It was not surprising to me that the first cable-news analysis of Barack Obama's speech on race--delivered on Tuesday morning in Philadelphia--focused almost entirely on what he had to say about Jeremiah Wright, his former pastor. A good chunk of the speech was indeed devoted to Wright--but in a bigger context than gotcha journalism. Obama's speech was daring and unique. No modern-day presidential candidate has ever given such a speech and taken race so head-on--and, perhaps, dead-on. But it's not surprising that the larger accomplishment of the speech will be lost in the nitty-gritty of controversy-driven journalism.
Jay Rosen, press critic, immediately took CNN to task for this:
I was watching CNN for Obama's speech. Moments after it concluded Wolf Blitzer was asked to tell us what he heard in it. Wolf's ear is the big ear for the Best Political Team on Television, according to CNN. So he went first. And according to Blitzer, Obama's speech boils down to a “pre-emptive strike” against various attacks that are still to come, in the form of videos, ads, and news controversies that are sure to keep Reverend Jeremiah Wright and “race” in play as issues in the campaign. (I don't have his exact words; if someone has does, ping me.)
Wasn't the speech about that very pattern?
This is a style of analysis and a level of thought we have become utterly used to, especially from Blitzer but many others on TV: everything is a move in the game of getting elected, and it's our job in political television to explain to you, the slightly clueless viewer at home, what today's tactics are, then to estimate whether they will work.
That Blitzer, offered the first word on that speech, did the horse race thing tells you about his priorities (mistakenly “static,” as Obama said about Wright) and his imaginative range as an interpreter of politics (pretty close to zero.)
In fact it was a speech aimed right at him, at the best political team on television, and all the makers of our election year spectacle.
Obama had moments earlier told Blitzer. “You've scoured every exit poll for the latest evidence of racial polarization, not just in terms of white and black, but black and brown as well.” And so he had- him as much as anyone on television.
Obama had just said to Blitzer, look: “If all that I knew of Reverend Wright were the snippets of those sermons that have run in an endless loop on the television and You Tube, or if Trinity United Church of Christ conformed to the caricatures being peddled by some commentators, there is no doubt that I would react in much the same way…” And so if the reactions you report on are reactions to your reporting and video looping how are you, the talent in political television, not an actor with me in this cycle?
I'm not sure that Blitzer deserves such harsh singling-out. But Obama's speech certainly deserves deeper treatment than cable news shows are accustomed to granting such events. Fortunately (for you, dear reader), I've done just that at MotherJones.com:
With racial sentiments swirling in the 2008 campaign--notably, Geraldine Ferraro's claim that Barack Obama is not much more than an affirmative action case and the controversy over his former pastor's over-the-top remarks-- Senator Obama on Tuesday morning responded to these recent fusses with a speech unlike any delivered by a major political figure in modern American history. While explaining--not excusing--Reverend Jeremiah Wright's remarks (which Obama had already criticized), he called on all Americans to recognize that even though the United States has experienced progress on the racial reconciliation front in recent decades (Exhibit A: Barack Obama), racial anger exists among both whites and blacks, and he said that this anger and its causes must be fully acknowledged before further progress can be achieved. Obama did this without displaying a trace of anger himself.
Speaking in Philadelphia, Obama celebrated his own racial heritage but also demonstrated his ability to view the black community with a measure of objectivity and, when necessary, criticism--caring criticism. But this was no Sister Souljah moment. He did not sacrifice Wright for political ends. He hailed the good deeds of his former minister, noting that Wright's claim that America continues to be a racist society is rooted in Wright's generational experiences. And Obama identified the sources of racial resentment held by whites without being judgmental. With this address, Obama was trying to show the nation a pathway to a society free of racial gridlock and denial. Moreover, he declared that bridging the very real racial divide of today is essential to forging the popular coalition necessary to transform America into a society with a universal and effective health care system, an education system that serves poor and rich children, and an economy that yields a decent-paying jobs for all. Obama was not playing the race card. He was shooting the moon.
