Craig Crawford's Trail Mix

Good morning! My ability to post has been spotty....but today Internet Explorer mysteriously showed back up on my desktop....bizarre.

don't know if this will help but have you rebuilt the desktop lately Patsi?

yo soy Horsedooty!

the tubes giveth, and the tubes taketh away.....

--Ted Stevens

Unfortunately, I have no idea how to rebuild a desktop....I am -- uh, technically challenged.

By the way, for all country music fans....actually, music of all sorts fans...check out today's Nashville Tennessean for a great piece on the first inductions to the new Musicians Hall of Fame. Included were the Wrecking Crew, the A-Team, the Tennessee Two and others. Very cool event!

Patsi,

read this link and follow the instructions for your OS.

it might help.

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=10182

yo soy Horsedooty!

here is another link

http://macs.about.com/cs/onlinecourses/a/tsclassic01.htm

Mac gurus I have talked to always recommend this maybe once a month.

yo soy Horsedooty!

Dooty....my friend Joe Sun was here on Thanksgiving (remember "Bombed Boozed & Busted" as well as his "OldFlames" hit later covered by Dolly?)...he looked at my desktop and cringed because I have about three million downloaded photos of my fabulous grandbaby Maria on the desktop. Would it help if I moved all those photos to "documents"?

I find her Stepford-viewers disturbing. Assigning reading material is one thing, but pushing a candidate (who would lose in the general) is another.

Has Oprah promoted enough things that have turned out to be tainted in some way that people will take her endorsement of Obama with a grain of salt?

When will the writers' strike end so that the political satirists can return?

these guys deserve some kind of award also:
The Dan Band....Dan Finnerty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIRiZsDObrU

sorry....the Dan Band in context:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObRUDbZofwQ&feature=related

Not so good news for my girl Hillary, but this is just the early rounds of a 12 round prize fight, and Hillary hasn't thrown any kidney punches, or did her world famous head butt. Hillary is a close in fighter, meaning she is smaller than her opponents and needs to step inside the long reach of Obama to make her punches felt. And one thing to keep in mind, Hillary isn't afraid to get hit on her way in. God did I just see her hit Obama below the belt? lol Oh that has got to hurt! Rewind the tape, lets watch it again.

http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSN2645320920071126

I haven't watched Oprah in years.....
I do read some of the books she recommends..... they're usually pretty good and have been very good of late.....

I know her promoting Obama is disturbing to some..... but she is a citizen and it is her right as much as anyone's here to openly express her opinion and campaign for whomever she chooses, IMO.....

Craig.... yeah.... too bad about the weather.....
I gotta admit.... November in New England is the pits!
(and Julia's right.... blue is definitely your color).....

I don't get this. Does Oprah believe she is the King Maker? Apparently Oprah believes she has so much sway over the female voting block that her backing of Obama will seal the deal. If true what does this say about female voters that they can be so easily manipulated by a famous celebrity? I thought the 19th Amendment gave the woman the right to vote, not to be lead around by the nose, and drawn a picture of who they are suppose to vote for? But then again, Democrat females have always let good looks stand in the way of good sense. Have great day :-)

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8T5C5GG1&show_article=1

Looks like they had to change the oil in cheney's heart.......

Fandom in all it's forms bothers me as human beings no matter how nice were meant to be worshipped.

Oprah is certainly entitled to support any one she wants - more power to her for being involved. She would probably be more effected by giving each voter a car.

mornin' all.

Patsi, I feel your pain. I did a 4 hour (on & off) clean up, tune up and restart to get the home computer back into Cyber space last night with
Dell on Call (the 3rd such marathon, although this one was longer and more involved). Tonite after LP does his eval for his Jerry West Basketball league, I'll hold my breath and see if it worked.

Right, FD, too many dem women voted for Dumya - although I don't see what they saw in him. If your theory is right, god knows Rudi won't get their votes. And I don't get too lathered about Zogby polls, they have a methodology that yeilds a largely self-selected sample, I participated in their polls for a while - would do one whenever it was convenient. Yeilds very spotty and inconsistent results.

