Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

:)

Senator Kennedy needs to say...

"I got ya back, Ba-rack!!"

LOL

I don't know if Kennedy's endorsement will have much impact in FL. But it could turn California (except for KGC) around. They loved Teddy in 1980 and the Hispanics there love him too. That's the state to watch...

GO TEDDY!

Stands up and Claps!!!!

MSNBC is truly fair and balanced. CC on KO followed by Stephanie Miller on Dan Abrams.

You know Fry,

All you have to do is listen to Caroline and her uncle. This is what Barack Obama means in Change.

Fresh Generational Change.

But if you want me to parse, I can.

ooooo! Stephanie and Dan together again? .....this is a can't miss! lol

The latino's in California for the most part have already chosen sides and are not likely to be influenced by Ted Kennedy. The Farm Workers have already endorsed Clinton and in particular Delores Huerta.
The mayor of LA endorsed Clinton,

A very radical latino group has endorsed obama but they are not expected to have much of an impact.

1980 was a long time ago and people here have
moved on.

Obama is trying to use his position on driver's licenses to make inroads in the community but it seems to be backfiring because people know it is a pander.

also Obama did not do well with latinos in Nevada

cue....

"I Got 99 Problems, But A B*tch Ain't One"

ha, the ole buzzard almost said oSama again

dnd I agree whole heartedly, the impact of Teddy will be seen in California, especially among latinos. Florida, who cares.

He may have almost said it, but we will forgive him and choose to honor everything else he said.

I was point by point quite good and very proffesional

I have boycotted MSNBC both on cable and TiVo, but will break my own rules and tune in to see Craig. Craig is accumulating a fan club, especially among Democratic women. ;-)

KGC,
"1980 was a long time ago and people here have
moved on."

Perhaps, but clearly Craig still holds a grudge.

My prediction: Carter and Kennedy kiss and make up, like Dino and Jerry, endorses Obama, and the party's over.

practical politics question: has Ted Kennedy ever endorsed anyone who became president? The scorecard is not pretty, folks.

MP,

It will be well worth it for you. KO actually allows his guests to speak, without interruption.

Just lost another somewhat long post, which of course had some brilliant ideas. For now, I'll just re-post this response to HD from the last thread:

Dooty,

I agree that 23% probably wouldn't be enough. I'd like to say Huckabee's tax proposal is a fairy tale, but I believe that term is now officially a racial slur. I think it's just something he dreamed up (oops, probably can't say that either) so he'd get people talking about his ideas. Similar to Steve Forbes' 10% Flat Tax, we can put it on a bridge to nowhere.

I had a great answer for Cheryl about the Republican's chances of winning in '08, but I have to get back to work.

Short version:

Cheryl,

It can happen. Rather than arguing with Gordo or anyone else, who suggests the possibility, we need to work to see that it doesn't.

practical politics question: has Bill Clinton ever endorsed anyone who became president? The scorecard is not pretty, folks.

Sorry Craig. Couldn't resist. ;-)

Craig,

Didn't Ted endorse you to be President of the CQ Wine Club? lol

Oh, no he didn't.....

Did Obama just inject race into his speech???????

Sour grapes abound on this blog today.

I hear angels singing...

I hear angels singing...

oops...sorry for the double post

Amazing and Ironic link between Obama and the efforts of Teddy Kenndy to raise people up.....

It's frightening to think that Ann Coulter has endorsed more candidates who became president than Bill huh?

all i 've known and seen is that when democrats drool the republicans salivate

Well, I'm off. Not into reading posts hear that will just slam. ;0)

Good Day Folks.

Happy Politics!

That was quite a speech....I usually only hear angels singing, when Chuck Todd is speaking!! ;)

Clinton/Obama '08!!

Craig,

Is your last statement directed towards the Dems and Reps views on elections, food or pornography?

how many prez candidates has clinton endorsed compared to Kennedy?

Sorry I haven't read all the comments yet, but That's the way you do an endorsement!!!!! and I'm no fan of Senator Kennedy.

Okay gotta go pick up the kids from school.

Bear,
"Is your last statement directed towards the Dems and Reps views on elections, food or pornography?"

Thanks. Now I've got to clean up all the coffee I spit on the keyboard. LOL!

kennedy has just ripped a giant hole in the party. he should have remained neutral until the general, i think.

It is no accident ... is clearly aimed

So... baseless speculation it is, then?

Obama's FLA ads were part of a national buy. He didn't do squat in Florida; Clinton's the one who started talking it up out of the blue in the past couple days.

Well ok, first of all Teddy Kennedy also praised Hillary and John (Edwards) and said he would support the nominee whoever it is. If Hillary wasn't running, I would be solidly behind Obama at this point. But she is running and I believe this is the year of the woman. Obama is good yes, but he is still part of the boy's network, and it's time to show that America can and will elect a leader from the most disenfranchised block of citizens in the country: Women, women who actually make up more than 50% of the USA's population. It's been over 200 years; let's get on with it.

Fry mentioned the fighting among the Democrats. The problem we have here is that two constituencies, which have been shut out of the highest office in the land, finally see the real possibility that they can break through. So the tensions are there. Once there is a nominee I think "losing" side will support she/him.

Thomas

dnd

better to spit, rather than have it come out your nose...LOL ;)

so when obama was in Fla in Sept what was he doing
campaigning for Mitt?