Obama delivered his speech in a stiff manner. The melodious lilt and cascading tones that typically characterize his campaign addresses were not present. This was a speech in which the words--not the delivery--counted. He began with a predictable notion: slavery was the original sin of the glorious American project. Removing that stain has been the nation's burden ever since, and he tied his campaign to that long-running endeavor: "This was one of the tasks we set forth at the beginning of this campaign--to continue the long march of those who came before us, a march for a more just, more equal, more free, more caring and more prosperous America." And he proclaimed that due to his own personal story--"I am the son of a black man from Kenya and a white woman from Kansas"--he both recognizes the need to heal this divide and possesses an "unyielding faith in the decency and generosity of the American people." Unlike the black leaders of recent years, Obama identified with both the winners and losers of America: "I have brothers, sisters, nieces, nephews, uncles and cousins, of every race and every hue, scattered across three continents, and for as long as I live, I will never forget that in no other country on Earth is my story even possible." He is E Pluribus Unum.
You can read the rest here.
Comments
I hope this works, but I suspect the GOP and the Corporate Holodeck Media will turn Rev. Wrong into a Willie Hortonish figure.
Although, at the rate the economy is tanking, that may surpass even the war as an issue by November, and Rev. Wrong will be forgotten.
Posted by: Ivory Bill Woodpecker
| March 18, 2008 2:56 PM
Great piece - here and at MoJo.
WOW is right.
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 3:05 PM
It's over. Obama is the nominee.
It was extremely unlikely that Hillary Clinton was going to overcome Barack Obama's lead in delegates, states and total votes and take the Democratic nomination, but Obama's speech this morning -- graceful, thoughtful, nuanced, sweeping, challenging, unprecedented -- pretty much wiped out any chance at all. It was a speech Hillary could never have given -- really, few U.S. politicians ever could have given.
I write this not just because I think this will dampen the Rev. Wright controversy. I write this because Obama did an extraordinary job of presenting himself as the candidate of "the better angels of our nature," to use the phrase from Abraham Lincoln's first inaugural address. His speech isn't just inspirational to millions of voters who are tired of cynicism and division. I think many in the political media will see it as redemptive on personal grounds. Maybe they really aren't spending their careers in swampland.
Which not-so-coincidentally is the name of Time magazine's fine national politics blog.
*****
Repost from the last thread but on point so . .
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 3:05 PM
From what I heard it was a great speech but doesn't address his lack of knowing for 20 years that his pastor was a racist.This won't go away with a one time, feel good about yourself, speech.
Theres only one way around this whole embarrassing omission by Obama and that's vote for Hillary.
I mean really, this guy has a pastor for twenty years and doesn't know what the pastor is preaching every sunday?
Then theres that whole Rezco thing. If Obama has such bad judgement in picking friends just think of the damage he will do when he has to pick a cabinet. No wonder he wants to be friends with Syria and Iran.
Wise up and vote Hillary!!!!
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 4:06 PM
Excellent post Corn. Your provided the style in delivery that Barack chose to dispense with today. About Jay Rosen, journalism Prof. at NYU, he is one of the most astute students and writers about contemporary journalism that I've read. Put on your thinking cap. Check out his blog PressThink. Puts people like Kurtz to shame.
Posted by: Neil
| March 18, 2008 4:09 PM
It's over. Obama is the nominee.
~~~~
You all have been saying that for months now. When Hillary wins Penn you all will still be declaring it's over~
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 4:09 PM
Plame and Wilson say they were right about Iraq and that they're right about hillary also. She is the only one who can end this war~~
Democratic presidential hopeful, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., left, speaks about Iraq as former CIA officer Valerie Plame, right, and her husband, former ambassador Joseph Wilson, center, look on Tuesday, March 18, 2008, in Philadelphia.
(
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 4:13 PM
"From what I heard it was "
Read the first six words and save yourself time by skippnig the rest. LBH is commenting on something he didn't listen to.
Posted by: Neil
| March 18, 2008 4:13 PM
Neil,
I heard most of it on the radio-not all of it. I unlike some trolls here I work for a living. The only reason Obama gave this speech is because team Hillary outed him for belonging to this racist church and the media was ignoring it for the last year. I give one up for Hillary on this one, not Obama.
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 4:28 PM
brilliant. he's clinched it. President Obama.