Can't stand Oprah - but she does have a large, devoted following that take much of what she says as gospel. Be interesting to see whether her attempt at kingmaking gives Obama a bump.

Sturg, I think they had to jump start Darth - I wonder if they installed neck bolts a la Frank's monster this time? Could save time the next time the heart of darkness hiccups.

Here's Pollster's take on the Zogby poll. Like I said...

http://www.pollster.com/blogs/zogby_internet_poll_trial_heat.php

FD

Zogby always trends slightly right. Since this is an on line poll it becomes even more in need of analysis since the people taking part are self selecting. Since I answer Zogbys about once a week.

It's useful info but hardly a reason for Clinton to start weeping.

the on line zogby poll us nothing more han a push poll and zogby does free work for Ward Connerly

And here's Gallup's head to head matchups between Cinton and the Reps and Obama and the Reps - one tie between Obama and Rudi, the rest are Dem advantages of between 3 and 17 percent.

http://www.pollster.com/blogs/poll_gallup_general_election_m.php

But like Fry said, it's early.

I've been relishing the Rep frontrunners savaging each other. Rudi is proving to be untryustworthy - he shouldn't lie about Romney's record when it take about 3 clicks to show that he's lying. He could lose votes that way.

I too have answered the online Zogby stuff occasionally- but as I ahve written here before, at least in NH, the "worker bee" democrats in the party are not supporters of HRC> There has been a long standing concern about her ability to sail on through the general, as well as concerns about some of her positions and the whole Clinton legacy.

There has been no clear alternatve for many, because most everyone I know likes all the democratic candidates to some degree. If Obama or Edwards was not in the race, it would look quite differently with a clear alternative.

Could be good news - could Jon be back soon?

http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/dare-we-hope-a-deal-has-been-struck/

Obama is the weakest democrat and if the media is supporting him you know why.

kgc

It isn't a "push poll". There is none of this "if you knew ... would you" fake statements. I just question the methodology since they have no real idea if the person filling out the questionaire is who or what they say they are unless they have some sort of filter that I'm not aware of to eliminate frauds or use a higher margin of error.

Still it is a matter of what data to include and Zogby has just always trended slightly right just as the LA Times trends left. Neither has been vastly off in their predictions as long as you take that into consideration.

Having said that, I'm not fond of polls since the media tends to just broadcast what is handed to them without questioning and it can lead to self fulfilling prophecies as people have a natural tendency to be "on the winning side".

it is a push poll..it doesn't have o have that format ...to be oneo the swiftboat pac...and they are not the same..at all. Zogby is a rightwing goooper and the on line poll reflects that

for example in one poll they compared moveon

oops...in one poll they said the moveon.org group is the same as the swiftboat pac. That simply is not true. They do that all the time. The try to present something as a fact when it is not
they do it all the time in the on line polls

zogby does free work for Ward Connerly that should tell you everything

Strength and electibility and all that- it reminds me of when the masses decided in the weeks before the caucus and primary that Kerry was the best. How wrong they were. What the caucuses told me last time around was that it is dangerous to be the frontrunner with the cloak of inevitability in the months before the caucus date.

It is interesting to read the comments about Oprah viewers- Stepford wives and such. Myself I have a great deal of respect for Oprah- and have watched her occaisionally over the years. The biggest slam I hear about her is put downs due to her wealth or that she is "better than" others. But that is the minority.

I think she will cause people to perk up their ears to Obama and listen to him more- that is worth something. I do not think that is a slam dunk that her viewers- who vary in education and age and backgrounds- will vote for him. But it will generate publicity.

I also think that endorsements are not so effective in causing one to vote for a candidate, except when it is someone another knows personally.

New Politifact Truth O Meters

Edwards got a "pants on fire" this time.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/

In 2004 "by the numbers" Kerry was the best candidate. The goopers destroyed the advantage with the swiftboat attacks....which could not have happened without the media being their enablers.

