Political Insider

Remember when McCain changed one of his famous POW stories to swap in the local football team? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/07/10/mccain-changes-pow-story_n_112017.html

Is it any surprise that he would revise (or invent) another story?

When I heard that I thought, "that's weird, Vietnam is a very Buddhist country." There is a small number of Christians in Vietnam, but a Viet Cong guard who is a Christian, that is so unlikely! It made for a good story, but it sure sounds like a lie.

Mr. McCain campaign has exclusively been hinged on one subject - heroism. But with bare-faced plagiarisms like this, time is coming when he should be asked to tell us how being a POW made him an automatic hero instead of a FAILURE to the American war cause.
Heroes are those soldiers who did outstanding heroic things to win wars - and not get imprisoned by the enemy.
And what war has McCain ever helped America win as he keeps claiming - Definitely, not the one in Vietnam, nor any other ever since.
McCain should just shut up about his heroic acts and talk about the failures of his Republican government under President G. W. Bush

The first thing I thought of when I hear McCain's story about the cross is that it is virtually identical to the story told by Solzhenitsyn about his experience in the Soviet Gulags. And I also thought it was strange that there would be a Viet Cong prison guard who was Christian, whereas in the Soviet Union, it would not be completely unexpected, since the (former) Soviet Union was an historically (Orthodox) Christian country.

I have no comment about McCain's evolving memories other than that they seem to be evolving or devolving in much the same way that Reagan's did....

"This is just like the plane that I flew in the war!"
"Mr. President, you didn't fly a plane in the war you flew it in a movie."

What I would like to comment on is the posting including "There is a small number of Christians in Vietnam," from IsupportedMcCainIn2000. Members of the Roman Catholic church were a significant and sizable minority in Viet Nam prior to the war and included the Diem family, who ruled the South. That was a result of the French imperialist presence in the country for decades prior to WW II. The possibility of a Christian prison guard is not at all unlikely.

And I think John McCain as President of the United States would be a walking talking nightmare for this country.

This is what McCain said after he was released from prison.

"I had the singular misfortune to get caught communicating four times in the month of May of 1969. They had a punishment room right across the courtyard from my cell, and I ended up spending a lot of time over there.

It was also in May, 1969, that they wanted me to write—as I remember—a letter to U. S. pilots who were flying over North Vietnam asking them not to do it. I was being forced to stand up continuously—sometimes they'd make you stand up or sit on a stool for a long period of time. I'd stood up for a couple of days, with a respite only because one of the guards — the only real human being that I ever met over there — let me lie down for a couple of hours while he was on watch the middle of one night."

McCain was known by the prison guards because he was the chaplain for his comrades.

McCain talked about his in a book a in the late 90's.

You libs attacking McCain's service with backfire big time.

McCain had his arms tied behind his back so hard they repeatedly broke them. To this day he can't lift up his arms to comb his hair.

You want to talk about hypocricy.

Obama copied word for word passages from Duval Patrick without crediting him. You can find them on youtube.

Obama lied that his parents met at Selma. Obama was four years old during Selma it is impossible they met there.

Obama lied about his uncle liberating auschwitz.

When they talked about people spitting on vets from vietnam this is the kind of garbage they talked about.

McCain talked about this guard right when he was released from prison. How this guard was the only guard to show mercy.

You people who never served a day in your lives love to smear McCain with lies.

It isn't enough that McCain is disabled and can't lift his arms up to comb his own hair. Barry O can enjoy basketball something McCain can never do.

It isn't enough that McCain has a nasty grin because his teeth were knocked out by his captors so decades later the left can make fun of his smile.

It isn't enough that he was left out in the sun to rot and get permanent skin damage.

It isn't enough that he has two sons in the military one who just came back from a tour in the middle east.

You lefties are the bottom of the barrel.

McCain after three years of getting his teeth knocked out and arms disabled McCain refused you leave his men behind and he stayed for more years.

McCain did this to serve his country so decades later liberal bloggers like yourself who never sacrificed anything could spit on his service and smear his service with lies. Shame on you. Shame on you.

