voted early downtown, and quite honestly, I do not think anyone has a clue as to what PA will do.

Oh so you now all have keys......like a pin.....okay...i'll work on it.

Democratic Convention watch is saying 5 for Hillary as well...they are pretty accurate in these things since all they do is try to figure out delegates

http://demconwatch.blogspot.com/2008/03/wyoming-caucus-and-mississippi-primary.html

She lost pretty big in the 2 places where people live though...so...O' had a good day.

LL

Now you can go to

http://www.typekey.com
Log In
Update Profile

Webpage for the Philadelphia Mummers

http://mummers.com/

March8,

I can't give you an adequate description of a Mummers Band, but go to mummers.com and check out info on the Mummers Parade. I'm sure you'll find a picture there that should give you a good idea of what they look like.

Thanks Jamie, and I thought Mummer was a sandwich

I love the mummers parade
People stand on Broad street all NYDay and get totally plastered. As well as the string bands there are the comics, fancies -- it is an amazing show.

Help get them a national television spot
http://www.mummersonnationaltv.com/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_adnKWrjPA&feature=related

mummers on you tube

LL

It must be age or perversion, today I actually found myself looking forward to an old fashioned floor fight and insider negotiations.

I figure any system that dumped Wallace and gave us Truman can't be all bad.

Wow , my whole life has been so damn sheltered ....Mummers what else is out there?

Holy crap I am getting scared.

I have to admit I kinda like they costumes.

March8 And if you head south, there's Harry Connick, Jr.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ty2ui0vY5Os

I think I'll wait till all the states vote before I decide on whether more people have voted for Hillary or Obama...by the end of this...Hillary may very well lead in the popular vote....then what will we do?

March 8 they make new costumes every year.

Well in the Bay area we have
St. Stupid's Day Parade
Tuesday, April 1, 2008
12:00 PM

Embarcadero Plaza, San Francisco

Embarcadero Plaza
San Francisco, California

Description
The First Church of the Last Laugh holds its 30th Annual St. Stupid's Day Parade. Bishop Joey leads the performance of the rituals, including the Leap of Faith, the Sock Exchange and the induction ceremony. Attendees are encouraged to wear whatever they think is appropriate to this event which has its roots in the thousand year old Feast of Fools tradition. Noise makers, musical instruments, flags and silly signage are also called for at this unique San Francisco event.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAk1k3UvWdQ

I sat next to Harry Conick Jr, one fateful flight....oh my god.......I did not know who he was......it was great .......I told him everything he needed to know , where to go -what to do....it was awesome......he had gotten engaged. ....I was on a wild weekend with my college roommates.... he was awesome. Then he told me , and I got a bit star struck...i have his autograph somewhere....but it was better before i knew...he was so genuine, and soulful. He loved his Mother so much...I was lucky to get that seat.....I can't say the same for him.

Whether red or blue state, now that I've seen it up close, I'm really opposed to the caucus system. You have to give Obama credit for organizing a takeover of a totally undemocratic system that locks out the majority of the voters in a state in order to turn it into a believable run for the presidency.

As a follow-up...with all the superDs have to figure out when putting a candidate forward...I have a feeling factoring in a misstatement from October 07 in Iowa will have little effect in looking at the bigger picture.

Both sides have pretty good arguments for why the superDs should push them forward...we'll have to wait until the voting is over and if she continues to win in places like PA...she'll have a better argument than he and a comment in Iowa is not going to make the difference.

Can you imagine how hard is is to relate to the common people when you have been the "kings" , I mean really....even in corporations it's tough, imagine trying to do it when lives are at stake....

And while we don't have a parade here to equal the mummers, we do have pretty wild bingo games
http://www.rrsisters.org/

Jamie - agreed

National primary in June

Popular vote gives you your candidate

November general election

Popular vote gives you your President

If the general election were a caucus...I'd say O' is your guy...McCain wouldn't stand a chance

problem is...it's not.