The edwards pants on fire to me is not serious --it is about his challenge to congress to get healthcare on the agenda.

what about tjhe lies the Plunger has been telling about healthcare and crime....thos lies are much worse.

politifact truthometer is stuck on load of crap based on whose facts they chose to check,

Kathy, Everything you say about Oprah is absolutely true. She deserves real respect for her accomplishments. It is her audience that at times seems a little too hero worshipping. It is that reaction that bothers me a bit, but it may say more about me that "joiners" disturb me more than it says about her.

Forget Oprah. Hillary is inevitable. Just ask her:

It's 2:20 into the clip.

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=3541273n

msgop is spending the day pimping the immiigration issue even though it is only important to 11% as a priority issue but they see it has a way to promote
hatred...and now msgop is not presenting the issue in a factual way. They just misrepresented both Clinton and Obama's position

msgop is a disgrace to journalism

Patsi,
If you're still interested in getting a cheap windows machine, these guys have good deals:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/

I think between now and Christmas, you'll see computer sales everywhere. Shopzilla.com might help comparison shop.

Well, Oprah will be in Manchester a week form Sunday- I think there will be a huge crowd.

I got to talk with Barack Obama yesterday for a few minutes one on one- he was in town for an editorial meeting and I was called a half hour before to meet at a local coffee place- this is the second time I have been able to speak with him for more than a handshake, and just as before I found him to be real, comfortable in his skin, and honestly more interested in what others have to say than speaking about himself. Still officially undeclared though-

Patsi,

build a folder and stuff all the desktop images of the fab grandbaby in it. Then rebuild the desktop.

yo soy Horsedooty!

Zmell Miller did a lot of damage to Kerry by speaking at the goopers convention and attacking his patriotism...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uselections2004/story/0,,1296378,00.html

electibility is a crap argument and nothing but a media invention

Kathy....
I have one friend here in this little burg that I can talk politics with..... we go to several book clubs meetings together..... and she is an ardent Oprah fan.....

I don't watch Oprah..... but I don't put her down either.... I think a lot of the criticism is jealousy over her money....

BTW..... she's also an ardent Bill Moyers, Charlie Rose, and John Stewart fan....

the media trashed Kerry

here we Mrs. Greenspan pointing out that Zmell misreprsented Kerry's positions and Tweety saying who cares --we don't like Kerry ...we are goopers
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5892840/

the electability issue is a trap because no matter who the democrat is...they will be trashed by the media

I just spent 20 minutes scanning the recent polls (I'm working on my attention span - tomorrow, 20 1/2 minutes). In short, they are all over the place. Zogby's is an anomoly and is contrary to almost all other polls out there, regardless of bias, even Fox's which are, as we know, anything but fair and balanced.

kc, I agree with you to the extent that Zogby is right leaning, but don't agree that it is a push poll. I've participated in it a few times, and their "push" items, like the one you mentioned, suffer from the sin of omission. The Swiftboat Liars and Moveon are the same from a legal standpoint - they are both 527s with a clearly identifiable political agenda aligned with one party only. However, their methods and viviewpoints are nothing alike - the Swiftboaters create lies from whole cloth (from the left wing perspective) and Moveon deals in half truths (from the right wing viewpoint - a viewpoint with which I do not agree, but do recognize). But the statement that they are alike is correct from one perspective. Zogby's right bias is obvious from the equation of the two, but that does not make the poll a push poll. I read a very good article last week about the differences between push polls and polls that are simply biased - of course I can't remember where or who wrote it, but if I find it again I'll link it.

I disagree...the swfitbnoats were liars set up to attack one candidate --that it hardly the role of moveon,org. and the zogby polls on the "investor class" have also been full of crap.

the on line polls are set ups for gooper issues and distribution to the media..they are nothing but psuh polls...you can dress it up but it iis nothing but gooper propaganda

Anyone who knows what they're doing can rig a poll. Leading questions, distorted sampling, or just plain lying about the results.