They never let his initial injuries from the crash heal properly either.

Could you imagine if Obama had been abused for three years and then refused to leave his men behind and the right smeared him. Obama who has never sacrificed anything in his life. He is allowed to enjoy thrills in life like basketball something McCain can never do because of the torture. McCain had his arms snapped repeatedly behind his back with ropes and hung from a ceiling. McCain gave his country his all and lost full use of his arms so decades later liberal bloggers could spit as his service.

Could you imagine if Obama had a son who had just come back from combat that is all we would hear about. He uses his kids as it is.

Jim Webb wore his sons boots, Duncan Hunter mentioned his sons service, Tim Johnson ran commercials with his son.

You libs complained all the time about bush's children not serving.

Here McCain has two sons in the military.

You liberal bloggers have no morals.

You lefty bloggers love to disparage McCain and say he wasn't a hero.

McCain with shattered arms still saved the life of a comrade who was badly wounded and treated him.

Sounds like a hero to me.

I don't think people in this discussion are passing judgment on whether or not McCain was a war hero. It has to do with his Christianity (not a plagiarized Christianity, but a genuine one) and with his honesty.

I find it so offensive that McCain steals an authentic experience by a member of my faith (Orthodox Christian) and tries to pass it off as his own.

For Orthodox, the cross is absolutely central to our faith experience. We cross ourselves scores of times during each divine liturgy. We wear crosses around our necks. We kiss the cross out of veneration for Christ's sacrifice. For the Orthodox, the Cross of Christ is an essential and life-giving expression of our faith.

It is deeply offensive to me that someone who wants to lead our country would steal a story that has meaning and depth and rings true in the context of the Orthodox Christian faith and pretend like it was his story.

Why didn't Joshdavid change the name he was posting under? Usually if you want to make it look like a large number of posts saying the same thing are coming from different people, you make up different names for each post. Instead... he just looks a bit like a loon.

As an elderly Christian systematic biblical theologian, as far as I'm concerned, Senator McCain is entirely welcome to use whatever illustrations derived from whatever sources to make his point on whatever occasion. Every Christian writer and speaker does the same thing on a regular basis as do I. It is quite certain that Jesus did the very same thing when he spoke of goings on involving a man in hadies and Lazarus in heaven. This was obviously an invention as were all of his parables and other illustrative teachings.

There is not the slightest chance that Obama is a genuine, biblically defined Christian. However, I would love to lead him into that kind of commitment if he should ever decide to quit being a hypocrite and get real.

Mr. McCain may not be a genuine follower of Christ Jesus either, but, if not, he is at least much closer to being so than is Mr. Obama. Again, I would like to have the opportunity to share the principles of the covenant of salvation in Christ with Mr. McCain (Luke 9:23 ff). It would be an immense blessing for the entire nation to have the real thing in the White House if only for one shinning moment in my 73 year lifetime.

1. McCain changed prisons between the time of the "nice guard" who loosened his bindings and the "Cross" story.

2. I am sooo sick of Righ Wing hypocrisy. It takes nothing away from McCain's duty as a soldier and a POW to say that he should not lie about and exploit this experience for political gain 30 years later.

3. If you don't want to vote for Obama -- fine -- but don't say it is because he is a "socialist," You just make yourself look stupid.

4. Unless you want to discount most of your Republican leadership -- and elect most of the Democratic leadership the last 50 years -- including George McGovern -- don't make military duty a part of proving your "worth" as a politician. There are many "ways" to serve. What if McCain picks Romney? He and all his big strapping sons haven't served in the military -- and they were the right ages during wars!

5. If you sit and write speeches together with a friend -- you aren't stealing when you both use the lines.

6. Can't any of you Right Wingers -- for freaking ONCE -- ask one of your candidates to take responsibility for making a mistake?

You expect poor minorities to be punished to the max for every little mistake -- but older, rich, white politicians are expected to say, "I'm sorry" for stealing literary references for political gain -- from a Nobel Laureate and one of the geniuses of his generation -- WHO WAS A PRISONER OF STALIN?