Clinton Beats Expectations In Wyoming With Near Split In Delegates

"Clinton Campaign Manager Maggie Williams issued the following statement in response to the Wyoming caucuses and our estimated pick-up of five delegates:

"We are thrilled with this near split in delegates and are grateful to the people of Wyoming for their support. Although the Obama campaign predicted victory in Wyoming weeks ago, we worked hard to present Senator Clinton’s vision to the caucus-goers and we thank them for turning out today.”

http://taylormarsh.com/

Denny Lost

Proof once and for all Republicans do take drugs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_A53PAxeR8

wow this is really a tough race. Denver should be fun...anyone going to be there???

I think we should go to the convention

road trip

r o a d t r i p

come on you can say it road trip!

I went to the 1968 convention. It was plenty scary.

March8

Unless you have at a minimum $5,000 you don't mind frittering away (and that's a shared room), it probably isn't a road trip you want ...

How many RVs would we need for the crowd?

hmmm. maybe i would have to go on the econo side.

I have a mini van with dvd- not something I am proud of, but it's better then a tent, heat , a/c, and I could possible through in a Keurig for coffee.

throw.... I was the child left behind.

"...a lot the party big wigs and super delegates despise the Clintons and want them gone."

They can not control Hillary. Obama would be a "puppet".

Well march8

I was the child that never left then. I'm much worse than you. ;0)

here's some good news.

Dems Take Old Hastert Seat
The AP has called the race in the Illinois 14th for Democrat Bill Foster.

With more than 96% of precincts reporting, Foster has a 52-48 lead over big-spending GOP candidate Jim Oberweis.

Think Rep. Tom Cole (R-OK) is having fun yet as chairman of the NRCC? Since taking over the NRCC after the 2006 midterms, he's struggled to compete with the DCCC financially, faced an ugly embezzlement scandal within the NRCC, and now lost the seat held by the last Republican Speaker of the House.

--David Kurtz

LL -- did you figure out how to create a profile?

thanks for posting that link.. brought back nice memories..

here's my fave Cohen song

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DinvTZ85OtI

ohhhh baby!!

March8. Sheila is an extraordinarily wise and intelligent lady with a total inability to spell. Her brain has never met an incorrect homonym it didn't love. This sometimes produces truly unique and hilarious constructions.

Hallelujah! Hope the taking of Hastert's old seat is an omen for what's to come!

cool, because then there is no worry.... just be happy and try

Why is everyone so afraid of a convention where the leader is actually chosen?? I've been beggin for an exciting convention for years... I love those old newsies of one state or another (the nominee's home state) puttin the winner over the top.. woohoo!!

Yes Jamie,

If I hadn't had spell check and thesaurus on my computer, I would have been toast in my old job. ;0)

Frankly,

I feel extremely vindicated that Denny's constituents have spoken,

Michael Nutter...someone to keep an eye on

"Nutter takes it as a point of personal pride that he plans to stick with Clinton no matter what the future holds for her candidacy. "I take my time, think about what I am doing and then stick with it," he said. "I don't care whether it's just me and them left.""

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/08/AR2008030802244.html

Hey Sheila:

If you use Firefox for your browser...it will underline misspelled words as you are typing. You can then right click on the word and it will give you suggestions for the correct spelling.

Really helps.

IE doesn't seem to have that feature.

Good for him, a Man of his word

Downside of Obama Strategy
Losses in Big States Spur General-Election Fears

"If Clinton enters the summer on a roll, especially in the big states, the superdelegates may no longer feel that backing her would be opposing the will of the voters, an Obama supporter said."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/07/AR2008030703318.html

Wendy!

I had it at one time. It corrupted my old laptop...just don't want to take a chance. Thanks though. ;0)

IE is the DEVIL......rid your self of IE

March8

ROFL

I do prefer Firefox - I especially like my "colored tab" plug-in so all my Firefox tabs are different pretty colors

LOL

One other great event
the annual kinetic sculpture race in Eureka California
http://kineticgrandchampionship.com/

I can only stay for a few minutes. I just spent the last 12 hours reinstalling my O.S. and a few items that were needed.

I tried again to fix my ATI issue and screwed the operating system up real good this time. It wouldn't even go to a desktop.

Now after reinstalling I used the original drivers that came with my card and I have my TV working again.