The nonstop media attack on the Clintons did not elicit even one peep of protest from Senator Obama. That tells me he is a coward with abysmal ethics.

Of course I no longer need to ever vote again. The media canonized him, the Kennedys crowned him., and We have heard the innaugural speech.

From now on every four years the MSNBC can just tell us who is moving in to 1600.

Eat your Wheaties, Craig. Bitch-slap any of those Obamaist Kool-Aid-drinking Clinton-hating thugs, too!

Seriously...I like TK, but c'mon...These endorsements, received by anyone typically don't have any impact.

I do find it ironic however, that the news is all abuzz about a career Senator endorsing a campaign that is based upon some nebulous platform of change.

If Kennedy's name was Smith or Jones or Levin for that matter, it would be a mere blip in the news cycle. Cheers!!

dnd
Bill Clinton hung in with Jimmy Carter
Kennedy cost him the election

I wonder if Teddy coming out for Obama will open the door for Gore to come out and endorse him too.

jamie, the frightening thing is, you may be right. the media is playing us all for fools.

Obama's not green enought for Gore
Edwards and Clinton have much better renewable energy packages. It would be tough for Gore to justify an Obama endorsement.

Elvis

Obama could have done a national buy without Florida just the way Clinton did, but he went on the cheap with a national buy that didn't indicate states where it would run. In other words another example of his superior ethics and veracity.

"Of course I no longer need to ever vote again."

Works for me.

Teddy is about "raising people up?" He didn't do such a good job for Mary Jo Kopekne. Seriously, that incident bothers me.

Has Ted endorsed anyone who became president?
JFK & LBJ.

Ted won't matter much to young voters, but many of the northeast & midwest retirees in FL love him. They are not afraid to call themselves "liberals."

Cuban Americans in FL are mostly Republicans. They did the break-in at Watergate and according to Oliver Stone, they had a hand in the JFK assassination.

They're probably voting for the mad bomber, Rudy.

You can't really be serious about considering Oliver Stone a reliable source on the assassination of JFK?

Ted Kennedy has been a voice for liberals and progressives in the party. I don't think he will have much impact.

He is what he is and a lot of people give him some credit for the Kerry in Iowa. But this is the night before the election. I rather doubt most Florida voters will even know about the endorsement before it they vote
the ones who haven't already voted.

Maybe Obama can have a Ted and Oprah tour

KGC,
"Obama's not green enought for Gore"

Plus the Gore's and the Clinton's love each other so much...

"KCG the only people who care about Florida are you, Craig, and Hillary." I suggest that Obama should be added to that list or show that he is indeed a political naif, which I don't believe - after all, he didn't have his name removed from the primary ballots as he did in MI (nor did Edwards for that matter) - FL is the 4th largest state, the only one that one on one retail politics hasn't occurred in, and delegates or no, may be the best indication to date what voters in the other states may do since it more closely approximates what will happen in the other states between now and next Tuesday (minus the TV ad deluge that will occur in the other states). Of course being 20 or so points down in most polls just 1 day before the primary is probably good enough reason to try and downplay whatever significance the FL outcome might have.

Brian, Whenever someone points out the same crap you accuse the Clintons of you call it sour grapes.

dnd

I thought the natural fit for Gore was Edwards but it didn't happen and now I think it is too late.

About to go for Home Depot.

But before I do.

First of all, I was wondering when someone was going to slam a fellow Democrat with the Chapaquidick.....LOL

Second, Then I was thinking someone in this group is going to say, they may never vote again.....CHECK! LOL

Third, parsing whether or not he can hold the numbers of LIBERALS and Hispanics in certain parts of the country.......CHECK CHECK!!

As Fry would say, totally readable you guys are today.

Whats the difference between you and the rest of us who are not Clinton all the way? We are still being gracious about Clinton and we are being realistic in our asessments of ALL the candidates.

I for one will keep on kepping Senator Clinton in my high estimation and in my prayers.

Now OFF TO HOME DEPOT> ;0)

KGC,
"I thought the natural fit for Gore was Edwards but it didn't happen and now I think it is too late."

Yeah, I think you're probably right.

Oh and.....Gore is now a Statesman of the World. Bigger than endorsements for President.

He will not endorse any candidate, I'm betting on that,

Global Warming is more important....really.

and cuz Gore's endorsement of Dean was soooo successful :)

Had an off-blog conversation with Zoey yesterday. One of the best conspiracy-theorists I've ever met, she wondered aloud if the Kennedy endorsement was aimed at getting Edwards out of the race before the 2/5 national primary.

The endorsement isn't going to have much if any effect on people who are considering Clinton, but it might have a big effect on those people who are considering the choice between Obama and Edwards...

You have to admit it's an interesting proposition....

I raised that issue in the previous thread mostly as it related to the unions now supporting Edwards

They want to be released but he isn't letting them off the hook.

Although it isn't clear to me that they would go to obama anyway

I don't think it mattered to Mary Jo Kopechne's parents if the person driving the car she died is was a "fellow democrat" or a republican, or the fact that instead of calling the police while she was in the water, Teddy called his cousin attorney instead.

Brian will complain about "sour grapes" or how this incident from 1969 has nothing to do with today. Maybe he would be right. I only mentioned it because I saw the irony in the statement about Teddy's attempts for "lifting people up".

pogo Florida doesn't matter on the Dem side, people can shout from the rafters I'm wrong, it going to change the fact. As Andrea said, it's a "beauty contest" nothing more.