Reporting poll results is about all the cable TV "journlaists" can do. They do no research, and think no thoughts. They just read whatever is handed to them.

this is the fifth day in a row that msgop has made Oprah the lead story

Yeah, I'd like to see someone define what they think electability is. If it's favorable/unfavorable, Rudi looks good at 55/32, but he, Hill and Barack are all above 50% favorable and Edwards is at 50%. All the rest are below 50%. I figure that means that any of the top 4 could draw enough votes to be elected - and isn't that what "electability" is all about? Winnow the field to 2 and it gets real close to 50/50 if history is a teacher. IMHO electability is noting more than appealing to enough of the base to get them to go out and vote and appealing to enough of the middle who vote to check your name instead of the other guy, and it can't be measured until the field is narrowed. Besides, an Illinois/Arkansas lawyer ex first lady could hardly be considered electable in NY, but she was.

nash is right - anyone can rig a poll, and the newsies don't take the time to learn to analyze poll results. It's the mainstream pollsters who try to keep it neutral who garner some respect in the polling world, but even they screw up questions, skew their sample, etc. and even when they do it as right as it can be done, they can miss the mark. It's so much easier to predict the past than the future.

"It's so much easier to predict the past than the future. " pogo

you'd think that would be true..but look how often they get that wrong too

so far all of the msgop pundits have said --immigration is only an issue for the republicans
based on what I can tell --republicans are less than 30% these days so who cares what they think,
The reporting here says the indies in NH are voting in the Democratic primary
msgop continues to promote racial hatred and misstate facts about immigration. Today they told us the culinary workers promote illegal immigration.

Morning peeps.
No one wants to address the elephant in the room and Oprah's effect on that elephant. Oprah will make it a lot easier for white females to vote for Obama. Oprah has transcended race and her endorsement and campaigning for Obama can go a long way in doing the same for him. If Obama does well with white middle class women it could go a long way in helping him to win the nomination and election.

good point kc, I guess there's a lot more past to predict than there is future. I love how Dumya is trying to predict how in the future historians will "predict" the impact of his preidency and politicies. Of course, I'm betting they get it a whole lot righter than he has.

Brian, I don't think people see Oprah as being influential only among black women - you are right that she has clearly transcended color and her impact is on women in general. She clearly is giving Obama an opening - time will tell whether it benefits him.

kgc

All of the service industry unions want members whether legal or illegal. It is the numbers that give them their power and income. Looking to closely at their members legality would defeat that purpose.

too closely

blah blah blah oprah.
she has already done everything he can for Obama
she endorsed him last fall
she is not an "easy path for woman to consider Obama"
Obama's new improved poll number have come because nbc and msgop launched an attack against Clinton.starting at the Philly debate and then using their news(sic) outlets have promoted their own bias as the story line.

And if people are duped into thinking Obama is a better choice because he is less polarizing then I have some citigrou stock I would like to sell you.

about Obama and race-
It has been interesting to me, that I have spoken with several people- the youngest being mid40's- who do not think Obama has a chance nationally due to racism- as well as a lesser concern about his own safety. The younger voters, and especially the campaign workers, do not think that racism is an issue, and that they are not "hearing" it.

There still is talk about the Bush-Clinton - Bush-CLinton legacy- it is interesting to note that almost all of the campaign workers were in elementary school when Clinton was elected.

One thing that has been on my mind lately is how much I dislike that the election cycle started so soon. Even I'm getting sick of it and I'm a political junkie.

It is wrong for msgop to say the Culinary Workers invite illegal immiigration and do not check their membership as required by law.

Unions abide by the federal law to collect the same data emloyers are required to obtain.

Pogo I didn't say anything about black women, I suspect Hillary will carry the black vote. Not much of an issue in either Iowa or NH is it?

Patsi....
I know how you feel..... I've gotten sick of it too.....
I've stopped watching most of the news shows..... no Sunday morning shows for me at all (Sundays mornings are for Rick and I to go out to breakfast).....
and after this past Sunday night..... we've decided to stop answering the phone unless our caller ID shows us someone we know personally....