Posted by: colleen
| March 18, 2008 5:27 PM
"Read the first six words and save yourself time by skippnig the rest. LBH is commenting on something he didn't listen to.
Posted by: Neil March 18, 2008 4:13 PM
Neil,
That was my exact thought when I read it. I guess we gotta cut LBH a little slack. With the busy schedule that he keeps at the Gas-n-sip, he doesn't have time to keep up with all of the latest happenings. Given that he feels comfortable standing on the streetcorner with his little tinfoil hat on, screaming "REZKO REZKO REZKO" at the top of his lungs, it's a wonder that he has any time left to blog at all. And given that he knows even less about McCain than he knows about Obama, we shouldn't be surprised that he falls for all this nonsense about Wright being a racist. I'm sure the Koolaid enema wipes out any memory that would interfere with the perfectly crafted hate-mongering that he experiences with the Freepers and Little Green Nutjobs. It also impairs his ability to think logically. He finds fault with Obama for befriending Rezko and never violating any oaths or laws. But LBH is such a partisan DIngbat that he has no problems with a married John McCain "befriending" Cindy Lou Homewrecker and divorcing the woman who raised his kids (and she happened to be disabled due to being in a car accident). That's the kind of "judgement" in friends that LBH values. Typical from the deadenders in the DMW party.
Posted by: Pandemoniac
| March 18, 2008 5:31 PM
Obama gives a speech on uniting the people and silly cornnuts go on a rambling spree of personal attacks~
I know it's hard to be a grown up and act like it, but jeesh already~ if it's at all possible for ya, take Obamas speech and run with it!
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 5:56 PM
Obama camp: HRC is taking the low road
[…]
From the perspective of the Clinton campaign, it has little choice but to go all-out. As a top Clinton aide admitted to me: “Under our projections, if you sat both the Michigan and Florida delegations as they now exist and based on our projections for the remaining contests, Sen. Clinton would still trail narrowly on pledged delegates going into the convention.”
Which means that Clinton almost certainly cannot get to the Denver convention with a lead in pledged delegates won in primaries and caucuses. She also cannot win a majority of states, even if she wins every remaining contest.
*****
HRC has lost, she knows it and her “camp” knows it.
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 6:30 PM
Clinton on Obama’s Speech: I Haven’t Heard It
PHILADELPHIA -– Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton appeared at Philadelphia’s City Hall this afternoon, a few hours after Senator Barack Obama delivered a major speech on race not far from here. But despite the speech’s high profile and intense media coverage of it, Mrs. Clinton said at a news conference she had not heard it yet or read the text.
Many reporters muttered in disbelief during and after her remarks, surprised that a candidate as diligent as Mrs. Clinton -– who always talked about being well-prepared and doing her homework -– would not have read the speech yet. The fact that she was not prepared to comment on it, however, will keep the race issue alive for at least another news cycle, since reporters will keep seeking her reaction.
*****
Wowser, as petty as a person can be. HRC has never been gracious. She just lost a chance to do so.
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 6:34 PM
What Obamas speech didn't cover
Politico
Where it was weakest was in explaining the very reason for the speech: how the inflammatory, even repugnant, comments of Obama’s pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, are understandable.
Wright, who has been Obama’s pastor for 20 years, has said America had brought on the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001 — “America’s chickens are coming home to roost” — and that “We started the AIDS virus.”
Without citing such statements specifically, Obama sought to explain them, though he first condemned them. Speaking in slow, measured tones, Obama said Wright used “incendiary language to express views that have the potential not only to widen the racial divide, but views that denigrate both the greatness and the goodness of our nation, that rightly offend white and black alike.”
But, for the first time, Obama admitted what he previously had denied: that he was present when Wright had made some of his outrageous comments.
“Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church?” Obama said. “Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely — just as I’m sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed.”
Obama did not say, however, that he had ever expressed his disagreement to Wright or in any way attempted to get Wright to moderate or change his views.
Instead, Obama said Wright was “more than snippets of those sermons that have run in an endless loop on the television and YouTube.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wow! Obama admits to lying and you Cornnuts missed it?
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 6:38 PM
HRC need not comment, we all know Bill was the first black president~ enough said!