I understand just how difficult it is when a candidate you believe in fails to win the prize. I'm sure watching Hillary's chance grow increasing slim with each day is very painful however that doesn't justify the back biting and venom spewing that has taken place around here today. Nothing will be more of a threat to the GOP than a unified Democratic Party, it's time for HillCo to start remembering it's not about Hillary winning, it's about a Democrat winning in November.

quoting Andrea Mitchell, mrs Alan Greenspan or Andi as she was known in her early days

lololololololololololololo
and the only candidate who has failed to talk about a unified Democratic party is Obama
'

Brian, it seems to me that you are writing a political obituary for Hillary Clinton long before we know where this nominating process will end up. Reminds me of the Chicago Tribune headline:

DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN

Be careful about making predictions.

another hucksterbee hypocrisy. I thought he was supposed to be the healthy eater now

January 28, 2008
Huckabee challenges Romney over fried chicken
Posted: 09:01 AM ET

Romney stopped in at a KFC over the weekend.
PENSACOLA, Florida (CNN) – Mitt Romney's failure to eat fried chicken with the skin on is nothing short of blasphemy here in the South, according to GOP rival Mike Huckabee.

Romney, of Massachusetts, dug into a piece fried chicken at KFC while campaigning in Lutz, Florida on Saturday, but not before peeling off what most would consider the best part — the crispy skin.

Admittedly, KFC's chicken doesn't exactly stack up against the delectable kind that comes out of deep fryers in kitchens around the South, and Romney said he was looking for the healthiest option available to him for lunch.

Huckabee, looking ahead to a flotilla of southern states up for grabs on Super Tuesday, was told about the move by a reporter here in the Florida panhandle.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/01/28/huckabee-challenges-romney-over-fried-chicken/

"it's time for HillCo to start remembering it's not about Hillary winning, it's about a Democrat winning in November."
Brian, it could just as easily be said that it's not about obama, it's about a democrat winning in november. too bad obama didn't consider that before he decided to run this time.

Sheila, given what I consider our long and mutually respectful correspondence on this blog and knowing that you do indeed love Dems of all stripes, I'm sure you are gracious about Clinton, are being realistic about all the candidates, and do keep Sen. Clinton in your high estimation. However, I don't think we have to look far though to find Dems on this blog who do not do that, and before anyone jumps me, I don't claim to be so detached myself.

Brian, what are you going to say if the combo of SC win and Kennedy endorsement produce a boom at the polls tomorrow for Obama? Because i think that's a real possibility. Are you still going to say Florida doesn't matter? If there really is some sort of natural force out there for Obama why wouldn't it register at the polls here tomorrow?

"too bad obama didn't consider that before he decided to run this time."

That's exactly the attitude why so many Dems, myself included loath the idea of Hillary. The gal of you people thinking only Hillary can win is beyond the pale.

Off for a meeting. You Hillary folks will have to find someone else to spew your bile out. dnd yuo want to borrow my hazmat suit?

Craig I'm going to say it's a beauty contest, nothing more. Sure it will be grand if Hillary doesn't win, but it's still a beauty contest. L8R

Well Brian tried to stick out an Olive branch to placate the Hillary supporters, which was rather condescending and didn't work. When that failed, he returned to his combative attacks on Hillary Clinton and her supporters.

The early afternoon Intrade Presidential Futures update...

At this time, Clinton has about a 92% chance of winning Florida. With the exception of a couple days of speculation buying around 1/8/08, Obama's support has remained about 8-9 times less than Clinton for at least the last 60 days. It has been drifting steadily downward over the last week.

The support between McCain and Romney is still rather volatile. Even though McCain has shown some strength in the last 18 hours, Romney's financial support also increased.

At this time, McCain and Romney are within each other's margin-of-error in this futures market. Therefore, the race is too close to call.

More as events warrant...

I don't think Kennedy will change hard core Hillary supporters. I agree with those who thnk FL matters, it will be inpoertant at the convention and in general. Why is Obama araid to let delegates count?

I am with Clinton to end, I think RFK's cjldren Kathleen Kennedy Townsend, RFK, Jr and Kerry Kennedy alog with Anthony K Shriver will help with migrants and poor people more than Ted.

EuroTom,

Whether you like Oliver Stone or not, when you go to Dealey Plaza and survey the motorcade route, you recognize that Oliver Stone's theory is much more in tune with the laws of physics than the Warren Commision.

I attended a lecture about the assassination and one thing that always disturbed me were pictures of LBJ being protected in his limo, by swarming secret service, just before JFK was hit for the first time...

"Craig I'm going to say it's a beauty contest, nothing more. Sure it will be grand if Hillary doesn't win, but it's still a beauty contest. L8R -- Posted by: Brian In NYC"

OK then, we're agreed -- the most beautiful Democrat will win Florida tomorrow

LOL Craig !!!!!

I don't have a problem with Obama running. I do have a problem with the disdain he projects about the Clintons.

How ironic, looks to me that the Dems are going to be in the FL courts this summer on an presidential election matter. I hope not!

I agree with Eurotom.

Beschlos just said TK endosement is more significant
than most. Makes my hear sad.

KGC,

Why would Obama have to talk about a unified party when you have the former president basically calling him Jesse Jackson.