I hate to say it..... but I'm even beginning to scan a lot of the posts here.....

life is short..... I'm getting tired of all the negativity surrounding this primary/caucus season..... especially since most of it is just useless blather, IMO....

It's the end of the year and party time. I think most people want to feel goodwill at this time of year not get involved in politics. It is going to be very difficult to get anyone to pay attention and change minds. I think this and the writer's strike are very good for Clinton,

"Culinary Workers"

Interesting term. Would that include dishwashers, bus-boys, waiters? Unions abide by the same rules. Really? That' is odd usually when ICE makes one of there sweeps they usually hit union work sites; meat cutters, construction. garment etc.. So if the "Culinary Workers" union abide by the rules, I would be very surprised. Last time I was in Vegas most of the "Culinary Workers" didn't speak, or understand English very well. Wonder how Jimmy Hoffa would deal with illegal alien union workers?

" Wonder how Jimmy Hoffa would deal with illegal alien union workers?"

he welcomed them with open arms. Many of the teamster union roosters had many members of with the same social security number. I know because in the 1980's I helped conduct teamster elections under a court ordered trustee. Times are different now.

for the unions you mentioned...membership comes with work and the employer is responsible for checking documents which are then given to the union. The failure is with the employers.

I've noticed in many posts your English isn't that great..

kgc,

I'm not sure about the strength of your defense of the unions, culinary and otherwise. Saying that they collect the same data as employers, only gets them to the level of Tyson Foods and any number of other see-no-evil, hear-no-evil conglomerates. I'm not insinuating the unions should be held to a higher standard, just saying it would be naive to think they're more careful than any other employer.

Brian, I didn't say you did, but you didn't have to. It's that transcending thing Oprah's done (and Obama's doing) - she appeals to housewives across the board (and probably a lot of others thanks to TiVo). And unless things have changed a lot in NH since I lived there, you're right - carrying the black vote there gets you a cuppa - if you've got $3 (Starbucks).

Sorry, had I known FD was on the attack, I never would have weighed in. It's bad enough that I agree with Brian on Oprah. Now, I'll just get back to work.

Pogo I think you're missing my point, Ophrah hurts Hillary in what should be Hillary's easiest group, white middle class women. The black vote is not an issue at this point in the game. Not sure why you keep going there, maybe I'm missing something.

EdVB
Tamron Hall on masgop said the culinary workers encourage illegal immigration. It is simply not true.
As noted on this board. The Farm Workers Union opposed the hiring of undocumented workers.
They are satisfying the law as it is written.
You have to work for thirty days or so before you can join the union --so the unions depend in part on the employers to satisfy the document requirement.
But the same docs are to be filed with the union office as well.

Come to the light Ed, come to the light.

If Oprah hasn't been able to move "white middle class women" so far...what makes you think it is going to happen now...?????????????

KC cause I do think a lot of the women will show up to see her and enthusiasm can be very contagious. I have a lot of trouble understanding your off the cuff dismissing her?

Because people are acting like he just endorsed him
she endorsed him a year ago -- her audience knows who she supports. I don't think people are going to turn out to see her during the holiday season. and I don't think she has that much influence more to wield on Obama's behalf. She has already given him a lot...
Women I know what are supporting Clinton are not going to change becuse of Oprah Winfrey.

kgc

"Unions abide by the federal law to collect the same data emloyers are required to obtain."

They collect the data but they are not required to do anything about it when Social Security eventually comes back that the name and/or number do not match records and sends along a different number to use.

It's a matter of enforcement. They just don't do it because it is not in their best interest to do it.

Oprah is not always right...
she gave us Dr. Phil and his phony diet
she gets taken in by frauds
and what about the Gail show?

sometimes she makes mistakes

don't think the black vote comes in to play in NH. Just not enough blacks in the area, in my opinion.

yo soy Horsedooty!