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 6:39 PM
Juan Williams gave Barack Obama mixed marks on his speech today, avoiding the kind of swoon some other commentators indulged immediately afterwards. While praising Obama for his nuanced view of racial relations, Williams told Fox News that Obama failed in his primary goal — to take responsibility for having a twenty-year relationship with a man to whom hateful rhetoric appears second nature:
~~~~~~~~
Notice how all the liberal white guys (Corn included) are crooning over Obamas speech but a liberal black journalist say's wait a minute why did he keep going to this church for twenty years?
Just a thought!
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 6:50 PM
News Flash***
Obama gives radical speech of race division in America.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Correction,
Obama gives radical speech of race division in the Democratic party~~~
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 6:58 PM
D A V I D C O R N,
Nice job on the NewsHour tonight.
I'm glad you were able to put your thesis forward first. We'll thank Judy for that. You made a good case with more clarity even than your MJ post today. Earl Hutchinson didn't do you any favors by rejecting your framing as his transitioned to his own framing but his media naivete was on full display later when he started to address Barack Oboma directly. Obama of course, was not there. Earl suffered from a little lack of clarity although I wouldn't disagree with him. He seemed more interested in giving Barack advice rather than describing what Barack accomplished or didn't accomplish in the speech, and how he went about it.
Interesting panel. York usually rubs me the wrong way but he was entirely palatable.
Can you guess who I'm voting for? Here's a hint: ...because Black is the new President, bitch. You still stay up for SNL, don't you?
Posted by: Neil
| March 18, 2008 7:05 PM
While Obama is preaching the audacity to hope his pastor was preaching the audacity to hate~~
Posted by: LBH
| March 18, 2008 7:06 PM
LBH | March 18, 2008 7:06 PM --- A good snippet, for a change.
Posted by: David B. Benson
| March 18, 2008 7:14 PM
Dueling SNL Endorsements: Tina Fey vs. Tracy Morgan
JS has this up at MoJo - both clips.
A do not miss.
Tracy RAWKS!
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 7:19 PM
Watching Newshour - Earl is just rambling.
Didn't LBJ speak to the issue of race?
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 8:12 PM
York is an ass - as always - he makes me throw up a little in my mouth.
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 8:14 PM
There's an echo? What was that?
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 8:17 PM
64% in poll state war not worth it:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/18/poll-majority-of-america_n_92227.html
Posted by: David B. Benson
| March 18, 2008 9:34 PM
"Cindy Lou Homewrecker and the Koolaid Enemas" would be a great name for a rock band.
Posted by: Ivory Bill Woodpecker
| March 18, 2008 10:43 PM
I think David Letterman should show parts of this speech in contrast to anything from GWB - talk about Wow!
Posted by: flan
| March 18, 2008 11:01 PM
Thoughts from a Republican
I am a Republican, and I have been so all of my adult life, which makes up the last 20 years. I am also a strong supporter of Sen. Barack Obama for President of the United States of America. Now I have had many fellow Republicans ask me why I am not behind Sen. McCain, and why I would support someone so "liberal" as Sen. Obama. Dare I say that even accusations of "traitor" have been floated about my way.
*****
AN interesting read.
Posted by: capt
| March 18, 2008 11:54 PM
al-Qaida, extremists, Iraq, Iran, whatever, it's commonly known.
Do you really want this guy in charge of foriegn policy?
John McCain in his own words.
Posted by: Neil
| March 19, 2008 10:44 AM
McCain better learn his foriegn policy facts, all extremists are not al-Qaida.
Here's a 50 second film clip that make you wonder whether McCain found 'any' facts on his trip to the middle east.
FILM CLIP
Posted by: Neil
| March 19, 2008 10:48 AM
Too much experience built on a foundation of lies.
Time for a change.
Posted by: capt
| March 19, 2008 10:49 AM
There's an old Japanese saying that when your opponent is committing sepuku, don't get in his way.
The only comment Senator Clinton offered to Senator Obama was that she was glad he made the speech. Talk about damning with feint praise.
It seems that Senator Obama, in his speech, was indeed preaching to the choir. Those who wanted to believe him did. Those who chose not to believe him are still skeptical.