I love Bill Clinton but he pissed me off because he is saying with his actions that short of burning a cross on the Obama's lawn, he can piss off blacks knowing that they would never vote for a Republican. While it's ok for a running mate to make that argument, it shouldn't be coming from the titular head of the party or a former president.

Bill Clinton should shut up with his Jesse Jackson references because someone with a long memory will think back to Jesse Jackson giving Bill Clinton some post Monica "counseling". This was short lived because the good Reverend was soon revealed to have had his own affair, complete with child. Thrown in no apology to the Duke lacrosse players and he may end up like Gilligan, on a raft, trying to paddle away from that mine in the lagoon...

Hillary will win nomination, question is will Obama be running mate in a situation similar to Kennedy-Johnson ticket. Also if Obama is elected pres who will be his Bobby?

The only problem I've had with Obama is that he never addressed the media speculating that Clinton won NH because of some hidden racism....

IMO.... he should have said immediately that he did not think the good people of NH were racists...... and the fact that he never said that speaks volumes......

but if he is the Democratic nominee.... I will whole heartedly support him...

ooops..... did I just break my pledge to not saying anything negative about a Democratic candidate...... oh well.....

Craig,

Do you think Resko arrest will hurt Obama. He did buy a lot from him at reduced price. His disclaimers "credulity" in Chicago papers. Problem for St Obama?

Why in the world would a comment about Jesse Jackson be insulting to Barack Obama. Obama respects Jesse Jackson, President Clinton respects Jesse Jackson, and even though I am a nobody, I respect Jesse Jackson too... I was an alternate delegate for Jesse at the Washington State Democratic Party. If anything, President Clinton was only commenting that South Carolina is and has been hospitable to African-American candidates. He wasn't dissing anyone.

There is no need for a lawsuit rezdogobama unless someone is planning on challenging the Florida State Democratic Party and its voters

All the information you need is on their website

Factless and fectless drivel

Sorry, Brian, I think your comment about FL just being a beauty contest (credits to Andrea) is wrong. I'm betting that FL's delegates will be seated.

And you certainly do know what it's like to see your candidate's run fall flat - I felt the same thing in '04 that you are feeling now, and with the same candidate - yes, I supported JE in teh runup to the '04 convention and thought Kerry was the wrong choice for head of the ticket. But I supported him after the convention and so it goes.

And I don't see Hillary's chances as being slim or getting appreciably slimmer. Maybe in a few states, but not overall. To the contrary. What I see in the contests up until today is what you normally expect to happen - they narrowed as the election date approached. Aside from SC, they have been very close, and including SC they have split the contests equally. I would certainly not hang my ultimate electoral hopes on a lopsided victory in a historically red state that is anything other than representative of the US. If Obama wins FL, CA, NY, NJ - states that are much more diverse than SC - or some combination of smaller states next week that puts a majority of the electoral votes that will flow from those states in his column, then you'll have something to be smug about. But that hasn't happened yet, and I don't really expect it to.

This damn place is becoming addicting to me. I am neglecting my MySpace. grrrrrr... anyway, I need to go get cleaned up for bed. Tomorrow morning comes very early... It's the main weekly magazines day and I need at least 30-45 minutes to sort everything and place them.

All this Teddy Kennedy beatification reminded me of what happened the night he took some of the Kennedy boys out on the town.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/celebrity/william_k_smith/documents.html

Bear
I think I see where you are going I think the lesson for Clinton is shut up shut up shut up you cannot win this fight,

Are you enjoying the Plunger's plunge. it is one of the best parts of the campaign season to me. I wish I had a collage of every time Tweety said the Plunger would win because terra trumps values and everything else.
He was wrong.

Bear, the speculation about your demise was wrong I'm happy to see. I for one did not take Bill's comments about Jesse as a slam at Jesse or Obama - and I daresay that notwithstanding any appearances to the contrary, Bill Clinton and Jesse Jackson share a mutual respect and affection. Rather, I took it as a comment reflecting a political reality - winning SC, whether you're black or not, doesn't ensure a victory at the national party level. I rather took it as acknowledging Jesse as having been a credible candidate who couldn't convert an SC victory into a larger one. I saw Jesse speak at the Univ. of AL back in the early 80s- probably about '83 (would that be the right dateframe for the Rainbow coalition?) and thought he was the most inspiring politician I had ever heard - extending a hand of friendship and acceptance to all. He got a wonderful reception there, and And I really didn't hear much in the way of negative stuff being said about him in the days following his speech there. Considering that AL is, ummm, somewhat less hospitable to candidates of color than SC, that is saying a lot. Of course that didn't get him the nomination either, but times and prejudices have certainly changed, but SC as a national bellweather has not.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8akaUMV6u0A

KGC,

With regards to Bill, it's not so much that I want him to shut the F up, it's that the more he speaks in such "inpolitic" ways, it takes some of the shine off the star. It would be similar to news that my favorite athlete was a roid head...

With regards to the Plunger, I haven't been this happy since the Pats won the Super Bowl in '02 or the Sox won in 04.

The only thing that would make it better would be to have a monkey throwing handfuls of poop at all the MSM who annointed the plunger as our next president.

Craig...I'll mail you a rain slicker...lol

I love how Craig makes Florida some make or break place for either: Obama's SC momentum or now the Kennedy effect. How about the place doesn't count, but I'll bet that the Clintons will whine about counting and seating the delegates at the convention.