"As noted on this board. The Farm Workers Union opposed the hiring of undocumented workers."

Use to oppose it when Caesar Chavez was in charge because it took work away from legal farm workers. Now that he is dead and the kids are raking in money, the farm workers actually lead pro illegal demonstrations.

The law requires the employer not the union to guarantee the documentation, You cannot join the union unless you are employed. The employer is the one responsible. The employer would know well before the union if the paperwork was accurate. The unions are dependent upon the employer and the federal government.

I think you underestimate the undecideds, also I think you are missing the point that a lot of people of both sexes are supporting Hillary because they think she is inevitable. If you take that away I think a lot of her support erodes. We are a celebrity driven society, I think a lot of people would get up from their holiday dinner table to go see Oprah. Just look at the cable news ratings when there is a big celebrity story. You give the American public too much credit.

" Now that he is dead and the kids are raking in money, the farm workers actually lead pro illegal demonstrations" Jamie

I call baloney on this and ask for some sourcing

" Oprah hasn't been able to move "white middle class women"

Really who do you think makes up the majority of her viewers, book club, audience? Females, white, black, brown, yellow, green and pink will follow Oprah leads, because they think Oprah knows all.

Women who support Clinton are not supporting her because she in inevitable. I think you are missing the excitment that a lot of women feel about the first woman president.

The Oprah argument is just media crapola...all along the media has been saying Clionton does not have the support of her peers white upper educated women and that she got lower class women instead...now Oprah is taking away voters according to the media Clinton never had.

Time will tell KC, I think caucus night is going to be quite a wakeup for the Hillary people. I'll be surprised if she gets above third place.

I think the Iowa finish will be
Edwards
Clinton
Obama

Close KC,
Edwards
Obama
Hillary

"The law requires the employer not the union to guarantee the documentation"

Well that would be nice if it was followed, but apparently the Unions hire people who produce fraudulent documents, fake social security numbers, fake drivers license, fake birth certificates. To correct this problem the Unions, if they wanted to, could put a stop to this by verifying the documents. The cost is minimal compared to the fines and penalties they have to pay per each illegal worker caught working.

"Well that would be nice if it was followed, but apparently the Unions hire people who produce fraudulent documents, fake social security numbers, fake drivers license, fake birth certificates" frydaddy

unions don't hire anyone unless you are suggesting they hire people to make false documents and then I would have to ask you for a source I know you won't produce.

Fry I didn't know you were a communist. Expecting labor orgs. to be an arm of the govt. is rather Stalinist isn't it?

To correct this problem the Unions, if they wanted to, could put a stop to this by verifying the documents. The cost is minimal compared to the fines and penalties they have to pay per each illegal worker caught working.

Posted by: FryDaddy | November 27, 2007 12:12 PM

currently this is the job of the employer. First you get a job and then you join the union. The federal laws make the employer responsible not the union

you usual factless drivel.

http://www.ice.gov/partners/opaimage/

this link is for you Fry I know you will want to make sure all the industry in the Carolina's are participating.

Edwards. lol, sorry just can't help myself when I think of him. If Edwards doesn't win Iowa, it isn't for his lack of campaigning. If memory serves me right Edwards has been in Iowa for over 2 years beating the bushes, and for all that hard work he is only in 3rd place. But wait lets look at the other states: NH. WOW, 3rd place again. Michigan 3rd again. Nevada 3rd again. SC his home state. drum roll please 3rd yet again.! Apparently there are a lot of FD types out there who can see through John "BP" Edwards mystique.

The employer are just lazy or they don't want any Union problems. In some industries you have to be a Union member first before you get a Union job. You are letting the Unions off the hook, no surprise there, for furnishing illegal union help to industries who are tied to Unions. BTW, NC is a right to work state, although there are Unions, they have been pretty much castrated, as their main threat, "STRIKE", has been taken away.

read the link fry....you are as usual looking to blame everyone but yourself and the people you support
what a big ole gooper whinny baby you are

The Obama campaign said they hope Oprah will make participating in the caucus process fun and that she will get people to turn out to the caucuses.
I do not find that believable.