We have all sat in places of worship and disagreed with the speakers. The unanswered question, in Senator Obama's case, is how he endured for twenty years with the unyielding, unrelenting, unmitigated hatred spewed by this truly vile man. At what point must a parishioner simply get up and walk out forever?
We have always been taught to hate the sin but love the sinner. Reverend Wright has stood that dictum on its head. He hates everything and everyone not black. Talk about false prophets!!
What kind of judgment does it show on Senator Obama's part to have participated in this man's malevolence for two decades?
The great irony of all this is that Senator Obama has been running a truly race-free campaign. He is now about to be brought low by a race hustler of the worst kind.
Posted by: Tomcantu
| March 19, 2008 11:00 AM
"I believe that the success will be fairly easy." (9/24/02)
-
"We’re not going to have a bloodletting of trading American bodies for Iraqi bodies." (9/29/02)
-
"We will win this conflict. We will win it easily." (1/22/03)
-
"[T]here’s no doubt in my mind, once these people are gone, that we will be welcomed as liberators." (3/24/03)
---Senator John McCain
Posted by: capt
| March 19, 2008 11:04 AM
Great. Gramps McBush is jabbering on now like Mr. 20%? Gosh, who would've predicted that a doddering old Republican ninny like Gramps could answer that call at 3 a.m., and yet he couldn't answer a simple question in the middle of the day? Me. I could have predicted that. Yes, he can answer the call at 3 a.m. We'll get him a job as a night patrolman at the mall and he can answer the phone when the possum gets jammed in the air vent. That's more his speed.
I don't know if I've ever done the funnies mid-day, but here goes:
"A blue-ribbon panel of educators put together by President Bush -- President Bush put these guys together. He's determined that other countries' kids are better at math because we try to teach our kids too much. Oh, that's the problem? We're teaching them too much. Teach them less and they'll learn more. In fact, don't teach them at all, they could grow up to be president of the United States."
--Jay Leno
"Don't kid yourselves, ladies and gentlemen, things are bad. We've got an unpopular war, we have high energy prices, slumping economy. I just hope to God the president doesn't find out."
--David Letterman
"The economy is in trouble, at least that's what some of the financial analysts in the audience are saying today. But President Bush this morning gave a speech at the Economic Club of New York -- that sounds like a fun club to be a part of. He urged the businessmen and women in the audience not to overreact. If you have ever seen the footage of him reading to the children on 9/11, you know one thing that this guy doesn't do is overreact. He also said that if you look at the numbers overall, even though things may seem bad right now, they're actually very, very good compared to how they're gonna be. So, enjoy!"
--Jimmy Kimmel
"You folks excited about the presidential race? What do you think of John McCain? I like John McCain. He looks like the guy at the bakery who doesn't hear his number called. ... He looks like the guy who likes to watch the plumber work.
--David Letterman
"In his first televised interview since suspending his presidential campaign, Mitt Romney on Tuesday said he would be honored to serve as John McCain's vice presidential nominee. Which was an odd response to the question, 'So, how do you like this weather?'"
--Amy Poehler
"And Geraldine Ferraro has left Hillary Clinton's campaign. She's no longer working for Hillary. She's got a new job in radio now. She's the new sidekick for Don Imus."
--Jay Leno
"With all the bad news about the economy today, John McCain started distancing himself from President Bush. In fact, McCain was running so fast from President Bush, he ran into Barack Obama, who was running from his minister, and Hillary, who was running from Geraldine Ferraro. And they all just collided."
--Jay Leno
"Did you see how much the dollar fell again today? ... The dollar is so low now, all of Eliot Spitzer's hookers demand euros."
--Jay Leno
"During a short press conference Monday, in which New York Governor Eliot Spitzer apologized for his involvement in a prostitution ring, his wife, Silda, stood by his side -- apparently, to make sure there was no prostitute under the podium."
--Amy Poehler
"On Tuesday, Barack Obama won the Mississippi primary with nearly 90% of the black vote in the state, but only one-quarter of the white vote. While Mississippi's Asian guy is still too scared to leave the house."