McCain didn't just steal from some Lefty writer -- he stole from a man who had been through even WORSE than McCain had been through! In the Gulags of the Soviet Union, where he almost died of cancer. A man who was eventually exiled from his Homeland for standing up to tyranny! You should be ashamed and so should John McCain.

Just apologize and move on.

Obviously, Josh David hasn't spent much time outside the right wing cocoon of (yawn) Hannity-O'Reilly-Limbaugh-Foxfoxfoxfox--

Its rather amusing to read his comments about hypocrisy concerning the Duval Patrick thing. How do you know the other posters have even heard of it? Since YOU were the one who had a problem with Obama using Patrick's lines, and now YOU DON’T have a problem with the "old man" (that's a military term) doing the same thing, that makes YOU the hypocrite.

…and by the way, YOU don't get to respond to ME, since I am a veteran. Apparently, we have now reached the point in this country where every Army cook is beyond any criticism.

Unless, of course, its John Kerry…..

LOL at Wingers….

No one can fairly debate John McCain's heroic performance as a prisoner of war in Vietnam.

Whether or not that experience somehow overcomes all of the other flaws he possesses as a candidate is certainly open to discussion.

John McCain will say or do anything to get what he wants, including dumping his first wife after she had been disfigured in a car crash. Smilingly obsequious one minute, verbally abusive the next, he is disliked and distrusted by Senate colleagues, both Republican and Democratic for his unstable temperament.

Well, I wonder what loving your country means. I guess if you do not wear a uniform you do not love your country.

There are a lot of fine young men and women in the military, but how does that make them heros. Everybody seems to say it is a sacrifice, i beg to differ. It is a job, and most men and women get in the military because they gotta pay bills and need to survive like every other American.

I know some right wingers would say I hate my country, for the record, my dad served in the military, and my brother is currently serving in the military. People do not enroll in the military because they want to sacrifice for thier country, they do it because it pays the bills and takes care of thier family. John got shot down, big deal, he was a prisoner of war!! so what!! How about the jews in the concentration camps, and you don't see us trying to use that as a reason why we are more qualified to run a country. I know ignorance may be the reason McCain will be President, but being shot down, and spending five years in a prison camp does not make you qualified to lead. I think it should disqualify him, because he might hold some old grudges, and think because he holds the key to the nukes this would be a good time to settle those issues.

You made a choice to serve, and because I make a choice to go to college and become a lawyer, doctor or accountant does not make you more of an american than me. I am serving my country too.

The earlier we snap from this craziness the better, McCain is going to get us into another War, and my brother's blood and many other families like mine may have to mourn in private, while the rest you keep electing people who do not care about the consequences of the decisions they make. And yes I said do not care, Serving in the Military does not give you and automatic "Care Pass" for those currently serving.

During the 1980's and while he was president, Ronald Reagan often alluded to various historic moments which proved to have actually come from various movies e.g.: He alluded to an admiral on the bridge of an aircraft carrier during the Korean Conflict. He went on to quote the admiral who, upon hearing of the death of a carrier pilot, posed the rhetorical question "Where do we get these young men who so bravely sacrifice their lives for our country." President Reagan made this allusion during a State of the Union address.

A PhD student at Berkeley investigated this and many other such allusions for his thesis; proving beyond question that Reagan had in fact borrowed this and many other "historic" allusions and quotations from American cinema. In the case of this one allusion; it was a line delivered by Frederick March, portraying an admiral in Paramount's 1954 production "The Bridges at Toko Ri."

Thus as a self-proclaimed "Reagan Republican", Senator McCain may well be following and in fact excelling beyond the oratorical skills of his mentor by citing a Nobel laureate VS a couple of Hollywood screenwriters.

Why is it McBush always has to copy someone else or just outright steal someone elses idea and claim it as his own? What a loser. Surely no one is taking anything McBush says or does seriously. I mean really!

DR
www.useurl.us/12m

Why is Obama not a socialist?

Seems like one to me.