You know, I'm starting to finally, after all these years, see the character flaws in the Clintons that the Republicans used to rail against. And that's scary.

Next prediction from Craig: If Obama wins more delegates than Clinton on February 5th, then it's clear that voters can't spell, because they would have never picked Obama over Clinton.

I said it once and I'll say it again. Bill Clinton messed this up for Hillary. Now, somewhat enthusiastic Obama supporters are HYPER enthusiastic supporters. Just took a couple of cabs in Chicago and all of the drivers said they were voting for Obama because they were pissed at Clinton. So I say to Bill: Keep doing the voodoo that you like to do. It drives Obama to victory.

Craig said: "OK then, we're agreed -- the most beautiful Democrat will win Florida tomorrow"

YAHOO! YOU READ IT HERE FIRST! CRAIG PREDICTS AN EDWARDS WIN IN FLORIDA!!!

For those who think we are past the days of racism, think again.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-St-Cloud-Swastikas.html

And this is Minnesota, not Mississippi.

harborwoman,

I see you are hanging in there till the end?

Sure.. ya'll just go ahead and have a party while i'm stuck here workin, sweatin.. :(

Is it just me not paying attention or has Craig's membership rolls doubled since NH? So many new niks.

Reminder: This is the political comments page for MSNBC

http://boards.msn.com/MSNBCboards/board.aspx?BoardID=780

There are boards of the specific shows as well.

"love how Craig makes Florida some make or break place for either." -- Posted by: alpha1906

Alpha, i am writing about and looking for the significance of each state as they come -- and Florida is tomorrow. I'm not going to pretend that two million D and R voters don't matter, especially when natl leaders in both parties (including DNC's Howard Dean) acknoweldge that the state's delegations will eventually be seated and counted because the party nominees will not have the guts to uphold the denial of convention voting rights to Michigan or Florida.

FD

More than doubled, but the hit and run folks seem to have gotten it out of their system, but a few newbies are sticking so far

EuroTom
Matt-Man
Nannymm

Anyone else I missed?

pogo,

Why would you ever think that? I mean Bill Clinton was a gnat's hair away from being labeled a racist for his works in SC. Bill Clinton, the First American Black President. Wasn't that Toni Morris who titled him with that phrase? Now isn't she backing Obama?

alpha it's comments like that that just piss me off to no end.... sorry.

Fry..that would be Toni Morrison.. and she's free to support whomever she wants..

Yes well I think my participation in this webblog thing is detrimental to my internet usage. I just got a warning that I am up to 90% of my maximum monthly capacity of usage!! So now I will probably lose high speed connection and get crap connection for the rest of the month. of course it's only a few days.

Anyway I need to shower and shave, and sleep
bye bye bye

Fry...

Edwards is still the only one I hear saying what I think needs saying...and, more important, DOING. Also, our other two front-runners have taken a number of cues from him. So, yes...I'm sticking with Edwards to the end...will caucus for him in WA on Feb. 9....

oh and harborwoman... LOL LOL LOL

Jamie,

It does seem like a lot of hit and run going on. Alpha, Rezdog (is that dod with a different nik?), are new. There was one on the earlier post. Long winded person but was very though provoking. Did Sheila ever get her cable back up and running?

Toni Morrison that her. Wonder what it was about Hillary she didn't care for? She sure liked Bill back then.

Harborwoman, I took the liberty to post John Edwards' farewell song on the earlier post. it was written with a tad bit of humor, but i doubt if you'll find it humorous.

*takes a bow*

Thank you, Thomas!

I have seen rezdog post under that name over on another blog I read. Sounds the same way to me.

yo soy Horsedooty!

MSNBC finally deigned to mention that all of Robert Kennedy's children have endorsed Senator Clinton

http://boards.msn.com/MSNBCboards/board.aspx?BoardID=780

Although Senators Obama and Clinton -- and, occasionally, the media -- lionize Dr. Martin Luther King, no one seems to make much mention of the fact that Martin Luther King III expressed his preference for Senator John Edwards.

Why is it that the endorsements of some icons' hangers-on matter so much?

Apparently, it is because some endorsements serve the media's agenda and some don't.

I'm sure that if Martin Luther King III had endorsed Senator Obama or Senator Clinton, it would have served the narrative, one way or the other, but because Senator Edwards received the nod, well, never mind.

Fry...

Don't take this wrong, but whenever you post about Edwards, I skip the post. Don't want to hear you spew your venom about him...sorry.

The loooooong posts have been submitted by MaxTrue. And you're tight, he's had some thought-provoking material in them.

Fry.. either way, Dems have chance to cast historic vote.. not sure it's a matter of 'not liking someone'

Fry...

That was meant to be...you're right...which are two words I rarely type together...hence, I'm sure, the typo!

'Fry...