I just caught up the last thread and boy am I glad I wasn't online with all the back and forth that went on.

And I sure am glad that my moniker has stayed the same since coming online here. When I post there's no doubt about who I am. Paranoid sure, but you know its me and not someone using different nic's all the time to spread dissent.

When you bash me your really bashing the one and only anon paranoid.

It was strange though that no one brought me up. Maybe that's a good thing? At least I know I have a few friends from over the years and I would sure hate to lose them.

Anyway, that's it for me tonight as I got to get up at 2am so I'll try to catch up with this thread before I hit the hay and try to get on tomorrow after I do some more computer reinstalling of my hardware and software.

Take care all and ...

God Bless.

I am just going to say that , perhaps in those days long ago that maybe our words were heard, but now everything seems to be analyze into minutia until there is no meaning.

I think we have lost.

Apple has a nice free browser - Safari 3 (Mac & PC) at this link:

http://www.apple.com/downloads/

Okay, I just caught up to my last comment. I did skip a few though and before I turn in I wanted to leave a thought or two.

I fully agree that Saddam Husein was a brutal Dictator, however don't forget that at one time he was OUR Brutal Dictator.

We sold and probably gave him the Chemical and Biological Weapons he used in his War with Iran. The same weapons that he used against the Kurds I believe.

As too Afghanistan what makes you think we can do any better there than Russia did. We armed the Taliban and they also were OUR friends when they were fighting the Russian Army.

And there were others as well least we forget Manual Noriega of Panama.

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~lormand/poli/soa/panama.htm

And one last thing. I'm pissed at Hillary saying McCain is ready to be Commander in Chief like her, but she don't think Obama is.

So if Obama is the nominee I can just see McCain now.

Well you know, Hillary said I'm more qualified to be the next President than the young Senator Obama is.

How does that sound for a talking point? And there will be much more of this the longer it goes.

On the other hand maybe Hillary should get the nomination. If we do have elections and she wins just think how well she will be remembered when we go into a Depression Greater then the one in 1929 and they blame her for not doing enough to stop it.

Remember, any time the economy has been bad, the current or sitting President gets the blame as well as the party. This is the legacy of the next President no matter whom it is.

It will take a lot to keep us from what surly looks like a total collapse of not only our Military, but our economy as well.

I'm off to bed now. Take care and ...

God Bless.

Nice to see nothing has changed. Gordo, typical of you to utter filth like the black man can be controlled by others and not the other candidates...your day of reckoning will come, sooner rather than later, if that is how you live your life...

"I read once, passingly, about a man named Shakespeare. I only read about him passingly, but I remember one thing he wrote that kind of moved me. He put it in the mouth of Hamlet, I think, it was, who said, "To be or not to be." He was in doubt about something. Whether it was nobler in the mind of man to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, moderation, or to take up arms against a sea of troubles and by opposing end them. And I go for that. If you take up arms, you'll end it, but if you sit around and wait for the one who's in power to make up his mind that he should end it, you'll be waiting a long time. And in my opinion, the young generation of whites, blacks, browns, whatever else there is, you're living at a time of extremism, a time of revolution, a time when there's got to be a change. People in power have misused it and now there has to be a change and a better world has to be built and the only way it's going to be built is with extreme methods. And I, for one, will join in with anyone, I don't care what color you are, as long as you want to change this miserable condition that exists on this earth."

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Dmzaaf-9aHQ&feature=related

http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-49076

Lardass Liberal is right...we all need to do a bit of history studying. The selection process of presidential candidates is not any sort of popularity contest, at least historically.
This is great true politics. Let's enjoy it.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ENHP89mLWOY&feature=related

I assume gordo is related to one of the interviewers.

Here is a fascinating article about Barack Obama's rise to the U.S. Senate and his frustration within the institution:

Obama in Senate: Star Power, Minor Role

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/us/politics/09obama.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

Thoughts?

Hey Sheila:

If you use Firefox for your browser...it will underline misspelled words as you are typing. You can then right click on the word and it will give you suggestions for the correct spelling.

Really helps.

IE doesn't seem to have that feature.