Red Fox: 'Why is Obama not a socialist? Seems like one to me'

Socialism is defined as the ownership or control of the means of production by the workers or the people in general (as opposed to capitalism, the ownership or control of the means of production by private parties, to wit, capitalists). As far as I know Obama has never suggested the transfer of the ownership or control of the means of production to the workers or the people anywhere, anytime, ever. He seems pretty conservative about economic arrangements, in fact. The fat cats of the Democratic Party would hardly be showering him with money if he were thought to be some kind of radical with insufficient respect for private property and the capitalist order of things.

McCain is not a hero by definition in any dictionary except the rethugican playbook. McCain has flip-flopped, stolen, reinvented his life story consistently.

Any right-winger non-veteran is just another phony commando and preposterous supporter of democracy.

Such losers...

I agree that McCain has short comings on his positions on a lot of issues and that Obama can beat him steadily on those. But, we can not just let McCain blatantly lie. This is a Presidenti al campaign. When Hillary told the story about Bosnia, the media and we jumped all over her. We need to be fair. The Republicans were not fair to Sen. Obama's wife Michelle, now were they? I do not feel bad for McCain's pandering to the American people. I am glad that this happened and I hope the media picks up on this. He straight out lied and fell off the Straight talk Express. He never went through the "cross in the sand" story he plagarized the idea! What is that!?? He tried to put another twist on the story to make people feel bad. This not only shows he will do anything to win, but that his character is completely flawed. **One more thing, Sean Hannity on FOX NEWS said that we should give McCain a break on cheating on his first wife Carol McCain because he was a POW and that he came home a different person that he went in. (Google it) That may be true, but being a POW or war hero does not give you a pass at ruining the COUNTRY, personal RELATIONSHIPS, further more LYING!** That is a slap in the face to the many Vets that come back from war and lead RESPECTFUL lives!

Since Socialism is considered to be a middle ground, or transitional phase, between Communism and Capitalism, I would think that his voting record, his stated positions, and his apparent beliefs regarding the following should be enough to qualify him as, at a minimum, a socialist:

- The progressive tax system
- The abolishment of rights of inheritance re: tax code/death tax
- Government administration of credit
- Fairness Doctrine
- Nationalization of production of energy
- Public schools with no voucher system for school choice
- Strong support of the workers' collective (unions)
- Nationalized health care

He may not have stated it blatently, but he sure has voiced support of many of the tenets of Communism. And as far as the Bourgeois who support him financially: These are the grossest examples of the guilt of the wealthy that our nation can put forth.

Not all, but many of these people have little to no concept of the rewards that hard work and the success it can bring to a person, and appear to feel that as a nation, we can only lift up those in poverty rather than incent them to lift themselves.

Of course, the irony of this is that they all want US to do the heavy lifting (see Al Gore as an example).

My advice to anyone who plans on voting for Obama... Read the Communist Manifesto, and compare his actions and words to those of Marx.

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Your convoluted quasi-syllogistic argument (if I understand it properly) is that once you have established your own definitions (VS Marx or Engels') of communism; you use a conservative vocabulary (i.e.: School choice, death tax, etc.) to connote communism with socialism directly.

Then, you blast the bourgeois and labor unions simultaneously as a smoke screen to label Senator Obama (via an incomprehensible comparison to Al Gore) a socialist on his way to being a communist. Based on your definitions and a blurring of terms; you may sound like you know what you're talking about to those who didn't pay attention in school. However, for those of us who did, you make absolutely no sense.

FYI: Blatantly is spelled with two a's not an a and an e.

So, does a spelling mistake invalidate the premise? You have derided the argument without pointing out exactly what does not make sense to you.

If you aren't a fan of common definitions and vocabulary vis-a-vis collectivism, then there's not a lot I can do about your ignorance of the matter. Perhaps you could read something that is critical of Marx and Engels, rather than eating up, like a hungry little bird, everything you've been fed during your indoctrination.