Don't take this wrong, but whenever you post about Edwards, I skip the post. Don't want to hear you spew your venom about him...sorry........
And you're tight'
Harborwoman

I have often though Fry was drunk posting. lol

HarborW..... now that was truly funny..... LOL!

hey Craig.... I see they're going to let you back on Morning Joe tomorrow....
but one could easily construe your 6:30 am appearance after being on at midnight with Shuster the night before as a form of punishment....

yeah we'll begrudgingly let you back on...... but you must do penance.... you bad, bad, boy....... :0}

Jaime -
Don't forget me! I just don't post much during the day. Somebody has to work for a living ;-)

Fry, despite "almost" being labelled a racist, primarily by the Obama supporters and the media lapping up their comments, aside from believing that Bill Clinton is not a racist and acknowledging the factual accuracy of his comments, even the subject of Bill's comments, Jesse Jackson, said he saw nothing offensive in Bill's comments, and I feel certain that he will come out as supporting Obama if he hasn't already - the tar and feather reaction to them is coming from the Obama worshippers. And I think She's cable is up & running, but she's apparently not gotten her wireless going yet.

Alpha, ignoring the 4th largest state's results is moronic. Who in their right mind doesn't believe it means anything as far as the mood of the voters is concerned? Certainly not the pundits. Obama's supporters are working overtime to tamp down its significance, and if Clinton doesn't do as well there as expected, her supporters will be doing the same thing after the results are in. Besides Craig's assesment: "Clinton expects a wide lead in Tuesday’s balloting to give her a boost toward next week’s collection of 22 primaries and caucuses.
If Kennedy’s endorsement means anything, its first test comes tomorrow in Florida." is hardly a make or break one, and shows that both leading camps have some risk in tomorrow's voting. Point out one thing Craig said that suggests anything beyond those words.

Renee, in the past Joe has had some of hei best guests on in the 6:30 half hour, first thing out of the chutes\ (kind of copying IMus in that respect). Catches those who are up and getting ready for work. Certainly that will be the case tomorrow.

Odd isn't it. Teddy Kennedy's endorsement of Obama carries more weight with the delegates but not with the voters, but Caroline's endorsement carries more weight with the voters and not the delegates. I wonder how much of Caroline's endorsement for Obama has to do with her imagery of Camelot. All the deaths, all the scandals that the Kennedy family has gone through. What sort of impact would that have upon her, what is it that she sees, or thinks she sees in Obama. One thing for sure it isn't his record as a politician, and it has to be more than vision. Her dad had vision, but he also had a history of achievements, leadership.

That would be HIS best guests

those who don't believe Florida matters can disregard this, but just got latest stats on Democratic absentees and early voting: 437,038 Democrats have already voted (with nearly 70,000 absentee ballots yet to be returned).

That is five times the early-voting total in 2004. Republicans have been keeping pace but still waiting on their latest numbers.

"I see they're going to let you back on Morning Joe " one could easily construe your 6:30 am appearance after being on at midnight with Shuster the night before as a form of punishment." -- Posted by: RebelliousRenee

RebelliousRenee -- Ha, mebbe they're wearin me down to get sandbagged -- won't happen

I just spew about Edwards because he is a fake. You'll notice I never spew about Hillary or Obama. Well I guess that is because i like them.

Funny you mention drinking KG, I often thought you were drunk. So of the hateful thing you have written would either have to come from a drunk or a bigot. Certainly not from a educated newspaper reporter.

*looking chagrined*

Alas...when is a typo just a typo...and not a Freudian slip???

CC :"Howard Dean acknoweldges that the state's delegations will eventually be seated and counted "

NP with that. All delegates should be counted, but apportioned by what means? A straw poll, beauty contest. I don't think those on the short end of the stick will stand by without a big fight.

Well, fry, dang it...he's my fake, and I like 'im!

Craig -- "RebelliousRenee -- Ha, mebbe they're wearin me down to get sandbagged -- won't happen"

Just taking an extra shirt and sleeping on the weather guy's cot, aren't you???

And Craig says he's gonna' win tomorrow...didn't you, Craig? Beauty contest...remember!?!

Craig- given the high number of people who have already cast their FL ballots, doesn't it follow that the FL count tomorrow will not be all about the Kennedy Effect?

Doesn't mean tho that the media types will stop making it be all about that.

rezdog
It explains all on the web site of the florida dem party
what's the matter don't you know how to google to get to it
Delegate allocation is established. Oh right sore loserville -that could only be obama who couldn't be bothered to call Clinton after Nevada

It''s been forever since I've logged onto the post-Attack-The-Messenger boards. Nice to know people are still having fun thinking.

My sister and I just ignored the polite rule to not talk politics at parties and hosted a party to talk politics. It was great - almost European in it's enjoyment of sharp discussion and wine drinking. Universally people wanted a change in the tenor of political conversation in this country and wanted the pundits (sorry, Craig) to stop creating the narrative for judgment.

As so many have pointed out, voters make choices on more than race or gender. In fact, defining it that way eliminates complexity and puts Edwards out in the cold and out of the race simply because he's a white male and therefore doesn't fit the chosen story line. When are those who ask questions going to ask detailed questions about how to realize those grand ideas that make clever sound bites? (CJR has a great article on this at http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/seeing_the_light_in_south_caro.php)

Whether or not a candidate is viable shouldn't depend on charm or connection to past presidencies. I suspect the Kennedy legacy is almost meaningless to anyone under 40, so touting this as a huge blow to Clinton and Edwards simply shows how disconnected major media is, for example, to the people who came to our party, and who are looking at other models for leadership. The Kennedy legacy includes killing those who try to make dramatic change, so if you want to make change your rally cry, you've got to deal with the dangers and difficulties of making that change real.

Ah, it feels good to spout off again.