Posted by: Wendy! | March 8, 2008 10:43 PM

Ah that really works for me as well with SAFARI... of course that is part of the iMac system. I don't know, can SAFARI work on PCs?

Wendy,

"Hillary may very well lead in the popular vote."

I know this is important to you but at this point it has nothing to do with anything. As you recall, it doesn't have a bearing in the GE either, remember Al Gore . Let's stick to the rules as we know and understand them. Delegates, both pledged and Super will determine our nominee. That's it.

Max,

I was in a hurry to get out the door and wanted to reply. I knew ii would be taken wrong. I'm sure you are not a wingnut, maybe a nut.. but that's different. :) I was really taking a shot at Gordo and his right wing sources and how they operate.. You know the tactic. So, sorry to imply otherwise.I'm still watching the rezko roll out. i said before ; we probably won't know the entirety of it until next year, at about the same time we see Hill's WH records.

The discussion has definitely been worthwhile today.

Posted by: Wendy! | March 8, 2008 8:03 PM

I agree... For our group it's been a downright family reunion dinner...
I've had to clench my hands a couple times not to respond in a negative way, but well like any good family, we all have our dysfunctions! ;-)

Bear ----------------------------

There you go again, just like Obama, playing the Race Card. Obama makes speechs, that is it! He would be a Front Man. You seem to hate, before you think.

ET

Earlier today, it was mentioned that in 12 years in politics, Sen Obama has run for office 6 times. That to me means that celebrity and ambition have meant both neglecting the jobs he was hired to do and not being ready for the one he has attained.

I do not not that he is a man of both brilliance and accomplishments, but there is such a thing as too much too soon, and he well could be a classic example.

Apple has Safari 3 for PCs.

I do not not that he is a man of both brilliance and accomplishments, but there is such a thing as too much too soon, and he well could be a classic example.

Posted by: Jamie | March 9, 2008 1:13 AM

Thanks Jamie... He is an impressive orator and I believe he is a talented man. After reviewing the NY Times article, I was surprised by the disconnect he hah/has with the U.S. Senate. On the other hand, a lot of U.S. Senators endorsed him. I don't know the split between him and HIllary on those endorsements.

What he lacks in experience he gains in ambition and a vision for the future. This is all very good! Still, on balance, I am and will always be for Hillary. She has the extra experience, the vision for the future, ambition and a clear plan on how to move forward into an age when America's power and clout is diminishing.... economically and militarily. The likelihood of a full blown recession should help either Democrat this Fall. I still "pray" that it will be both of them on the ticket.

gordo,

You are the person always playing the card. If a minority points out the fact that a white person makes a racially charged statement, it is not playing a race card. Same thing, if a woman points out that a man is making a gender charged statement, it is not playing a gender card to point out a fact.

Defensive statements such as yours are typical of guilt/guilty conscious.

Good Night All. Don't forget to change your clocks.

Bear ---------------------------

"If a minority points out the fact that a white person makes a racially charged statement, it is not playing a race card."

How do you know I am White? Because I believe Obama is not ready to be POTUS?

When Bill Clinton said "It would be a roll of the dice", race was read into the words. You see race in everything! You use race as a weapon when lost for an answer.

I see that Obama won Wyoming Bush vetoes bill limiting CIA interrogation tactics.

Don't forget to spring ahead. You're already an hour behind for tomorrow.

tt

Oh and don't rely on your computer clock, it's confused.

tt

I fully agree that Saddam Husein was a brutal Dictator, however don't forget that at one time he was OUR Brutal Dictator.

We sold and probably gave him the Chemical and Biological Weapons he used in his War with Iran. The same weapons that he used against the Kurds I believe.

As too Afghanistan what makes you think we can do any better there than Russia did. We armed the Taliban and they also were OUR friends when they were fighting the Russian Army.

And there were others as well least we forget Manual Noriega of Panama.

Posted by: anon-paranoid | March 9, 2008 12:04 AM

Anon... just to post that I found this a very correct and important message. I don't understand a lot of what you write, and your questions on whether there will be an election, but you are a thinker. And for you a little story...

A cow comes running up to grazing field where two other cows are grazing lazily. The other cow is breathing hard, out of breath, and can hardly talk. The overly excited cow frantically says:

"OMG, you guys, I just found out where hamburgers come from!"