I have only been a union member once when I worked for the Frisco Railroad. Texas is a right to work state also. I had to have the switchman's job before the Union Steward came around to sign me up.

yo soy Horsedooty!

let me know when all the NC employers are in compliance with ICE --I'm sure Fry will be happy to contact them and ask if they are participating.

KGC...
Oprah is like everyone else..... a human being....

I bet she draws HUGE crowds here in NH a week from Sunday....

I bet my friend tries to persuade me to go see Oprah with her....
poor thing..... she has a snowball's chance in hell of getting me to give up the Patriots/Steelers game just to see Oprah..... :)

rr
would you go see her if there wasn't a game?

I've had sort of an issue with Oprah since she put my (then somewhat obscure) favorite brand of jeans on one of HER "Favorite Things" shows, the end result being me not able to find a pair in my size for many moons AND the bonus dork factor when store clerks smirked at me and said "Oh, you mean OPRAH'S JEANS..." when asked if they had the brand in stock. Thanks a lot, Oprah. *grumbles*

That aside, I don't think she's going to influence very many voters with her support of Obama. I don't think there are too many "swing voters" (or whatever you want to call them) out there who haven't made up their minds, OR who are so easily swayed by celebrity that they'll cast their one Presidential vote for whomever Oprah says they should. Books, cupcakes, and jeans are one thing, politics are quite another. I agree with Jamie: "She would probably be more effected by giving each voter a car."

Oprah Winfrey or Deepak Chopra, these celebrities are all chopped liver to me. Whether the candidate is male or female, white, black, or other we need to make our own decisions. I've seen and heard enough. Joe biden is my guy, and if he's not on the ticket, I'll vote for whichever candidate Derek Jeter thinks is best.

No, Brian, I don't miss your point. I think you're right that it might be easier for white middle class women to vote for someone who most resembles them in many respects, and if Oprah moves a bunch of them to Obama in Iowa or NH, it might help him at Hillary's expense. I keep going back to the race issue because I'm looking past the primaries. Oprah's ability to mobilize and motivate her base of support, which includes black, brown and white women voters could make a difference in the numbers of Dem base voters who return from their Bushco insanity and turn out to vote as Dems in November next year, and perhaps even some Rep women who are more brainwashed by her than by their conservative leanings. I don't know how interested she'll remain if Obama doesn't get the nod, and FWIW, I don't think he will, Oprah or not. And I do also agree with you about her ability to add excitement to the process - which I might add it sorely needs.

BTW, unless the law has canged in the past 6 months, unions aren't required to verify their members' documentation - employers are required to verify their employees' immigration status through the use of an I-9 form.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

http://www.uscis.gov/files/article/EIB102.pdf

They cannot designate which of the allowable documents they will accept, are not required to verify the authenticity of the documents so long as they appear to be genuine and aren't subject to fine unless the documents are patently false. If you think it should be different, contact your representatives and ge the law changed.

That should have been "unless the law has changed in the past 6 months"

should have been "get the law changed"

(Drat)

Brian, better rethink your "black vote is not an issue at this point in the game" stance. Jesse disagrees (of course), and says your boy is the only dem candidate paying attention to its needs.

http://www.suntimes.com/news/jackson/668053,CST-EDT-JESSE27.article

For those o fyou who haven't gotten your BS quota for the day (week or month) ...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-abrams/rove-congress-pushed-bu_b_74039.html

Rove is now claiming Congress pushed Bush into Iraq prematurely.

Pogo I don't care what Jesse says, in Iowa and NH there is no black vote! Right now I'm not thinking past Iowa and NH. With this years compacted schedule I believe both states could be make or break for the top three Dems. If any of them comes out #3 in both races they are out of the game. I think Hillary can afford to come in second or third place in Iowa, however if she doesn't come in first in NH I think it's over for her.

I'm going to make a pot of sauce, anyone want to come over for a pasta dinner?