Craig -- "just got latest stats on Democratic absentees and early voting: 437,038 Democrats have already voted (with nearly 70,000 absentee ballots yet to be returned)."

That suggests the Kennedy endorsements don't mean quite as much in FL as they might appear on the surface.

This would further suggest they're aimed primarily toward the Feb. 5th states, which strengthens Zoey's "get Edwards out of the race" conspiracy theory...

Just a thought...

It''s been forever since I've logged onto the post-Attack-The-Messenger boards. Nice to know people are still having fun thinking.

My sister and I just ignored the polite rule to not talk politics at parties and hosted a party to talk politics. It was great - almost European in it's enjoyment of sharp discussion and wine drinking. Universally people wanted a change in the tenor of political conversation in this country and wanted the pundits (sorry, Craig) to stop creating the narrative for judgment.

As so many have pointed out, voters make choices on more than race or gender. In fact, defining it that way eliminates complexity and puts Edwards out in the cold and out of the race simply because he's a white male and therefore doesn't fit the chosen story line. When are those who ask questions going to ask detailed questions about how to realize those grand ideas that make clever sound bites? (CJR has a great article on this at http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/seeing_the_light_in_south_caro.php)

Whether or not a candidate is viable shouldn't depend on charm or connection to past presidencies. I suspect the Kennedy legacy is almost meaningless to anyone under 40, so touting this as a huge blow to Clinton and Edwards simply shows how disconnected major media is, for example, to the people who came to our party, and who are looking at other models for leadership. The Kennedy legacy includes killing those who try to make dramatic change, so if you want to make change your rally cry, you've got to deal with the dangers and difficulties of making that change real.

Ah, it feels good to spout off again.

The only news organization that tried to tie Clinton to Rezko is NBC. Another example of their bias and baloney. How pathetic

All the NEWBIES who plan to stay around and become OLD HANDS may want to look under "Blogroll" There is a map there with the locations and political leanings (red - Conservative, Purple - Moderate/Independent, and Blue - Liberal plus one green for an avid environmentalis),

If you have a website, your "light" will link to it when clicked. Put up a message to the mapkeeper "Ran". He will tell you the next steps.

"Craig- given the high number of people who have already cast their FL ballots, doesn't it follow that the FL count tomorrow will not be all about the Kennedy Effect?" -- Posted by: Kathy

if pattern holds, Kathy, another half million Democrats vote live tomorrow, so i am going to be probing those results for signs of Kennedy and/or SC boom, gotta believe it'll be there if all these expecations for an Obama wave are accurate. if not, it means that the Obama campaign must amplify the SC/ Kennedy effects in SupDupe states with campaigning and ads, and they haven't much time for doing that. to me, florida is like a laboratory rat used to predict the effects of chemical additves on larger organisms

Pogo,

I don't consider Bill Clinton racist, but I do find him to be a bit condescending and that can be worse than being racist.

Rez

"but apportioned by what means?" Each state divvies up its caucus or primary delegates by their formula. This is almost always by precinct, but some precincts are weighted heavier than others because population in them may vary widly and usually the parties want the countrs to represent as many people as possigle.

Craig-
The biggest stories of the season so far has been the incredibly high vote turnout and the stats that show Clinton 's percentages are higher the older the voter is, and that Obama sweeps the under 30 crowd-

it is strange to think that voters under 30 were not even ever able to vote for Bill Clinton.

Voter Turnout by Party (rough numbers)
Iowa: 220,000(D) 115,000(R)
New Hampshire: 288,000(D) 239,000(R)
Nevada: 115,800(D) 44,300(R)
South Carolina: 530,322 (D) 446,000 (R)

Total Democratic Voter Turnout: 1,154,122
Total Republican Voter Turnout: 844,300

Bear, I suspect any ex pres can be condescending - although I'm not sure other than his "how dare you" comments what he's said that would be considered condescending. And I took his "how dare you" comments as not unreasonable responses to comments he saw as patently false and unfair (rightly or wrongly).

The only news organization that tried to tie Clinton to Rezko is NBC. Another example of their bias and baloney. How pathetic

Posted by: Katherine Graham Cracker | January 28, 2008 4:13 PM

KGC,

First of all, people in glass houses shouldn't be using an AK-47 to open their windows.

Second, the Clinton's have been accused of being hypocrites in the past. After the Abramoff thing happened, everyone was clamoring for picture of Abramoff with Rove and Bush. So the fact that there is a picture of the Clinton's with this slum lord, yet there hasn't been one of Obama and Rezko, is a valid question to ask the candidate.

Why aren't you equally outraged that the statements of Bill Clinton made lauding Ronald Reagan weren't widely covered?

http://www.qando.net/details.aspx?Entry=7741

I am a Libra and I believe in keeping things BALANCED...

Craig -- "if pattern holds, Kathy, another half million Democrats vote live tomorrow, so i am going to be probing those results for signs of Kennedy and/or SC boom,"

Other than exit polling (yea, I know, I know) how do you disaggreate the results of the live voting from those ballots that were cast prior to Saturday?

Violating Spike's Rule #2 (Never assume anything), I would assume the published results will be aggregated total....

SHEILA STONE,
You know Fry,

All you have to do is listen to Caroline and her uncle. This is what Barack Obama means in Change.
Fresh Generational Change.
But if you want me to parse, I can.