--Seth Meyers
"President Bush gave an optimistic speech about the economy, even though the dollar fell even more, oil hit record highs and jobs continue to be lost. Yeah. So when asked what part of the economy is working, Bush said, 'Hookers are doing well.'"
--Conan O'Brien
"It turns out the call girl linked to Eliot Spitzer is also, this is true, an R B singer, and she said in an interview that her latest song was inspired by a guy. Yeah. She didn't say which guy, but the song is called, 'Bald Creepy Governor.' It's a good song."
--Conan O'Brien
Stephen Colbert: This week, Clinton advisor Geraldine Ferraro ripped Barack Obama to journalistic powerhouse the Daily Breeze, which covers the south bay area of Los Angeles and has a daily circulation of the people who find it on the bus.
Ferraro on screen: Obama's lucky to be who he is.
Colbert: That's right, Barack Obama is lucky to be who he is. He is lucky to be Barack Hussein Obama. His free ride is rivaled only by Congressman Fidel Pol Pot Bin Hitler. Ferraro has since resigned, but refused to apologize, and folks, there's no reason she should. Once you pass 70, you can say whatever you want about black people, and Chinamen. I can't wait."
Posted by: Pandemoniac
| March 19, 2008 11:10 AM
Tell me if you think Brit Hume has sufficient moral authority and sufficient specific knowledge to judge Rev. Wright's off color remarks as contemptable and in the same breath, judge Grandma Obama's comments us understandable, even as Hume has no specific knowledge about the nature, quantity and severity of Grandma Obama's "racially tinged" language.
"[H]e [O'bama] manages at once to connect himself to Reverend Wright, Reverend Wright to the black community, and then himself to the world of white people through references to his own grandmother. It is one thing, it seems to me, however, for his own grandmother, a white woman of an earlier generation, to speak of her trepidation at a black man on the street and to occasionally utter a racially tinged comment, than for Reverend Wright, in this day and age, from the pulpit of a Christian church, to be uttering the kind of things that he was uttering. But Obama did his best to connect them, and to find some strength for his argument in that way. It was -- some may find it deceptive, but, as you suggest, it was pretty clever.
Brit's analysis is fundamentally unsound and his politics are right-wing. Brit Hume is a hack ,not a news man.
Posted by: Neil
| March 19, 2008 11:17 AM
"The unanswered question, in Senator Obama's case, is how he endured for twenty years with the unyielding, unrelenting, unmitigated hatred spewed by this truly vile man. At what point must a parishioner simply get up and walk out forever?"
Posted by: Tomcantu | March 19, 2008 11:00 AM
You attended all 20 years and sat through all of Wright's sermons? Really? At what point did you walk out?
Posted by: Pandemoniac
| March 19, 2008 11:18 AM
"...how he endured for twenty years with the unyielding, unrelenting, unmitigated hatred spewed by this truly vile man."
I don't see where it's 20 years of "unyielding, unrelenting, unmitigated hatred spewed" and I don't know how you can make that claim.
The priest in my church used to say outrageous things that I dismissed. My association with that church would not be questioned nor my decisions to be baptized, confirmed and married there.
Libruls know what vile unyielding, unrelenting, unmitigated hatred is spewed by conservatives about libruls at CPAC and other conservative conclaves.
I bet there are a lot of conservatives who hate libruls as much as they hate blacks and asians. You can pretend it doesn't exist but you'd be fooling yourself.
My dad hated hippies and would yell out the window of the car "get a haircut". Should that is some way disqualify me from the hippy vote. NO. It would disqualify him from the hippy vote.
Did you hear the speech, the whole speech, or not?
Posted by: Neil
| March 19, 2008 11:31 AM
Comments section is losing comments when you hit submit, not always just twice today.
Posted by: Neil
| March 19, 2008 11:41 AM
I have had to reload more than once for a post to post.
The comments section posting functions have been a little shaky lately.
Posted by: capt
| March 19, 2008 11:48 AM
I'm mistaken. Ignore this comment: March 19, 2008 11:41 AM
Posted by: Neil
| March 19, 2008 11:53 AM
It took 10 page reloads and 8 minutes for my last post to show up.
Hey Webmasters - take a gander?
Posted by: capt
| March 19, 2008 12:02 PM
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