One of the lazy cows still chewing the hay, looks at him and says "oh you lefties and your conspiracy theories".

Good morning everyone,

I little run of Sunday Morning Cartoon for your morning Coffee.

The results of McCains visit tothe WH
http://cartoonbox.slate.com/static/160.html

http://cartoonbox.slate.com/static/131.html

The Rpublican vote scare.

Good morning Sheila, it seems only you and I are awake! Of course it's nearly 2 pm here!

Good conversation yesterday eh?

Not so funny

http://cartoonbox.slate.com/static/131.html

http://cartoonbox.slate.com/static/229.html

Good Morning ET, Here's a Nader one for you.

Yes it was actually fun...and civil for once. I actually learned something. I hope you did too. ;0)

AND.....one for Obama...

http://cartoonbox.slate.com/static/114.html

Well when we talk from the heart and try to get to know each other better, we find we aren't that far apart on what is important in this world... That's what I took from it... Reel in the reactions, respond when it adds to the conversation, don't get into heated online discussions... Anyway that's my goal ;-)

THERE! I think I have managed to insult all sides today. The political Cartoons guys have a lot of foder this week. ;0)

The Nader one is hilarious!!

I'm off for a while... have become addicted to HEROES and am watching the DVD's... later xoxoxox

A great goal and WHAT we oldies have been trying to get into ya'll's head. but not an easy subject because this season is so unusual and we are so excited for our candidates.

AND Yes. I do think both had better start thinking about a double ticket. I believe they both need to embarce each other as THE TICKET for the good of this country. Theres hard times ahead.

We don't need the PAST going into the White House trying to continue the race to become a Republic again when we are more a Democracy now.

IMPORTANT HISTORY LESSON

And Thank you to Mr Greenburg for reminding us.

http://www.slate.com/id/2185831/
The Long Goodbye

It's too early to talk about Hillary's withdrawal.

By David Greenberg
Posted Wednesday, March 5, 2008, at 11:33 AM ET

The calls to wrap up the Democratic primary race show a similar amnesia. To suggest that March 5 marks a late date in the calendar ignores the duration of primary seasons past. Indeed, were Hillary Clinton to have pulled out of the race this week, Obama would have actually clinched a contested race for the party's nomination earlier than almost any other Democrat since the current primary system took shape—the sole exception being John Kerry four years ago. Fighting all the way through the primaries, in other words, is perfectly normal.

"don't get into heated online discussions"

And don't take bait thrown out just to start a fight.

Welll.......Going to be hard to choose who to watch this morning.

I think CBS is more the ticket for me with Howard Dean, Sen Bill Nelson, Sen John Kerry, GOP Strategist Ed Rolloins, and DEM Strategist Trippi.

Looks like a two round tables?

Or on ABC Dean talks about the future of the DEM party...we already know its morphing into something....I wonder what HE thinks......then Christ and Levin talking about our states.

NBC looks more like an extention to slugfest with Dashcle and Rendell discussin WHO is going to win PA.......and the NOM....so tired of that.

I want some real substance this morning. I'll watch MTP at a later time period. The other two are worth channel Flipping.

Let me know if anything happens on Face the Nation. For some reason we don't get it on Sunday morning. It comes on a midnight ... stupid.

I will, It looks the best this morning.

Jamie

"And don't take bait thrown out just to start a fight."

Thanks for the reminder
lol
I was about to snack on a bit of troll bait myself.

Jack

"GOP Strategist Ed Rolloins, and DEM Strategist Trippi"

Now that is a pair to draw to.
They could be interesting, a bit more than the "didtoo,didnot,didtoo, didnot" that the rest of them are looking to be.

I think I will skip the whole mess, looks like nothing new.

Jack

Sheila said "We don't need the PAST going into the White House trying to continue the race to become a Republic again when we are more a Democracy now."
http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2008/03/saturday-at-the-ballot-box.html#comment-49215

We're certainly not a democracy constitutionally. And, looking at Wyoming, as an example, observers (on the winning side) extrapolate the results producing the statement, 'The people have spoken!' when we know that, actually, only a minuscule portion of the state's Dems spoke.