Sorry Ms Stone, her uncles lies, so what he has to say isn't worth much. Caroline is a different matter, but I am not interested in her reasons why she is endorsing Obama. What I have been asking you now since Saturday, what change is Obama going to be brining, and why doesn't his supporters expand from their typical sound bite of, "he represents change' to mention at least 1 of those changes when asked by the MSM why they voted for him. Obama is carrying the youth vote. The youth vote consist of students, limit work, limited family, individuals possessing limited real life experiences. So why would I think their idea of change is the same as what Obama has in mind? I am also wanting to know, how is Obama going to implement these changes if he is elected POTUS. Who is going to benefit, who is going to end up getting screwed?

craig, i thought you gave up on polls?

pogo....
don't take my teasing of Craig seriously..... stop thinking like a lawyer, will ya... :0)

Craig.... A... OK... buddy...... go in there tomorrow morning and give 'em hell!

The early Florida voting also occurred before the SC primary.... it should prove interesting to see the results..... no matter who comes out on top....

Personally I thought the raygun thing was stupid. Bill Clinton was angry because Obama dissed him
and baloney on the rezko thing.
Even obama doesn;t deny there is a relationship
he took 40k in campaign contributions from rezko
For all nbc knows that picture was photoshopped it came from Drudge and if it was a story why has no other news organization picked it up?

Fry,

One element of change that Obama and Clinton represent...

They actually earned their admission into and degrees from an Ivy League university.

Throw Edwards into the mix and the biggest change is a president with intellectual curiosity and a clue.

Another change they would bring is that they would be an American president that would be respected on the world stage.

harborwoman ,

I never said you weren't consistent. I like consistent people, at least you know where they are coming from. It is the wafflers that bother me; I will, I won't , I am, I'm not, I'm here, I''ll be there.

Sheila,
Have to run, but will be watching for your reply.

I believe that this Kennedy endorsement with Caroline joining in is not done out of lofty.... above the fray motives. I think Kerry, Leahy, and Kennedy took a look at the situation should the Democrat (Hillary) win the presidency and it looks good for that to happen and planned their strategy. Since power is the milk of politics and these veteran Senators have not had much lately I think they have assessed that if Hillary were to win with Bill in the background their power would not be as great. With this young really vulnerable Senator they can mold him to their wishes

Bear,

That world respect will be gone within 1 year. The Britts and the Aussies have always loved America, but you know why the rest of the world loves America. When your shit is in the street who else is going to pull your chestnuts out of the fire using their blood and treasure? More time than not that country will be, America.

Spike.... I find Zoey's theory very interesting....

Kathy..... I'm sure as someone involved in politics that you are well aware that those between the ages of 18-30 is the smallest percentage of the population that bothers to show up at the polls come general election day.....
I sincerely hope they get off their butts and show up to vote come November....
especially if the Democratic candidate is Obama.....

fry..... I've had the same problem with Obama supporters..... they seem unable to elaborate beyond "I want change".... "it's time for a change"..... "he inspires me to believe in change"..... etc. etc....

fry..... I've had the same problem with Obama supporters..... they seem unable to elaborate beyond "I want change".... "it's time for a change"..... "he inspires me to believe in change"..... etc. etc....

Thank you RR. :-)

Bye have a good night, try not to kill each other.

Good Gallup article on all the horse races

http://www.gallup.com/poll/103993/Gallup-Daily-Where-Election-Stands.aspx

Sorry, Renee, being a lawyer I sometimes lapse into talking like one. :-) Actually, I knew you were just poking fun - and CC will probably suffer a little from the lack of sleep - even more than my own if I stay up to watch him tonight. But it really is a pretty good time to be on - I get to catch him between shower and out the door.

Bear, it may be legitimate to ask the queston about the Rezko picture of Bill, after all he was president when it was taken, right? But there's no evidence that Rezko ever gave Hill a dime, at least none that I'm aware of, and there have been reports in the media that he gave Obama $200,000 over the years. As I said earlier, there will be questions about his votes or non votes that may have aided Rezko, and those questions will be based on more substance than a meet/greet photo and will require a deeper answer than "I guess he was in the photo line."

Well, off to get the kid, wash the car and head to LP's basketball practice. Manana.

OK, one more hit and run. In that Gallup article, they said.

"Clinton now leads Obama by 11 percentage points in Gallup's three-day rolling average nationally; as recently as Jan. 18-20 she was ahead by 20 points."

They forgot to say that Clinton's lead over Obama was as little as 4 points as of Jan 6-7

OK, now I gotta go.

Ann Meyers....

politicians doing things totally for their own benefit.....

Kudos!..... excellent thought!

yeah..... they ALL do that.....
including both Clintons, Obama, and Edwards.....

Random question...

If I somehow did damage to my rotator cuff while sleeping in my own bed, to the point where I can't kill the pain after taking a 4th vicodin, can I sue the maker of my bed or the vicodin since it's not killing the pain?

Fry.....

You know what gets my goat? YOu and the rest are so caught up in everything else you don't pay attention to it when someone writes it.

Now, I know I have sat down and written what change myself and a couple of million others want including college kids. I hear if on the tube too.

So, When I have time, I will sit down and write it out one more time. BUT, I will not do this again on demand. I will not be micro managed and parsed by you.

If you can't dig for the rest of the info yourself. YOur just out of luck.
I will see YOU when I am finished.