And if next you're going to accuse me of towing the republican party line, then please allow me to nip that in the bud. Neither party is innocent of the move toward collectivism, (or Communism or Socialism, or whatever you choose to call it).

If you choose to actually debate the issue, I welcome it.

My premise (and I stand by it) is that based upon Obama's actions and words, he is a socialist.

What you choose to project as a debate is (based upon your screed above) nothing more nor less than an ad hominem attack first upon Senator Obama then upon me. Spelling errors most certainly do not invalidate any argument, in and of themselves. As for what party line you toe, I cannot say nor would speculate.

Abraham Lincoln wrote, "When you raise your voice, you've lost the argument." It would seem that the civil courtesy of democratic dialogue does not extend from you to those with whom you disagree.

Voltaire, later echoed by De Tocqueville in his Democracy in America, wrote "I will disagree with you unto my death, and unto my death I will defend your right to disagree with me.

So however large or small a hungry bird I have been or may yet be, I've clearly given your views careful thought. From that thought, I have come to be of the opinion that your definitions of socialism, communism, etc. do not square with any of the many critiques, analyses I have read nor with the original texts.

I can respect McCain for serving in the Vietnam War.

However, I do not respect this.

It's one thing to use quotations/allusions in your speeches. That's fine; it's an accepted rhetorical practice. Speak well. (This is something, incidentally, in which Reagan was a master.) If he were using this as an anecdote or an example, I would not have a problem with it. My problem lies with this: he ascribed it to himself-- a specifically identifiable act happening at a specific point in time in history, something that may have happened but now seems to be "fudged"-- a half-truth, if you will...

And to quote another famous president, "a half truth ain't no damn truth."

What they edited out of the comments McCain made (just like they did in the CBS interview) was this:

“My friends, if the Democrat controlled Congress and Barrack Hussein Obama would kindly tip their hats and step out of the way, America’s dependence on foreign oil could be eliminated by allowing companies to begin off-planet oil drilling. As president, I will direct all of America’s energies towards such a goal. And I do mean ALL. There will be no slackers once I am in charge. I will even offer a $10,000 reward for the first person to venture into space and return safely to Earth with a gallon of extraterrestrial bubblin’ crude—oil that is—black gold, Texas tea.

This program will not be easy, my friends; it will not be a summer picnic where everyone sits around roasting marshmallows and singing ‘Cumbayá’ while their little free-range brats scamper to and fro without care or concern that they may be bothering me with their ear-splitting squealing about there being ants on their sandwiches. No sir, it’s a teeth-clinching, jaw-tightening event that makes you want to either reach for some piano-wire or start snapping necks. But once we have found oil on another planet, or perhaps on a nearby comet, our long national nightmare and what I personally believe to be a Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify the precious bodily fluids of the American people’s automobiles with fluoridated water—I mean foreign oil—will have ended and we can once again be the nation we all remember before Franklin Delano Roosevelt ruined it. Thank you, and God Bless.”

Senator McCain then looked up from the page from which he was reading and his eyes briefly turned into those of a dead fish, then re-awakened with alarm.

“I smell bacon! What are you people doing on my lawn?”

Despite what the media and polls are saying about Obama at present time, there has not been one event that has happened in the last 4 years that he has made a prediction on that he has been off the mark about. How strange then that some are still questioning his judgement and ability to lead. How strange that some are still clinging to (he's an appeaser) guns and (he's a muslim) religion in order to conclude that he would not be one of the greatest leaders in US history, not to mention the clear choice for president this year.
The Saddleback forum really did remind me of a national gameshow. Unfortunately Sen Obama thought it was Jeopardy and Sen McCain thought it was Family Feud. Since the people of this country cannot process information greater than a slogan, headline or sound byte, and Family Feud is so much more FUN than Jeopardy, Sen McCain "won".
Funny how ignorance, arrogance, and deceit are morphed into "qualities" for Sen McCain while Sen Obama has not displayed any of these and they are constantly pinned to him anyway, but they magically change back into faults.

John McCain's acceptance speech: a noun, a verb, I was a POW.
(WIth apologies to Sen Biden)