I've sat in too many meetings, on the dais, with people literally shouting that the "people' want such-and-such when ,in fact, it's just a small subset of the community's population who favor their particular position. But, still, they demand that we bow to the weight of their 'democratic' position.

I think the form of government we have is absolutely perfect if and when each branch asserts its constitutional prerogatives.

But, we most certainly are not a pure democracy despite our adherence to many democratic principles and ideals.

I do agree, though, that a ticket combining the two should be formed.

The principals should go to some secluded spot, just the candidates and their spouses, and hammer out a ticket and platform based on logic, reason, and their appreciation of what the country needs.

Morning gang. Lots of momentum building here in Florida for a mail-in primary do-over. This story is just one of many with the same kind of news. Some Dems pushing to make the vote open to independents.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/politics/orl-florida0908mar09,0,848657.story

FLATUS,

Good Morning! You are right in most of your prognosis of our country. I sometimes....most of the time just forego the details,

I don't think a pure democracy works and neither do I think a pure Republic is good. AND so in my Indie/moderate/left leaning vision, I think the combination of both was a great idea. LBJ almost had it and then Nixon started the spoil it. I'm just sayin.

In our lifetime we have seen the eroding of what should be. Not camelot, but a site bit better than the REPUBLIC that the Repugs have been hammering at.

They are correct when they have said that they intended to bring us back to what was originally started. A Republic is basically a government managed by the elite.

So LBJ had is going on. We the baby boomers only got a taste when the Repugs decided to quietly start the devolution.

ok, now I have to get more coffee!

ET...

And we more than likely ate those cows. LOL...LOL...LOL...

God Bless.

And Of course, I think our children will finish our version of Democracy. We may see it if we are blessed with a long life.

Morning Anon-P

good to read you more regularly! I am still in Palm Beach until 1st of Apr. I tell ya. I'm so tired I can hardly think straight.

They let me come up to me house for the weekend, just to rest. Now THAT is some kind of boss right?

Sheila
I just watched 30 seconds of MTP
My advice.
Turn off the TV, lay down the remote and slowly/carefully walk away.

Also McClatchy is doing a series of articles on Obama
I found them interesting
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/story/29752.html
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/29766.html

Jack

Question Anon-P

Are you officially putting your preferance with Obama? I thought of you when I wrote that list of Obama Supporters on the list, but I didn't want to put words in your mouth either.

LOL jack,

Please.....I haven't watched Sunday Morning in three months.......twitch....{{{twitch}}}

Well I have to get off now and try to finish reloading everything back onto my computer.

And isn't it great that the 29 states that Obama won are meaningless? According to Randell anyway.

And I still say let Florida stand and do a new Primary in Michigan. Even though the Governor is a friend of Hillary. Also let Michigan pay for it as they broke the rules and didn't think that anyone could beat Hillary and she would have the nomination locked up by super Tuesday.

I also was surprised to see that Hillary thought that McCain was more ready to be C in C than Obama. She supports McCain over Obama. That sounds like something a Republican would do. Support a Republican over a Democrat.

Catch you all later hopefully.

God Bless.

NEW THREAD

Good For Dean.

This IS a good thing that we are witnessing. The democratic process while fair is not instantaneous.

We are too used to instant everything and Cable has made it so much harder than it should be.

Sheila...

I have one post up on the race to the White House in it is in support of Obama.

I really don't feel comfortable getting into pissing contests over who is the best since it always leads to bashing.

I just try to tell it like I see it and whether or not you agree is your choice. Not you Sheila, the rest of those who comment here.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and if they support their candidate strongly nothing anyone says will change that. Its not worth fighting over and losing friends.

There are good arguments on both sides, however I look at the bigger picture like you and if this keeps up the Democratic Party will split and be destroyed for a very long time.

And if anyone thinks differently they better consider that it's a possibility that could occur and than we will be in more serious Sh*t than we are now.

Of course that is if we have elections.

Take care my friend, I really need to finish repairing my computer. Will check back sometime late today.

God Bless.

NEW THREAD
RELOAD